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One other thing that can give you lots of phantom type problems is if the secondary transformer on the pole from the power company is over loaded. Your main service typically comes off a step down transformer located on a pole or in the ground somewhere next to your house.
Sometimes they get to many folks on the same transformer and you get all sorts of weird situations because of it. I had it big time in my last neighborhood. The other thing can occur because of overloading is what is known as power factor, in an AC system voltage and current do not have to be in perfect phase and rarely are. If the power factor angle gets too big for any reason weird things can start to occur.
If your power factor is less than unity, (the typical situation) then more current has to flow to do the same work. The worse the power factor, the more the current, can be a factor in a home with the bigger loads. You can buy a critter to correct power factor, basically it is a big capacitor that is slapped across the line.
Also if your utility step down transformer is a bit on the overloaded side, the quatity of the power can suffer. You can get a "More Junky" power wave with lots of harmonics / noise. It all can affect some situations in the home. Hopefully your utility is using American made transformers, not some of that foreign born junk.
In the old neighborhood we had that transformer overload problem. I would call them and say, this puppy is not right. They of course would say, "What do you know". When the load peak would come around 5 PM everyday, I could see my computer monitor screen start to have fine wavy lines. Hey, what did I know, we finally fried the transformer one sunny day. I tell the dudes replacing it with the same size, that new one will be history too. Again they say what did I know. Took us about a week to fry the new one, melted the inlet leads to it too. Popped the relief plug, sprayed oil all over my neighbors car, he was a happy camper.
So they replace it with one size up. All them new TV's, hair dryers, microwaves, computers was really kicking up the peak loads. Shortly the new one was huffing and puffing too. Hey, dudes you need to restring this whole neighborhood, but what did I know. Couple more transformers, break up the load.
So for a problem like this one, I would consider a bunch of things. What is your neighborhood load situation, how heavy is your step down transformer loaded? Are there power factor considerations? What is the house main service sizing, are you trying to carry too much peak power on a marginal sized system? What is the general condition of the house power system, is the grounding proper and low resistance.
Lots of things can play into power phantom type problems. The last thing you want is some dude that just puts in the day and uses some sort of an Easter Egg hunting problem solving methods, can get very expensive. I might suspect a number of these type factors above could be in play. You want a person skilled enough to sort them out in a rational method. The last thing you want is some type of dangerous jury rigging.
Cosmic covered a bunch of stuff, and is right on target. I may add a couple things.
The a/c should have a label that will show the minimum amperage and the maximum amperage breaker/fuse that should be used for it. The breaker has to be within that range, and should not be larger than the manf. states as MAXIMUM allowed. Of course the wire size has to also match the rating of the breaker.
A water heater "almost always" uses a 30 amp circuit. An a/c unit can use anywhere from a 20 to a 60. You need to check the tag on the outside unit. The water heater and the a/c unit should not, under any circumstances be on the same circuit - EVER.
The only time it might be OK is if there is a sub panel that feeds the two units, and it would have a breaker in the main panel feeding the sub. But this is not likely what you have going.
The only other thing that was not mentioned is if the condo/house has a heating system that also provides hot water. Apollo made units that were popular in condos. It was a water source heat pump that heated the hot water for the house when the heat pump ran. This could be what your mother has, and would explain the talk about a/c and water heater.
Can you take a photo of the breaker panel, and the water heater, and the a/c unit and air handler?
I can post pics, but not until Monday. I go back to work tomorrow. She is pushing the red button on the water heater tank to reset her hot water, for the time being...
I mean, I could ask her companion to take pics, but it really is not in her scope of work.
Thanks for the help!
If she has to continually reset a trip unit (red button) on the water heater then it seems to me the problem is isolated to just the water heater and the problem has nothing to do with the A/C as you originally suggested it did. It sounds to me like you most likely have a problem with either the heating elements (which I think you said were replaced with new ones) or the water heater's thermostat(s)/overload protection control(s). You may have a problem with the water heater's thermostat(s), which is somewhat common.
More than likely it is a defective component associated with the water heater. Could be whatever has the red button.
We have no clue what this red button is associated with. More than likely it is some type of thermal overload. Did it work for a long time before??? How often does it trip, is it at different times of the day or does it appear to do it around a particular time?
Sounds like your typical Easter Egg solution will work. Replace things until it seems to be fixed. Not enough info given to have any actual feel for what is installed.
One thing you can do, is shutdown the A/C so it does not cycle, see if the heater will still trip out. Eliminate any interaction between large 220 VAC type loads. If it trips at a certain time, due to water draw for some use, try to shutdown the A/C for that period and see if that has any effect.
This is the type of OP where the problem is poorly described and we get to play a type of guessing game. Is it bigger than a bread box? Does it have yellow wheels.
Have a electricain check the problem out. To me it sounds like either the hot water heater has a problem or the circuit ofr the air condition is the same. A elctrician can test and tell you id=f he knows what he is doing.
Have a electricain check the problem out. To me it sounds like either the hot water heater has a problem or the circuit ofr the air condition is the same. A elctrician can test and tell you id=f he knows what he is doing.
An electrician has been scheduled for a service call tomorrow. From what I told him, he thinks it is the water heater. He is going to troubleshoot the problem.
Lots of great advice and this Forum is fortunate to have so many willing to take the time to post thoughtful and detailed responses.
I think your on the right track calling the electrician... for peace of mind, you need to know the problem is not only repaired, but repaired safely.
Note to Cosmic...
I've had a couple of problems with power fluctuations in the past and my solution was to borrow a recording Fluke Meter from work to monitor the fluctuations and then set up a meeting with one of the line engineers down at the power company. Made a lot of friends once the utility installed the upgraded transformer... seems a lot of my neighbors were having similar problems.
The electrician had to change the amp to a higher power for the electric water heater in the breaker box.
The last person who fooled with it had the wrong amperage and it was a fire hazard!
He also drilled a hole in the panel that covers the red reset button on the hot water heater, just in case...and he also said:
1. The electric water heater is very, very old.
2. There could be power surges since the town home is circa 1970 and all the units are connected.
In the future, we will be having the water heater replaced he also had a referral for a plumber to do it.
I am amazed what I find on Craig list, it is hit and miss, but I have been very, very fortunate.
Thanks for all of the electrical chat!
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Well if you are pushing the red button......
