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Old 11-21-2010, 08:53 AM
 
Location: Central Texas
13,715 posts, read 31,031,321 times
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If you doubt the financial wisdom of keeping it, build yourself a spreadsheet that compares the reasonable costs of keeping it running vs. buying a new (to you) Odyssey. You say you can't afford any expensive repairs, but you can't also afford expensive car payments, right? A two year old Odyssey could easily cost $25K.

There is NO reason that if you have maintained your Odyssey that it shouldn't run without major repairs for years to come. Our 2006 Pilot, with basically the same drivetrain, has 110K miles already. We recently replaced the timing belt and water pump too. It runs perfectly.

I suggest you set aside a little money for repairs - maybe $100 a month. If you have a repair, you have the money. But it is still 1/4 a car payment.
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:29 AM
 
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The one thing it seems most are unaware of is the propensity of Odyssey (and a lot of other Honda models) between 99 and 04 to have major transmission issues. There were several lawsuits about this and some settlements made. The 2003 and earlier Odysseys are pretty much an avoid at all costs thing on the used market. The 2004's integrated some changes (lubricity issue) that were retrofitted on other models, but were still prone to the gear failure (3rd gear would shatter). It is for this reason that Odyssey's of that vintage have much poorer resale values than the newer ones.

Given, there is no guarantee that yours will suffer this problem, but there is no guarantee it won't either (failures have occurred anywhere from 20k miles up to 150k+ miles). You have a vehicle that has a known fatal flaw with a major component. You are currently pushing 100k miles and staring down the end of your extended warranty. If it were me and the numbers worked, I would trade up to a newer model. The 2005+ Odyseey's are about as rock solid as you can get in terms of minivans and reliability.
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Old 11-22-2010, 03:06 PM
 
Location: Vermont
11,754 posts, read 14,579,066 times
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You're right, I didn't know that. Is there any way to tell in advance if you are vulnerable to this problem?

Even if there isn't, this is an unknown percentage risk of a what? $2000? repair. How many months' worth of car payments is that?
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Old 11-22-2010, 03:17 PM
 
14,780 posts, read 43,511,849 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jackmccullough View Post
You're right, I didn't know that. Is there any way to tell in advance if you are vulnerable to this problem?

Even if there isn't, this is an unknown percentage risk of a what? $2000? repair. How many months' worth of car payments is that?
No way to tell in advance if you're vulnerable. It will start slipping and then end up in catastophic failure. Even if you catch it when it first starts slipping or bahaving erratically, the end result is still replacing the transmission.

As for cost, that depends on the route you take. In general I'd say $2,000 would just about cover the replacement transmission itself. Total cost to replace the unit would run about $4k through an indy shop up to as much as $5,500 through Honda.

If we say the payment is $400 a month, that's about 10 months worth of payments. Of course, that doesn't count downtime and the need for alternate transportation.

It sounds like this is the OP's primary family hauler and they plan on doing a lot of driving in the next year. If it were me I wouldn't roll the dice that I may end up on the side of the road with a blown transmission or another failure. While going payment free is great, exactly how much life do you expect to get out of the vehicle?

The OP already stated that the payment is comfortable and they can step into a new vehicle for the same payment, but that they could not afford a costly repair. If it were me, that's the route I would go and would guarantee that I had a reliable and warranted car to handle my primary family hauling duties versus rolling the dice on a possible failure and paying a lot of money to replace the trans in a car I may not necessarily be keeping that much longer regardless of what happens.
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Old 11-30-2010, 09:48 PM
 
241 posts, read 932,379 times
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NJ Goat... thank you SO much for mentioning that. When I purchased the '04, consumer reports mentioned the problems with the '03 models and below, but didn't talk about the '04. I think the '05 had issues with the doors breaking all the time (and got lower scores than the '04), so we opted for the '04. I should go back and read that again.

And to describe the noises and issues we are currently having (perhaps someone will say "yes, that's a transmission issue!)... When we first put it into reverse in the morning, it sort of jerks back a bit and makes a THUD. Not all of the time, but some of the time. Also, I find that when it's shifting into 2nd gear, it takes longer to shift, and makes a strange noise, like the engine is struggling. And there's a noise I usually only hear when I'm in the passenger side front seat. The engine sounds... different. I can't explain it... Like a higher rotation noise or humming.

We test drove an '07 the other night and it was SO smooth. Really got us thinking

Thanks again everyone for your input... it is much appreciated!!
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Old 12-01-2010, 08:44 AM
 
14,780 posts, read 43,511,849 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petunia16 View Post
NJ Goat... thank you SO much for mentioning that. When I purchased the '04, consumer reports mentioned the problems with the '03 models and below, but didn't talk about the '04. I think the '05 had issues with the doors breaking all the time (and got lower scores than the '04), so we opted for the '04. I should go back and read that again.

And to describe the noises and issues we are currently having (perhaps someone will say "yes, that's a transmission issue!)... When we first put it into reverse in the morning, it sort of jerks back a bit and makes a THUD. Not all of the time, but some of the time. Also, I find that when it's shifting into 2nd gear, it takes longer to shift, and makes a strange noise, like the engine is struggling. And there's a noise I usually only hear when I'm in the passenger side front seat. The engine sounds... different. I can't explain it... Like a higher rotation noise or humming.

We test drove an '07 the other night and it was SO smooth. Really got us thinking

Thanks again everyone for your input... it is much appreciated!!
The thud wouldn't concern me as much as the other issues you are having. In general a thud like that could be several innocuous things. My guess would be since it only happens in the morning is that you are parking on an inclined driveway. Do you always apply the e-brake when you park? A lot of people don't use the e-brake on automatic transmissions, they just put them in park. What that does is lock the gears in the transmission so the car doesn't roll. Basically your trans is supporting the weight of the vehicle. Even on a minor incline like a street, it will cause them to bind and then you hear/feel a thud when you put it in reverse. When parking, I always (and argue with my wife over) while holding the brake, put the car in park and then apply the e-brake and then release the regular brakes. This lets the e-brake hold the car and prevents the binding. Outside of that it could be a worn motor mount or bushing, either of which wouldn't be uncommon on a vehicle of that age.

The other thing you describe though really sounds like the transmission is slipping. If the car is going to shift and the RPM's rise up before the shift or you feel a prolonged pause before it engages, that's indicative of slipping. If it is starting to slip, that is the prelude to failure. If it was every gear it would most likely be the torque converter, but only in a specific gear is an internal problem in the trans.

Since you are still under the extended warranty, I would take it in and have it looked at. As long as the problem is consistent or repeatable, you should be able to get the transmission replaced under the warranty. At that point, as long as everything else is working good, it may be worth holding on to.

If they won't replace it, I would advise getting the newer model and retiring this one.
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Old 12-01-2010, 08:58 AM
 
Location: Las Flores, Orange County, CA
26,338 posts, read 93,485,069 times
Reputation: 17827
Quote:
Originally Posted by Petunia16 View Post
We have a semi-tight budget (don't we all) and cannot afford any expensive car repairs. We are deciding whether to keep our 2004 Honda Odyssey or trade in for a 2008 or 2009... here are the facts on the 2004:

1. It has almost 100,000 miles
2. Our extended warranty is up in March 2011
3. I just replaced the timing belt, 4 tires and the battery
4. It runs great and the body is in excellent condition BUT I've heard one rattling noise that is unsettling and it's been sort of idling hard in the mornings (probably nothing... but... ?)
5. We'd have the same monthly payment, but instead of it being paid off in one year, we'd have 6 more years (which is okay... our monthly payment is in the budget and affordable)
6. We plan on driving a lot in 2011, mostly out of state.

I know this is hard to predict, but do you think we should just let the warranty expire and hope for the best, or try to get something newer and possibly more reliable?

My last car was a 1992 Volvo (And I had a Volvo before that, too) that started having lots of problems when it turned 10. I know Hondas can be more reliable, so this is why I'm on the fence about keeping our current car.

Thanks everyone!
I didn't read the other posts, I'm just shooting from the hip and replying.

Keep the existing car. A 2004 isn't that old. If it was significantly older (had only one airbag for example), then for safety considerations, I might consider a new car. But, what's the worst case for your existing car? Another $2000 in repairs in the next year? What's a new car? $30K? Besides, you just dumped a lot of money into it with timing belt which now will be good for what, another 100,000 miles?

Take that $28K, stick it in your retirement accounts of if you've maxed all those out, then stick it in an S&P500 account and watch it double every 7-10 years: $56K, then $112K, $256K, etc.


This is a slam dunk. Keep the car.
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Old 12-01-2010, 09:01 AM
 
Location: Las Flores, Orange County, CA
26,338 posts, read 93,485,069 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJGOAT View Post
If it were me and the numbers worked, I would trade up to a newer model.
The numbers would probably "work" if he had to get a new transmission every six months.
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Old 12-01-2010, 09:14 AM
 
14,780 posts, read 43,511,849 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles View Post
The numbers would probably "work" if he had to get a new transmission every six months.
While your advice may be spot on in financial terms, there are other factors at play. The OP was quite clear that they couldn't afford a major repair. This particular model has a known transmission flaw and the OP also just backed up that their trans is starting to have issues. A transmission will set them back $4k - $6k depending on where they get the work done and how the trans is sourced. They also implied that this was the primary family vehicle and would be driven extensively over the next year.

I think if they can get their trans that is currently having issues replaced under their warranty that expires in a few months, than I would keep it for at least another couple years. If not, it is probably better to dump it and get something newer versus running the risk of having the trans take a crap in the middle of nowhere and not having the cash to get it fixed. Not everything in life needs to boil down to investing more in your 401k and index funds. Some people (myself included) like knowing that their family is riding around in a safe and reliable vehicle and feel that the monthly payment is worth that piece of mind.
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Old 12-01-2010, 02:54 PM
 
241 posts, read 932,379 times
Reputation: 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJGOAT View Post
While your advice may be spot on in financial terms, there are other factors at play. The OP was quite clear that they couldn't afford a major repair. This particular model has a known transmission flaw and the OP also just backed up that their trans is starting to have issues. A transmission will set them back $4k - $6k depending on where they get the work done and how the trans is sourced. They also implied that this was the primary family vehicle and would be driven extensively over the next year.

I think if they can get their trans that is currently having issues replaced under their warranty that expires in a few months, than I would keep it for at least another couple years. If not, it is probably better to dump it and get something newer versus running the risk of having the trans take a crap in the middle of nowhere and not having the cash to get it fixed. Not everything in life needs to boil down to investing more in your 401k and index funds. Some people (myself included) like knowing that their family is riding around in a safe and reliable vehicle and feel that the monthly payment is worth that piece of mind.
We're going to take your advice and see if we can duplicate the noise and get it fixed by Honda while still under warranty. We have until March. If Honda doesn't/won't fix it, we'll get a newer van. I guess I should find out if they'll fix it while it's slipping and not after it's completely broken? All that fine print to think about

I'd much rather put money away into savings, but having a reliable car, especially next year, is more important for us.

At least we buy our cars 2+ years old... beat the steepest part of that depreciation curve

Again... thanks so much for your advice!
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