U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > History
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jump to a detailed profile or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Business Search - 14 Million verified businesses
Search for:  near: 
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-02-2010, 01:34 PM
 
1,777 posts, read 1,777,793 times
Reputation: 2936

Advertisements

Don't know if you guys know this, but during the migration of Irish immigrants to the US during these years, at least at the NY/Boston ports, they were met by representatives of the Union Army as they came down the ganglplank and offered, what to these poor people, who had just survived a crossing in the infamous "coffin ships", a sign-on payment, told they would receive a pension if they were injured, and the guarantee of a Catholic chaplain! This was the beginning of the still famous "Fighting 69th".

America's Civil War: Why the Irish Fought for the Union HistoryNet
Irish-Americans In The Civil War
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_Brigade_(U.S.)

After the Civil War and fighting for their adopted country, they still found themselves discriminated against upon their return to civilian life. This is one reason the Canadians saw such an increase in Irish immigration. In part, it was not the Irish coming from Ireland, but the Irish coming from America. Many of the returning soliders joined Thomas Meagher into Canada.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-02-2010, 02:05 PM
 
Location: North Jersey
11,020 posts, read 15,710,877 times
Reputation: 7058
Quote:
Originally Posted by cokatie View Post
Don't know if you guys know this, but during the migration of Irish immigrants to the US during these years, at least at the NY/Boston ports, they were met by representatives of the Union Army as they came down the ganglplank and offered, what to these poor people, who had just survived a crossing in the infamous "coffin ships", a sign-on payment, told they would receive a pension if they were injured, and the guarantee of a Catholic chaplain! This was the beginning of the still famous "Fighting 69th".

America's Civil War: Why the Irish Fought for the Union HistoryNet
Irish-Americans In The Civil War
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_Brigade_(U.S.)

After the Civil War and fighting for their adopted country, they still found themselves discriminated against upon their return to civilian life. This is one reason the Canadians saw such an increase in Irish immigration. In part, it was not the Irish coming from Ireland, but the Irish coming from America. Many of the returning soliders joined Thomas Meagher into Canada.

There is a monument to the 69th at Antietam Battlefield
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2010, 02:12 PM
 
Location: south Missouri
438 posts, read 646,357 times
Reputation: 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by skinem View Post
...and "down the river", in the deep, deep South, often a plantation owner would use Irish to drain swamps, as it was a whooooole lot cheaper to lose a hired Irishman to yellow fever, malaria, snake-bite, heat stroke, etc., than it would be an expensive, paid-for slave in which (from the slave owner's perspective) a lot of capital had been invested.

It's a real testament as to how tough things were at home that so many Irishmen came to a country in which living conditions were, in many ways, not much better.

True. My husband's great-grandfather came from Ireland to New Orleans. He was put to work digging the canals in the Big Easy because an Irishman had no value and slaves did.

It is a testament to the conditions back home in Ireland but at least in America, most of them could eat even though they did not live well. But not living well was the status quo under the English rule for so many centuries that the notion of freedom and not starving to death had to offer some powerful incentative.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2010, 02:13 PM
 
Location: south Missouri
438 posts, read 646,357 times
Reputation: 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by cokatie View Post
Don't know if you guys know this, but during the migration of Irish immigrants to the US during these years, at least at the NY/Boston ports, they were met by representatives of the Union Army as they came down the ganglplank and offered, what to these poor people, who had just survived a crossing in the infamous "coffin ships", a sign-on payment, told they would receive a pension if they were injured, and the guarantee of a Catholic chaplain! This was the beginning of the still famous "Fighting 69th".

America's Civil War: Why the Irish Fought for the Union HistoryNet
Irish-Americans In The Civil War
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_Brigade_(U.S.)

After the Civil War and fighting for their adopted country, they still found themselves discriminated against upon their return to civilian life. This is one reason the Canadians saw such an increase in Irish immigration. In part, it was not the Irish coming from Ireland, but the Irish coming from America. Many of the returning soliders joined Thomas Meagher into Canada.
Again, quite true. Most did not have a clue what they were even fighting and often dying for in the Union Army; many were still Gaelic speakers.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2010, 02:15 PM
 
Location: south Missouri
438 posts, read 646,357 times
Reputation: 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by njkate View Post
It was well over 150 years ago, you can look at it with perspective
My ancestors came from Northern Ireland a totally different species then from the other counties

So did mine but we prefer to call it the Six Counties as it is still occupied territory under British rule.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KsaQPobUZiM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnpYTbfIQ7M

Last edited by joetownmom; 03-02-2010 at 02:20 PM.. Reason: add the link
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2010, 02:22 PM
 
11,242 posts, read 8,221,313 times
Reputation: 5557
I can imagine that what fish came in would suddenly be much more expensive. If you're a fish merchant and suddenly people are starving, its time to raise the price of fish. Probably only wealthier irish citizens could afford fish and only limited amounts were given away to the truly poor. They do that now with hurricanes, price gouge for necessities and things like generators, gas and chainsaws.
I'm not joking about this, but the irish like their beer and whiskey as much as anybody else, if not more. And they use grain for alcohol. Did the distilleries and breweries suddenly stop producing whiskey and beer to make bread for the starving ( and throw many men out of work) or did they continue? The owners would want to continue making profit, no doubt.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2010, 02:36 PM
 
594 posts, read 1,106,410 times
Reputation: 690
The British government's hostility to the Irish actually began much earlier than the Famine of 1845-1852. In 1642 the British sent 10,000 Scottish lowland covenanter soldiers to quell Irish resistance. The soldiers were brutal and many atrocities were committed. Later, the British government pressured thousands of Scottish Lowlanders to emigrate to Northern Ireland as a bulwark against Irish incursions.

British rule in Ireland was harsh and exploitative, so much so that, in 1729, writer and Protestant cleric, Jonathan Swift anonymously wrote his shocking satire, A Modest Proposal. It said that Irish parents could ease their financial burden by selling their one-year-old children for consumption by British ladies and gentlemen. He even indelicately suggested certain culinary uses. It must have accomplished his purpose of getting attention to the abuses in Ireland.

The lesser-known Great Irish Famine of 1740-41, caused by adverse climatic conditions, was said to have been similar in effect as the famine of 1845-1852 and caused the death of nearly 20% of Ireland's population.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2010, 03:40 PM
 
Location: south Missouri
438 posts, read 646,357 times
Reputation: 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Walmsley View Post
The British government's hostility to the Irish actually began much earlier than the Famine of 1845-1852. .

Of course it did. It began with the Normans soon followed by the English. It started as early as Richard II in the 1300's, kicked into high gear under the Tudor monarchies, and then came Cromwell. Cromwell's original intent was to crush Royalist supporters in Ireland....it came to the point where Irish could not own property, be Catholic, attend school, and much more.

But the Irish never gave up; each generation, a new rebellion occured but not until the Easter Rising of 1916 did a new day begin to dawn. Although that rising was put down in short order by the Brits, it spawned a Civil War (The Troubles) that lasted until 26 out of 32 counties became the Republic of Ireland in the 1920's. But as long as the Six Counties remain under British rule, there will be rebellion....or patriotism depending on which side of the fight one may be on.

And yes, there were many other smaller famines which is why the one that began with the potato blight in 1845 was called "the Great Famine".
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2010, 03:46 PM
 
Location: 5 years in Southern Maryland, USA
791 posts, read 1,594,229 times
Reputation: 374
I thought by now, someone would have mentioned this well-circulated story. Amazing, if it's true. (Snopes.com has not looked into it)

Nine Famous Irishmen
http://www.div2aoh.or/Irishmen.htm (broken link)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2010, 04:56 PM
 
1,308 posts, read 1,589,409 times
Reputation: 561
The Irish had a long history of serving in foreign armies so serving in the US one was not a streach. It did not stop at the end of the civil war. You would have found plenty of Irishmen serving in the US army in the Western campaigns. The military was a logical place for those down on their luck or from an ethnic group that was looked down on to serve in - even ignoring the long military traditions of the Irish . Blacks flocked to it as well.

The same was true of the police forces in urban areas (of the Irish, few blacks served in them given open discrimination).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $84,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > History

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2014, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25 - Top