What comes first: Ceiling or Walls? (floor, paneling, paint, tiles)
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We have an old 1926 Bungalow Ranch. It was extended at some point and the floor was never properly insulated on the extension, and the walls have ugly wall paper, paneling...and the ceiling - horrific. They added a drop ceiling, which we're going to remove. Underneath that, are those old cardboard style tiles, some broken & water damaged.
So my question is, what would you replace first? The walls can wait, it's the ceiling I can't take. We'll start with the bath. One floor in our bathroom has wall to wall carpeting OVER tile
And that same bath's walls are half covered with a plastic tile looking paneling (oh yes) that we plan to replace with bead board. But it's "glued" to the vanity, and the plastic bathtub....
This same bath ALSO has a drop ceiling. Underneath that is peeling sheet rock, which we plan to scrap & paint.
The bedroom has a drop ceiling over the cardboard tiles. Can we replace that with bead board and worry about the walls later? Or would it be best to replace the paneling, which probably has plaster behind it so we might even hang drywall over that at some point...
I have had to demo and redo a few kitchens / baths...
If you can figure out a way to get the cash to do this the correct way is to really rip out all the ways and the ceiling. Doing that allows you to insulate the walls, install vapor barrier, use the proper moisture proof drywall and have a much more energy efficient and durable home.
If you try to do the "piece wise" it is almost a certainty that you will miss some areas that need to be insulated, have lots of double costs for re-work, and probably not end uo with as good a solution.
If you can do the demo yourself, vacuum up the mess, get the new all within easy dry work space and have the rest of the structure empty you may be pleasantly surprised just how FAST and cheap a good crew of insulators and dry wallets can knock this out in a normal sized home.
Areas to save money include carefully removing all the trim and reinstalling that. Priming and painting all the finished drywall yourself is also a way to keep money in your pocket.
If, down the road, you decide to "upgrade" from just drywall to beadboard you will be far better off than trying to cover over some old stuff. New drywall can and should be shimmed out and compounded to be much more square than stuff that has been settling and patched over the years.
If you cannot bite the bullet and do this all at once I would strongly recommend doing the rooms that are both most disruptive to everyday life and most likely to continue to degrade. It is hard to argue that the BATHROOM is tops of both those categories.
If the bedroom is self contained and easy to do down the road that is the other end of the spectrum, though I can sympathize that staring at the ugly stuff when trying to get to sleep can give you insomnia...
The addition (which I am assuming is either a "family room" or kitchen) is somewhere in the middle -- if you are worried that you are wasting heat and that the wear and tear of cooking / humidity further degrading the condition it is important to do sooner, if this is mostly just an appearance issue maybe that can wait too.
In the corners of the ceiling is wood around the perimeter. If you don't secure the new product in the corners, it will be floating from the surface. This is not good. I recommended to a relative on how to do this exact thing a few months ago. Here's the process. If the square tiles aren't falling down, don't mess with them. They probably have a bunch of toxic fibrous components in them we like to pretend don't exist. It would be nice to know where the ceiling joists are and mark their position on the wall. Those tiles may want to start falling down on you during this process so you gotta be careful or else take em all down. Bead board, toungue and groove, shiplap, whatever you call it(siding), all can go up there but you have to hit the joists with your screws (yes screws) or else everything could fall down. You are adding weight to everything. Your wood strips need to run perpendicular to the ceiling joists. You can find your first ceiling joist by measuring about 15 inches from the corner and drill a pilot hole with a small drill bit in the ceiling and see if you hit wood. Try the other side of the room if this didn't work cause the joist layout may have started from the opposite side of the room. Joists are usually 16 inches apart and for convenience sake every four feet is a new sheet of drywall. When done why not put a nice crown moulding around the perimeter and hide the cracks that will come with driving screws close to the edge. Putty the holes and prime/paint it. Leaving the tiles will have its advantages and disadvantages. Taking them down is how a lot of people would go but this way is possible, however the difficulty factor of this way could be considered not for the novice. Good luck.
chet, thanks! gives me a lot to think about. the demo is the scariest part, for me at least. and you sure are right about taking care of that insulation now. the addition falls at the end of three rooms, including the bathroom. they just kind of extended the house.
and thanks OC! we thought about covering that ceiling tile. it's horrendous to look at in bed. but we're pretty certain it needs to come down. we might have a piece of it tested, just to be on the safe side.
definitely save as much trim, casings as possible. they are hard to find ready-made (except quarter rounds).
demo'ng yourself will save some cash. once you carefully begin, you'll find it's not so scary. i'm like you, but once i started with plaster and some dry wall, and didn't hit any pipes, i felt more confident.
also try to remember to take a photo or two before closing back up the walls. it helps later on when you need to know what is behind the wall when working in the adjacent room.
If you do end up damaging some of the trim and such, look around your area for a Habitat for Humanity Restore. I've saved a fortune there when trying to match trim work in some of the older houses I've worked on.
Yes, if you are sleeping under the tile the microscopic fibers that become dust is probably the same fiber used in firefighter's jackets. Alot of people prefer to encapsulate the existing materials rather than remove it to avoid letting it become airborne...professional removal is pretty costly and disclosure to future buyers is always an issue.
Yes, if you are sleeping under the tile the microscopic fibers that become dust is probably the same fiber used in firefighter's jackets. Alot of people prefer to encapsulate the existing materials rather than remove it to avoid letting it become airborne...professional removal is pretty costly and disclosure to future buyers is always an issue.
The vast majority of the smaller, thin "acoustical tile" used to cover up ugly old ceiling are just about pure cellulose. That is fancy name for "wood pulp"
Modern fire- protective clothing is made primarily of Kevlar.
Ancient building products may have had small amount of asbestos in it, but the specific fibers types associated with lung diseases were almost never used in products that look like compressed wood / paper.
It is true that "encapsulation" is one way of dealing with asbsetos containing materials, but since it is extremely unlikely that the OP is dealing with that I would hesitate to even consider that...
i start at the ceiling then walls for the plastic on walls the faster you get rid of it the quickies you can fix it , in other words rip them off your walls and worry about patching the holes and stuff later , when i remove them i cut it with my raised skill saw just enough to cut the plastic sometimes i have to apply a little heat with my heat gun to make it easier ,once removed insulated then green sheet-rock the walls texture & paint or wood panel cover it. on your cardboard ceiling i always use sheet-rock for upgrade but i guess you can be cheap and try paneling if there is access from the attic you can insulated it later.
when Demo remove everything from the room run a line of tape then tape plastic to it for a curtain type of plastic on your walls same for the floors use a dust mask and be safe.
i start at the ceiling then walls for the plastic on walls the faster you get rid of it the quickies you can fix it , in other words rip them off your walls and worry about patching the holes and stuff later , when i remove them i cut it with my raised skill saw just enough to cut the plastic sometimes i have to apply a little heat with my heat gun to make it easier ,once removed insulated then green sheet-rock the walls texture & paint or wood panel cover it. on your cardboard ceiling i always use sheet-rock for upgrade but i guess you can be cheap and try paneling if there is access from the attic you can insulated it later.
when Demo remove everything from the room run a line of tape then tape plastic to it for a curtain type of plastic on your walls same for the floors use a dust mask and be safe.
thanks for the tips.
actually going to get started on this project next week.
most of the house is painted paneling (white), and some rooms even have the plank beadboard on the ceiling. we're not settle on whether we'll do beadboard or cedar/ pine planks just yet. definitely white or whitewash
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I have had to demo and redo a few kitchens / baths...
