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Old 10-23-2012, 09:42 AM
 
Location: Summerville, SC
3,383 posts, read 7,089,064 times
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I haven't looked much into the NEW civic Si, but the last years, its been a dud, not so amazing performance, crappy gas mileage for the performance/size.

Also I wouldn't rule out 2 doors. A compact 4 door isn't exactly roomy for putting kids in and out. You stated its not your primary kid hauler.

I am in a similar boat, wife has the family hauler, but my kid rides in my car occasionally. I have 2 camaros. My kid just turned two, I open the door, he climbs into his seat, I sit on the door sill, and I feel like with the larger door, front seat that fold forward, I have alot more room then typical compact and even midsized sedans. Room wise I will even better then some small suvs. I do admit the ride height sucks, but I don't bend over I just sit on the door sill, so its fine for me. I do less bending then a 4 door, because if I sat on the door sill of a 4 door, I wouldn't be able to reach the kid. Just reminding 2 door cars have much larger doors and provide a bigger opening then a 4 door.

I really wish the RX8/Saturn Ion rear opening door concept was more popular.


Either way... just my 2 cents for people that feel a 2 door is unacceptable with kids, I prefer my current car situation vs a 4 door compact on the kids front.




I'd look at the GTI, not sure if you can handle the price but the STi hatch would be pretty nice.
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Old 10-23-2012, 10:16 AM
 
Location: Chicago
3,063 posts, read 5,286,464 times
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As others mentioned the GTI would be my first choice as well. It has a stylish interior and zippy performance with room to improve on that performance if you ever want to. It also gets better gas mileage.

The SI is an okay car, but the interior in those is AWFUL. There also isn't as much interior room as what is offered by the hatch on the GTI. Just my $0.2
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Old 10-23-2012, 10:37 AM
 
Location: NY
9,069 posts, read 14,919,444 times
Reputation: 11486
Quote:
Originally Posted by MustangEater82 View Post
I haven't looked much into the NEW civic Si, but the last years, its been a dud, not so amazing performance, crappy gas mileage for the performance/size.

Also I wouldn't rule out 2 doors. A compact 4 door isn't exactly roomy for putting kids in and out. You stated its not your primary kid hauler.

I am in a similar boat, wife has the family hauler, but my kid rides in my car occasionally. I have 2 camaros. My kid just turned two, I open the door, he climbs into his seat, I sit on the door sill, and I feel like with the larger door, front seat that fold forward, I have alot more room then typical compact and even midsized sedans. Room wise I will even better then some small suvs. I do admit the ride height sucks, but I don't bend over I just sit on the door sill, so its fine for me. I do less bending then a 4 door, because if I sat on the door sill of a 4 door, I wouldn't be able to reach the kid. Just reminding 2 door cars have much larger doors and provide a bigger opening then a 4 door.

I really wish the RX8/Saturn Ion rear opening door concept was more popular.


Either way... just my 2 cents for people that feel a 2 door is unacceptable with kids, I prefer my current car situation vs a 4 door compact on the kids front.




I'd look at the GTI, not sure if you can handle the price but the STi hatch would be pretty nice.
I understand what you mean about 2 doors and kids. They are acceptable, but by no means convenient. I had a Volvo C30 hatch (which had, honestly, incredibly bad rear seat access, even by 2 door standards). A Camaro certainly has a bit more room to get into the back, which would help some.

I do think I am going to keep a focus on the 4 doors for now.

The GTI is very. I drove one a couple years ago, a 2009 model year GTI. I know the current car is the next generation, but very similar. I might have bought that '09 GTI if the dealer had been dealing, but they wouldn't budge more than $500 off MSRP, with the 2010's on their way. That is when I grabbed the C30, which was far better equipped and ended up being about the same OTD price.

I guess the SI looks like it might be a bargain in price by comparison, which is what piqued my interest. I am intending to look at a Mazdaspeed3 too. Might drive the Si tonight to see if after a close inspection and drive, it is even a contender.
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:06 AM
 
Location: NY
9,069 posts, read 14,919,444 times
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Just as an update, I was able to hit the Honda dealer yesterday.

Honestly, I had fun driving the Si. The engine seems a little jekyl and hyde like. Loafing around town it feels like a normal 4 banger. Get the RPM's up or above 4000 RPM, and the car turns into more of a rocket ship. The gearing and transmission made accessing power very easy too. It may be the nicest stick shift I have driven, and is far nicer and more precise than the one in my past '07 WRX. It was wet out, so I could not push it too much in turns, but the steering felt very precise, somewhat communicative, and the car felt eager to turn (and not just accepting of turns).

Some of the interior definately seems low rent, but considering the price I may be ok with that. (I did have a Volvo C30 prior, so I definately see the difference). I did like that the seats were not overly bolstered for that "race car" seating experience, which I usually feel is very uncomfortable.

Next up I am going to drive a MS3. Price is not too much more there, but add in overall operating costs and such, and it is definately more. So it will have to impress (but it might).
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:08 AM
 
3,967 posts, read 4,577,928 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Checkered24 View Post
Just as an update, I was able to hit the Honda dealer yesterday.

Honestly, I had fun driving the Si. The engine seems a little jekyl and hyde like. Loafing around town it feels like a normal 4 banger. Get the RPM's up or above 4000 RPM, and the car turns into more of a rocket ship. The gearing and transmission made accessing power very easy too. It may be the nicest stick shift I have driven, and is far nicer and more precise than the one in my past '07 WRX. It was wet out, so I could not push it too much in turns, but the steering felt very precise, somewhat communicative, and the car felt eager to turn (and not just accepting of turns).

Some of the interior definately seems low rent, but considering the price I may be ok with that. (I did have a Volvo C30 prior, so I definately see the difference). I did like that the seats were not overly bolstered for that "race car" seating experience, which I usually feel is very uncomfortable.

Next up I am going to drive a MS3. Price is not too much more there, but add in overall operating costs and such, and it is definately more. So it will have to impress (but it might).
Are you totally bent on getting a new car? If not, one car I HIGHLY recommend for you to find and test drive is the Mazdaspeed6. Same power train as the MS3 but it's AWD.
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:13 AM
 
Location: NY
9,069 posts, read 14,919,444 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellow Jacket View Post
Are you totally bent on getting a new car. If not, one car I HIGHLY recommend for you to find and test drive is the Mazdaspeed6. Same power train as the MS3 but it's AWD.
I am not really looking at used at this time. Having one old car keeping me under the hood is enough. I like having new for daily use.
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:24 AM
 
Location: Chicago
38,690 posts, read 88,875,297 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellow Jacket View Post
Are you totally bent on getting a new car? If not, one car I HIGHLY recommend for you to find and test drive is the Mazdaspeed6. Same power train as the MS3 but it's AWD.
See this from the OP: "I have tried bigger sedans too, but they all drive "big" and don't give me that quick, light on their feet feel of the sport compacts..." The Speed6 definitely drives "big." Capable car and all but there's no mistaking it's a 3700lb car when you're tossing it around bends.

Anyway Checker, other options to consider before pulling the trigger on the Civic are a Mini Cooper S, and also see if you can still find a 2012 Nissan Sentra Spec V in your area.
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:51 AM
 
3,967 posts, read 4,577,928 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drover View Post
See this from the OP: "I have tried bigger sedans too, but they all drive "big" and don't give me that quick, light on their feet feel of the sport compacts..." The Speed6 definitely drives "big." Capable car and all but there's no mistaking it's a 3700lb car when you're tossing it around bends.

Anyway Checker, other options to consider before pulling the trigger on the Civic are a Mini Cooper S, and also see if you can still find a 2012 Nissan Sentra Spec V in your area.
The MS6 is really a small midsize car halfway between compact and midsize. It's smaller than the comparable competitors. It only had one direct competitor. The Subaru Legacy 2.5GT and that was also small for the midsize but not bigger than the MS6. It's considered to be an alternative to the EVO and WRX STI.

The MS6 is not even 3600 pounds. It's light on it's feet for an AWD. Of course, you can tell that the AWD is there when it kicks in as it's FWD until the car loses grip but to be honest. It definitely does not feel big. I never owned one but I've had one at my residence for a while as my partner bought one (and owned it for a couple of years). It feels no bigger than the a compact and yet it has good space.

I've driven an MS3 extensively and the torque steer is annoying but not the worse I've ever driven. The MS6 virtually takes care of that as when the front starts to understeer. Power is immediately shifted to the back wheels. My last point is price. The MS3 is very popular in the sport compact community and for children just getting their driver license so the price tends to be a bit higher in insurance and buying the car itself. The MS6 is viewed as the more mature choice. It's low key, easy to maintain and better in adverse conditions (for obvious reasons). The MS3 is a faster car in a straight line but in the corners, it's not as tight as I like. My point is that the MS6 is not a big hulking sedan that the OP is referring to. It's bigger than the 3 sure but for that generation, not by a whole lot.

Last edited by Yellow Jacket; 10-24-2012 at 08:59 AM..
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Old 10-24-2012, 09:09 AM
 
Location: Chicago
38,690 posts, read 88,875,297 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellow Jacket View Post
The MS6 is really a small midsize car halfway between compact and midsize. It's smaller than the comparable competitors. It only had one direct competitor. The Subaru Legacy 2.5GT and that was also small for the midsize but not bigger than the MS6. It's considered to be an alternative to the EVO and WRX STI.

The MS6 is not even 3600 pounds. It's light on it's feet for an AWD. Of course, you can tell that the AWD is there when it kicks in as it's FWD until the car loses grip but to be honest. It definitely does not feel big. I never owned one but I've had one at my residence for a while as my partner bought one (and owned it for a couple of years). It feels no bigger than the a compact and yet it has good space.

I've driven an MS3 extensively and the torque steer is annoying but not the worse I've ever driven. The MS6 virtually takes care of that as when the front starts to understeer. Power is immediately shifted to the back wheels. My last point is price. The MS3 is very popular in the sport compact community and for children just getting their driver license so the price tends to be a bit higher in insurance and buying the car itself. The MS6 is viewed as the more mature choice. It's low key, easy to maintain and better in adverse conditions (for obvious reasons). The MS3 is a faster car in a straight line but in the corners, it's not as tight as I like. My point is that the MS6 is not a big hulking sedan that the OP is referring to. It's bigger than the 3 sure but for that generation, not by a whole lot.
I owned an MS6. It didn't drive anything like a compact car and it's definitely not in the same performance league as an Evo or STi nor does it try to be. What's more the AWD system was considerably more proactive than you're giving it credit for, but that's another story.
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Old 10-24-2012, 10:03 AM
 
3,967 posts, read 4,577,928 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drover View Post
I owned an MS6. It didn't drive anything like a compact car and it's definitely not in the same performance league as an Evo or STi nor does it try to be. What's more the AWD system was considerably more proactive than you're giving it credit for, but that's another story.
It has a part-time AWD system. While you may select different modes which have preset torque splits. It's still considered a part time system as it's FWD on it's on normally unlike the Legacy which is AWD at all times normally. If you don't believe me then Google is your friend. Then again, you can also go to a Mazda forum.

Now, we can agree to disagree on how it drives but I owned a Saab 9-3 Turbo X and we have a Subaru Legacy Spec. B at our place and I've driven various midsize sport sedans (of different drivetrain layouts) like the A4 Quattro, S60R, Nissan Altima SE-R, Acura TL Type-S. The MS6 drives more like a compact than any of the cars I just mentioned. It is smaller and lighter. It points where you want it to go. It drives nothing like a big car to me. It feels way more like a compact than a big car. That's why articles and critics have consistently linked it to the EVO and STI.

It's bigger (not by much as again, the first gen Mazda6 in general is between compact and midsize) and cheaper and more mature if you don't like the ricer attitude. It also draws less unwanted attention. Of course, it's direct competitor is the Legacy GT.
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