Soundproof windows? (vinyl, insulation, glass, vent)

[rogerhardy]

i have similar problem re noise . i live in a house converted to 5 flats. my bedroom allows all noise from the flat above. im thinking of employing a professioinal firm to soundproof at least my bedroom cheaper than moving,
to try and block sound i have found tuning a radio off any station and chosing
constant noise, ie buzzing and adjusting the frequency and volume helps. it must be constant otherwise changes wake one up. a noisy fan is also helpful, but low frequency noises such as footsteps, and intermittent noises such as dropped objects v difficult to block

[Oberon476]

Windows, doors, walls, whatever, are all rated as to their ability to deaden or attenuate sound based on something called STC or Sound Transmission Class.

STC is an average of an object’s ability to attenuate sound across a fixed frequency spectrum of approximately 100hz-5000hz. An STC average (what you will be quoted if asking about STC of a specific product) does not provide specific frequency-deadening information which may be what is needed if you want to block a specific type of unwanted noise – for example traffic noise – and while the attenuation characteristics of certain products at particular frequencies do exist, they are often not generally available to the consumer.

Sound Transmission Class is a laboratory rating based on some very specific criteria within a very specific frequency range. STC was designed to test the frequency range where the human voice will be the predominant consideration. Unfortunately, this does tend to minimize the effectiveness of STC as a tool for helping to block sound outside of that range.

While using STC to compare the sound-blocking ability of different window styles or brands is certainly not a bad idea since, generally speaking, a window with an STC of 40 should outperform a window with an STC of 35 – STC is sort of like mileage ratings on a new car – not always as useful as one might hope and that 40 versus 35 is for an overall rating – it does not say which of those products would perform best at specific frequencies – again blocking traffic noise for an example.

STC is a rating that is independent of the conditions under which the window will be used – meaning that it does not take into account the actual field conditions of the assembly. These conditions might include background noise, window area, even the level of sensitivity to noise of the occupants. Noise reduction requirements are affected by these conditions so that windows with the same STC might have very different NR requirements when used in different situations.

But, at the basic level there are three primary issues to consider when dealing with unwanted "noise" – the frequency, the level, and the duration of said noise.

Sound frequency and sound level are combined into what is called a "dBA" – or A-filtered decibel value – in order to quantify the sound in relation to the human perception or ability to hear it. In other words, we all “hear” (no pun intended – really!) about the specific dB level at a rock concert or at the airport, but we don’t hear “evenly” across the whole sound spectrum. For example, we may hear a sound at a relatively low decibel (or sound pressure) level at one specific frequency and yet be unable to hear an even louder sound at a different frequency - which is why frequency response is weighted.

Sound duration is added into the mix because even a relatively quiet sound can become annoying when it persists for a certain time. Using figures derived from these three descriptors, a sound professional can determine what is required to attenuate (opposite of amplify) the inappropriate sounds.

Sounds like a lot of trouble, right? Well, it actually is and unless you live next to an airport or train crossing it is usually not worth the trouble to go there. But, I pointed it out to give you some idea of how in depth fighting unwanted sound can be.

As humans we are born with the ability to hear from approximately 20 to 20,000 hertz.
Hertz, or Hz, is how sound frequency is measured - like electricity is measured in volts. By the time we are teenagers we have generally lost the ability to hear above about 13,000hz. Since the human voice tends to fall between 500hz and 5000hz, the loss of higher frequency sounds is not usually a big deal.

Traffic noise is a low frequency sound, and unfortunately, and as mentioned previously, low frequencies are much harder to attenuate (opposite of amplify) or block than are higher frequencies - just think how often you hear the bass sounds from the neighborhood kid's car stereo and not the higher pitch tunes when he is coming down the street.

When considering window glass performance there are three primary products to take into account for maximum possible sound attenuation.

First is laminated glass.
Second is a wider airspace between the lites.
Third is different thickness lites within the IGU or Insulating Glass Unit.
Fourth would be a combination of all three.

Airport windows, as an example, generally have laminated glass on both sides of an IGU in an aluminum frame and with a maximum airspace between the lites. In an airport the primary concern is sound attenuation and energy efficiency is secondary. I mention this because the width of the airspace and the choice of window framing material affects both sound and energy efficiency.

Some folks will suggest triple pane glass for its sound deadening ability, and while triple pane may be a slight improvement over standard double pane at lower frequencies due to the additional density of the extra lite, overall there is no major difference in STC rating between triple and double pane provided that the overall airspace between the panes is constant between the two constructions.

In other words, a triple pane with two 1/4" airspaces and a dual pane with a 1/2" airspace – both using 1/8" glass – will have the same overall STC rating assuming that windows are otherwise the same. However, a triple pane with two 1/2" airspaces may have a greater improvement in sound attenutaion than a dual pane with a single 1" airspace, but that gets a bit more complex than I am going here.

Using one thicker (3/16") and one thinner (1/16") lite in an IG construction may also help deaden sound because each lite is transparent to a different frequency and each lite will then attenuate the frequency that passed thru the other lite.

As a very general rule, different thickness lites in an IG configuration (for example 1/8” and 3/16”) contributes more to lower frequency noise attenuation than it does to higher frequency attenuation, yet oddly, using different thickness lites does not contribute significantly to overall STC performance as well as the other options – such as using a wider airspace in the IG unit.

And the wider the airspace between the lites, the more potential for limiting unwanted sound thru that space. Unfortunately, for significant sound attenuation, it may be necessary to have an airspace approaching two inches or so – although lesser width airspace can make a difference as well – often depending on other factors as mentioned.

Stopping unwanted sound thru any material is determined by three things – mass, stiffness, and damping. Increasing the mass of a window by using thicker glass will increase sound attenuation and the change from a single pane window to dual pane or triple pane IGU to a window will add glazing mass and may improve sound performance thru the window; but not as much as might seem obvious.

So why do folks with new dual pane windows, after living with single pane, often comment that the improvement in blocking unwanted outside noise? Often, this is due to the replacement window being tighter than the previous older window, but also the addition of the airspace between the lites of a dual pane – rather than to the effect of the additional lite, unless as mentioned the lites are different thicknesses – can have an effect on sound propagation.

So in that sense, the additional lite in a dual pane window improves performance over a single pane by the formation of the airspace. But this doesn’t always apply when adding triple pane due to the decrease in the airspace between the lites overriding the potential advantage of the additional lite.

And, since increasing the stiffness of glass isn't really practical, what about damping?
Inherently, glass has very little damping ability, but when putting a layer of a more viscous material between two of lites of glass we substantially increase the unit’s ability to dampen sound – thus the advantage of laminated glass which just so happens to be a product that has a layer of more viscous material between two lites of glass – cool how that works right into the explanation!

A single pane of 1/4" laminated glass consisting of two 1/8" lites with the plastic interlayer actually has just about as much sound blocking ability as a 1/2" lite of monolithic glass. The monolithic glass tends to do better at mid to higher frequencies while at the lower frequencies the performance of ¼” laminated and ½” monolithic tend to be about the same as well as the overall STC rating.

A fixed, versus an operating, window is usually going to give you much better sound attenuation. However, having a house-full of windows that can't be opened is not very appealing to most people, so again we come back to the earlier comment that the window MUST be tight when closed.

[Sage of Sagle]

I would look into Quietrock (http://www.quietsolution.com). I was looking around when building a home theater and I wanted a high STC rating. They have up to STC 80, which is some really sound deadening stuff. THX certified for home theaters. db reduction from 40-90, so it would probably help a lot.

[jimboburnsy]

Originally Posted by katzenfreund

I wish there was "magic bullet" to make a house quiet!

That gives me an idea...

If you just fire off about 15 regular bullets in your bedroom before you go to sleep, you won't hear anything but that gentle ringing.

[pitt_transplant]

LOL

Ahhh....well it would work

[going crazy]

im goingcrazy! the HOA wont do nothing , and the police wont do anything even though they got a code section 6.390 F saying they cant dump untill 5.00 am

i called the trash people , there no help
btw the police said they got to do there job. i told them abut the section rules, but he just said , i dont know all the sections. and went back to eating his donuts,

i aslo hear dogs backing all hours, and somethiimes i can hear the interstate even over 2.0 miles away

i need windows done> sound proofed big time , i dont know anything about this

my parnent have magnatight windows which are pexi glass ,and snap in like a magnet to the inside of the org. window frame.

i need to do al least 6 windows right now before i go off the edge!


if any knows a place contact me please thanks

i forgot to add that i sleep with my ceiling fan on high even when its 28 deg outside, and a thick down pillow over my ears, but i wake up when i hear the dumpsters at 3.30 am every single time, and cant get back to sleep . due to lack of sleep . i lost my job. i been getting apppx 4 hours of sleep a night .


HELP!

[f_m]

Originally Posted by going crazy

im goingcrazy! the HOA wont do nothing , and the police wont do anything even though they got a code section 6.390 F saying they cant dump untill 5.00 am

i called the trash people , there no help
btw the police said they got to do there job. i told them abut the section rules, but he just said , i dont know all the sections. and went back to eating his donuts,

i aslo hear dogs backing all hours, and somethiimes i can hear the interstate even over 2.0 miles away

i need windows done> sound proofed big time , i dont know anything about this

my parnent have magnatight windows which are pexi glass ,and snap in like a magnet to the inside of the org. window frame.

i need to do al least 6 windows right now before i go off the edge!


if any knows a place contact me please thanks

i forgot to add that i sleep with my ceiling fan on high even when its 28 deg outside, and a thick down pillow over my ears, but i wake up when i hear the dumpsters at 3.30 am every single time, and cant get back to sleep . due to lack of sleep . i lost my job. i been getting apppx 4 hours of sleep a night .


HELP!

As one person put, this link is a company that sells windows and sheetrock products for sound dampening. Proper sound dampening would actually include external and internal window panes.
Quiet Solution

[going crazy]

i just want to die now!

dogs barked all last night 10pm to 1 am ,,then dumpstered dumped at 3.16 am i got cops to come out , of coruse the truck was gone than , they said they got to cacth them in the act. but they would sit behind there to wait at the time they come at ..now that dog is barking again right now i cant sleep at night or during the day now .i want to blow my ear drums out or die. i dont thin anything will drown out this noisey neihgboer hood.

[going crazy]

Originally Posted by chuvak

Just give this guys a call. here is their website :: Soundproof Windows - Best Noise Elimination System ::
I used them. they have a line of great products and excellent service

thanks i just e mailed them

[peteboy]

I got in touch with a local soundproofer Soundproofing and noise soundproofing acoustic products

And they said windows are the hardest thing to soundproof, they suggested two sets of double glazed windows and a special 3/8" think layer of soundproofing glass between the two with special baffles and decouplers.

The whole thing worked out about £9000, so it seemed better value to move apartment to somewhere with less noise.