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Old 04-29-2010, 09:41 AM
 
Location: The canyon (with my pistols and knife)
13,217 posts, read 17,948,587 times
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This is how I envision the NHL hierarchy...

TIER I: The "Original Six"

- Boston Bruins
- Chicago Blackhawks
- Detroit Red Wings
- Montreal Canadiens
- New York Rangers
- Toronto Maple Leafs

The "Original Six" are the teams from which the NHL grew, and that have the deepest traditions both on and off the ice.

TIER II: The "Lucky Seven"

- Colorado Avalanche
- Edmonton Oilers
- New Jersey Devils
- New York Islanders
- Philadelphia Flyers
- Pittsburgh Penguins

The "Lucky Seven" are teams that came after the "Original Six" that have developed strong winning traditions and fan support.

TIER III: The "Defiant Dozen"

- Anaheim Ducks
- Calgary Flames
- Carolina Hurricanes
- Dallas Stars
- Los Angeles Kings
- Minnesota Wild
- Ottawa Senators
- St. Louis Blues
- San Jose Sharks
- Tampa Bay Lightning
- Vancouver Canucks
- Washington Capitals

The "Defiant Dozen" are teams that have found success in non-traditional hockey markets, or developed solid fan support despite a lack of championships.

TIER IV: The "Fledgling Five"

- Atlanta Thrashers
- Columbus Blue Jackets
- Florida Panthers
- Nashville Predators
- Phoenix Coyotes

The "Fledgling Five" are teams that have not been consistent with their performance on the ice, their finances, or their fan support.

Anybody disagree with my assessment?
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Old 04-29-2010, 11:17 AM
 
9,028 posts, read 16,424,156 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnutella View Post

Anybody disagree with my assessment?


I do.

Starting with level 2 - strong winning traditions and fan support ......... then put the devils in there - despite being one of the more successful teams they are always in the bottom 1/3 in attendance - their attendance is pretty sad given how good the team is

the islanders have a bad stadium and a bad product - i think they could draw if they were better ..... it's just that the last 70s, early 80s were a long, long time ago now

The for non-traditional hockey markets you list cities such as vancouver, minnesota, calgary, ottawa and even to a degree St. Louis are all places where hockey is a very popular sport ..... i'd hesitate with St. Louis for a bit because as soon as their winning dropped the attendance fell towards the basement like a rock .... but that's also happened in places like chicago & boston

to illustrate this, in 2006 the islanders had the worst attendance in the league, preceded by chicago, the caps, the blues and NJ

in 2005 the penguins had the worst attendance with carolina, nashville, chicago, NYI and the caps right in front of them

2007 the lowest went to the blues, with the blackhawks, NYI, caps, NY and boston preceding them

the past 3 years the blues have been better though - chicago has led the league in attendance the past 2 years and boston is drawing again
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Old 04-29-2010, 11:22 AM
 
Location: Toronto
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I agree with most of those but St Louis should be higher.

NJ and the Islanders should be lower, Washington and Vancouver should be higher.
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Old 04-29-2010, 11:24 AM
 
Location: Buffalo, NY
1,620 posts, read 2,396,944 times
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I DO!!!! WHERE THE HELL IS BUFFALO!!!!! they got fan support nationally more than any other team. When Buffalo was in Tampa and Phoenix the crowd chanted LET'S GO BUFFALO!!! Instead of Lets got Lightning or Phoenix.
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Old 04-29-2010, 11:25 AM
 
Location: Toronto
1,655 posts, read 5,219,387 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzy jeff 11 View Post
I DO!!!! WHERE THE HELL IS BUFFALO!!!!! they got fan support nationally more than any other team. When Buffalo was in Tampa and Phoenix the crowd chanted LET'S GO BUFFALO!!! Instead of Lets got Lightning or Phoenix.
Lmfao can't believe he left Buffalo out, Buffalo should definitely be in the lucky 7!
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Old 04-30-2010, 10:35 PM
 
416 posts, read 941,014 times
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Disagree with a lot of it, and it is making me angry.
re: History and tradition, . . . Toronto should be #1 and Montreal # 2.
Maple Leaf games are sold out 5 years in advance, and Montreal is the winningest team in hockey, and Toronto has won the 2nd most Cups in history.
They have enough history and tradition to put them at the top !
HOW can you say that, . . . Calgary, Vancouver, Ottawa and Minnesota are NON-TRADITIONAL Hockey markets????!?!?!?! This is PREPOSTEROUS ! !
Your list is as biased as Bettman. Did he write this for you???!?!?!?!
OK,
I guess you put them in alphabetic order, and are not ranking Montreal and Toronto near the bottom of the 6 ??????!?

Last edited by nb1968; 04-30-2010 at 10:39 PM.. Reason: nvoa898-kjnppqewurtuqer7737632554263292042-3245632475tf43980t59823y5903y4t50973y4-9yt90yh-ewgherigt9q43w8t0q3ht7q039t7ht4
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Old 04-30-2010, 11:55 PM
 
Location: The canyon (with my pistols and knife)
13,217 posts, read 17,948,587 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nb1968 View Post
Disagree with a lot of it, and it is making me angry.
re: History and tradition, . . . Toronto should be #1 and Montreal # 2.
Maple Leaf games are sold out 5 years in advance, and Montreal is the winningest team in hockey, and Toronto has won the 2nd most Cups in history.
They have enough history and tradition to put them at the top !
HOW can you say that, . . . Calgary, Vancouver, Ottawa and Minnesota are NON-TRADITIONAL Hockey markets????!?!?!?! This is PREPOSTEROUS ! !
Your list is as biased as Bettman. Did he write this for you???!?!?!?!
OK,
I guess you put them in alphabetic order, and are not ranking Montreal and Toronto near the bottom of the 6 ??????!?
Calgary, Vancouver, Ottawa and Minnesota haven't won any Stanley Cups recently. If you read just a little bit further, you would have noticed that I also mentioned that some teams on that list developed loyal fan bases in spite of a lack of recent success.

And yes, the teams in each category are listed in alphabetical order, so please don't cry "bias."
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Old 04-30-2010, 11:58 PM
 
Location: The canyon (with my pistols and knife)
13,217 posts, read 17,948,587 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThroatGuzzler View Post
Lmfao can't believe he left Buffalo out, Buffalo should definitely be in the lucky 7!
Buffalo was an accidental omission. I'd put them in Group III, though, because they've developed a very loyal and passionate fan base despite a lack of a championship. That'd make Group III the "Defiant (Baker's) Dozen."
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Old 05-01-2010, 01:16 AM
 
Location: Newark, California
2,250 posts, read 1,210,501 times
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Any team in Canada should never be considered 'Non-Traditional' hockey markets. That is like saying the south isn't NASCAR country. Personally I'd drop the Devils and Islanders due to attendance problems. Depending on how Phoenix does to back-up this seasons performance, they may go up to Tier III, and since 03-04 Nashville has failed to make the postseason once which occurred in the 08-09 season in which they finished 10th in the conference.
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Old 05-01-2010, 10:13 AM
 
Location: Buffalo, NY
1,620 posts, read 2,396,944 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnutella View Post
Buffalo was an accidental omission. I'd put them in Group III, though, because they've developed a very loyal and passionate fan base despite a lack of a championship. That'd make Group III the "Defiant (Baker's) Dozen."

GROUP 3!?!?!?!?!?!!!!

Are you serious?!!?! Half the teams in group three shouldn't even be in the NHL anymore, and half of those places are the reason why Buffalo has a huge fan base.... This is an opinionated organization. As previously stated Bettman maybe wrote this.. Wait he didn't though, because if he did Washington and Pittsburgh would be 1 and 2.
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