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Old 08-26-2016, 04:33 PM
 
Location: Oregon, formerly Texas
10,029 posts, read 7,188,252 times
Reputation: 17126

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We probably over-estimate the quality of old housing. Most of the old houses you see today in good shape were houses for the well-off back in their day. The old housing made for the low end working classes has long since fallen down.
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Old 08-26-2016, 04:53 PM
 
1,364 posts, read 1,110,845 times
Reputation: 1053
Quote:
Originally Posted by Threestep View Post
I do not know where in Germany you are but no one I know has had Raufaser since the 70s. Plastered walls were painted and then often rolled with rubber rollers with patters. You could get several colors onto one roll using special dipping pans. My Grandmother loved pastels with gold.
Until recently most tenancy agreements had a clause like "Wohnung ist bei Auszug mit Raufaser tapeziert und weiß gestrichen zu übergeben". So it's surely extremely common. If you choose a "Dekoputz" or "Rollputz" then you don't use Raufaser wallpaper, obviously. But painting directly on the wall? I have never seen it (with the exception of basement rooms). It appears so uncomfortably to me, so cold. The room acoustics is also quite different without a wallpaper.
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Old 08-26-2016, 05:41 PM
 
1,364 posts, read 1,110,845 times
Reputation: 1053
Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
Couple of things:
1) The 30 year and 15 year mortgage is almost an American exclusive. Mortgages do not exist in many countries, so homes are bought with cash - cash that took years and years and years to save up. As a result, homes are passed down and kept in the family. Or people rent forever.
It sounds absurd to think that such mortgages are an exclusive American thing. Of course almost all people in Europe use mortgages to buy or build houses. I don't know about other countries, but in Germany all kinds of mortgages are available (up to 40 years with up to 40 years fixed interest rates). A difference to the U.S. is most likely that the down payment requirements in Germany are higher and the banks normally ensures that the monthly payments aren't too high in relation to the monthly income.

Examples:

Price of the house: 250,000
Down payment: 50,000
Repayment in 25 years with 25 years fixed interest rates
Rate: 1.96%
Monthly payment: 843.33 Euro


Price of the house: 250,000
Down payment: 50,000
Repayment in 15 years with 5 years fixed interest rates
Rate: 0.68%
Monthly payment: 1,163.33 Euro

https://www.baufi24.de/baufinanzieru...kreditrechner/
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Old 08-26-2016, 05:54 PM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,114 posts, read 60,214,676 times
Reputation: 60714
One thing I think is being missed is that in much of the US houses are typically on larger lots than in much of Europe, even in small towns (not talking cities so much). That land is factored into pieces.
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Old 08-26-2016, 06:43 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,652 posts, read 60,572,966 times
Reputation: 101051
Quote:
Originally Posted by saibot View Post
Just a comment that roof tiles are extremely common in southern California. In some towns (mine, for example), virtually all homes have tile roofs. If you have a wooden shingle roof, your homeowner's insurance will go up astronomically because of the fire hazard. And, tile roofs (as opposed to asphalt shingles) fit the Southwest design style.

But this just goes to show again how very different things are in different areas of the US.
Right, and they are also popular in other pockets in the US - but they are rather the exception than the rule, and this has more to do with style of home than cost.

And same here with the wood shingles - they are considered a fire hazard here as well and will cause one's home insurance costs to go up considerably.

We moved two counties away and our homeowner's insurance went up because this particular county has more wind events than the county we were in 30 miles away.

So things can be very different even in one small area.
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Old 08-26-2016, 06:44 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,652 posts, read 60,572,966 times
Reputation: 101051
Quote:
Originally Posted by lukas1973 View Post
Until recently most tenancy agreements had a clause like "Wohnung ist bei Auszug mit Raufaser tapeziert und weiß gestrichen zu übergeben". So it's surely extremely common. If you choose a "Dekoputz" or "Rollputz" then you don't use Raufaser wallpaper, obviously. But painting directly on the wall? I have never seen it (with the exception of basement rooms). It appears so uncomfortably to me, so cold. The room acoustics is also quite different without a wallpaper.

It depends entirely on the other elements of the home. A warm paint color looks warm whether it's on wallpaper or not.
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Old 08-26-2016, 07:05 PM
 
31,761 posts, read 26,706,619 times
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Plaster tends to be porous, especially as it gets older. Thus putting up wall paper before painting gives a better base for the paint to adhere. Otherwise you may end up putting two, three, four or more coats of paint up because the plaster wall absorbs so much of the stuff.


Drywall when new is also porous and must be primed/sealed properly before painting or the same thing will happen as above. In fact if you've ever painted dry wall that hasn't been done in a very long time you know it can take two or more coats of paint before coverage is good. The surface is just that porous and keeps "drinking" paint.


Today there are many special primers and sealants you just didn't have years ago, so people used wall paper first then painted over that.
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Old 08-26-2016, 09:47 PM
 
1,177 posts, read 1,128,253 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davebarnes View Post
compare costs.
Most people in europe rent. Not inherit.
ftfy
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Old 08-26-2016, 11:38 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
18,927 posts, read 14,111,175 times
Reputation: 16638
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Many US homes are 100 percent electric. According to the National Association of Home Builders and the US Department of Energy, the average electric bill in the US is $110 a month (or about 97 euros at today's exchange rate). The average monthly water bill is about $30 (27 euros).
Average Monthly Electrical Bill by State – Updated Data | Eye On Housing
https://friedmansprout.com/2014/04/0...bill-stack-up/
I don't agree with those estimates.
The average electric bill for August in Atlanta is $205.11.
Average Electric Bill | Atlanta, Georgia | MyEnergy
That's on the low side, IMHO.

If you have a house in Dixie, and run A/C, you're going to pay $$$$.
(Which is another argument to transition to super insulation)

On the other hand, an apartment surrounded by other apartments, has a far lower exposed surface area, and has correspondingly lower energy costs.
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Old 08-27-2016, 12:41 AM
 
Location: Prepperland
18,927 posts, read 14,111,175 times
Reputation: 16638
One cost effective option to build a disaster resistant house is to use . . .
STRESS SKIN PANELS
Cement Fiber Skin Structural Insulated Panels - CSIPs
CSIPs are fire resistant, water resistant, wind resistant, vermin resistant, earthquake resistant and are non toxic.
Cement Fiber Skin Structural Insulated Panels (CSIPs) | Innova Eco System
“Our CSIPS panels are manufactured with a expanded polystyrene [EPS] insulating foam core of 1 to 3 pound density, that is sandwiched between two 5/16” thick cement fiber skins. Buildings constructed with CSIPs are more durable and will require less maintenance than buildings with OSB SIPs panels. Fiber-Cement Board SIPs will not rot or corrode and have a higher fire rating than OSB SIPs. Cement Fiber boards will not support black mold growth and have a high resistance to moisture absorption. CSIP panels emit no know toxins and are classified as a “Green Building Material.” With the use of a CSIPS panel, drywall can be eliminated which further reduces the time and cost of construction. The exterior surface of CSIPS can be painted or coated with a synthetic stucco finish, lap siding and a host of other suitable exterior finishes. CSIPS used to construct load-bearing walls up to four stories, roof panels up to 20 foot spans, floors spanning up to 16 feet between supports.”
SIP Installation Cost Estimating Guide | Innova Eco System
“Installation cost of your building kit will depend on a number of factors including the level of building kit purchased. Innova offers building kits with wind rating levels of 120 mph, 150 mph and Dade County 180 mph high wind impact rating. Earthquake design can also be added to any of our building kit levels. Designs with higher wind ratings and seismic requirements will have more anchors and tie-down strapping for uplift and additional ties for lateral movement.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Struct...nsulated_panel
A structural insulated panel (or structural insulating panel), SIP, is a composite building material. It consists of an insulating layer of rigid core sandwiched between two layers of structural board. The board can be sheet metal, plywood, cement, magnesium oxide board (MgO) or oriented strand board (OSB) and the core either expanded polystyrene foam (EPS), extruded polystyrene foam (XPS), polyisocyanurate foam, polyurethane foam or composite honeycomb (HSC).
SIPs share the same structural properties as an I-beam or I-column. The rigid insulation core of the SIP acts as a web, while the sheathing fulfills the function of the flanges. SIPs combine several components of conventional building, such as studs and joists, insulation, vapor barrier and air barrier. They can be used for many different applications, such as exterior wall, roof, floor and foundation systems.
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