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Old 12-12-2009, 10:37 AM
 
1 posts, read 29,087 times
Reputation: 11

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We have a house in the Northeast built in 1931. Two years ago, we converted what was originally an attached garage into a family room, and we installed in-floor hydronic radiant heating in a slab for this 20x20 room. The project was supervised by an architect. The pex tubing was properly placed. The walls and slab are properly insulated.

In our cold climate, this system simply does not keep the room warm in the Winter. It works for the milder conditions of Spring and Fall, but it is simply inadequate when the weather is cold. Today, with the cold snap we are experiencing, the room temp stands at 58.

The problem is caused due to the following:

1. Temperatures vary here from the 40's during the day to the 20's at night, and the constant floor temperature simply doesn't respond to the changes. In other words, in the rest of our house where there are hot water radiators, the heat simply comes on and the radiators get hot in response to falling temperature. I understand the concept that our problem must be due to inadequate insulation, need for more pex, need to sue the contractor, etc., but the fact is that where the heat source is constant and where the temperature varies widely, there is always going to be a lag while the heat "catches up" unless you have a way to increase the heat on demand for a surge. A radiant system simply doesn't do this.

2. Our carpets and flooring are causing the problem. I haven't tried removing the furniture from the room to see what would happen, but I presume the problem would disappear if we took up the large area rug and rug pad that covers the wood floor. Even though heat simply rises, and even though with a properly insulated slab there is ultimately no where else for the heat to go but into the room, it must also be true that it is possible to "insulate" the slab to the point where there is insufficient heat transfer -- the heat simply remains in the slab the way a pizza stays warm on the delivery truck because it is in an insulated bag.

And this leads to my major conclusion about the radiant system we installed: it is not much of a heating system where you have to select furniture based upon it. There is something wrong when the heating contractor is "partnered" with a decorator.

If you Google radiant heating systems, you get a billion hits for people who install them. These web sites all provide the same basic (canned) information about how great they are. But upon careful inspection, the success stories center around people who live in milder climates such as the upper South.

Last edited by brewsterK; 12-12-2009 at 10:47 AM..
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Old 12-12-2009, 10:54 AM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,292 posts, read 26,563,652 times
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Radiant Heat is nice in small rooms - as an additional source of heat. It's particularly nice in bathrooms. Warm floors are nice.

But you're right. In a cold climate, it is not going to be adequate to heat a whole room. Additionally, it's always good to have air movement.
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Old 12-12-2009, 10:54 AM
 
23,510 posts, read 69,899,087 times
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"Our carpets and flooring are causing the problem."

Yep. Remove the carpet and it will likely work as designed.
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Old 12-12-2009, 01:35 PM
 
Location: Dripping Springs , TX
786 posts, read 2,751,175 times
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Buddy of mine put in radiant heating when he refurbed a cabin into a permanent home in central Ontario. The temperature drops to -40 at times. He has no problem keeping the house heated with the radiant flooring. He has hardwood, no carpet.

He does have a gas stove but it is more for atmosphere, or really cold days.
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Old 12-12-2009, 03:32 PM
 
Location: Central Fl
2,903 posts, read 12,490,700 times
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I custom designed and built my own home in western NY ten years ago. I installed my own in floor radiant floor heating. It works great. I have tile, 3/4 oak flooring, and carpet and padding in the house. I have no problems with it.

The key is learning the R value of the padding and carpet, and factoring that in how much Pex to use. Also, I made sure I used 1/2" pex instead of 3/8". You may also have to adjust the water temp of your zones using the mixing valves. I off course have my heating temps lower then the boiler output temp, because I have one zone at full boiler temp to run a boiler-mate hot water maker.

Mind you, I did this ten years ago, when most folks never even heard of Radiant heat. Pex then was over $1.00 per foot. They have come a LONG way since.

I agree that one needs to know what they are doing before installing ANY heating or A/C system....but to say a whole method of heating is no good in half the world because of your experience is untrue and unfair.

Here is a pic of it....


Respectfully,

Frank

Last edited by faithfulFrank; 12-12-2009 at 03:40 PM..
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Old 12-13-2009, 04:45 PM
 
622 posts, read 3,106,836 times
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Like mentioned above, the system has to be designed properly to perform in the setting it is installed. Measurements, climate, R-value, etc, etc... have to be taken into account in order to design and install the properly sized and layed out system.
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Old 12-13-2009, 08:00 PM
 
Location: West Michigan
12,082 posts, read 38,702,294 times
Reputation: 17006
Sounds like your's wasn't designed and/or installed correctly. I have seen radiant floor heat used in Northern Maine where the outside temp during the day may be as low as -20 and overnight temps into the -40's. The systems there worked very well no matter how cold it dropped.
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Old 12-14-2009, 07:46 AM
 
Location: Ridgewood
302 posts, read 2,225,153 times
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Is the exterior of the converted garage floor slab insulated above and below grade? There is a lot of heat loss at the perimeter of the slab.
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Old 12-15-2009, 02:37 AM
 
41,815 posts, read 50,775,139 times
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Everyone I know that has it installed loves it and I'm in cold Northern climate and get a lot of feedback from my own forum. To tell you the truth I haven't heard any complaints that I can recall. Sounds to me like you have poor install job or something else wrong.

Not even fully functioning or the house full tightened up yet in from December 7th in Ohio:
Quote:
http://nepacrossroads.com/about13557-45.html

Right now with the main floor heated, the building is quite comfortable to work in, as long as the wind isn't blowing up through the soffits too hard. With calm wind, the house is very comfortable with the floor at 65*. Bare concrete 'suspended slab' floor. The heat in this slab also warms the basement from above.. I don't have water running through the basement slab yet either.. Just not enough time in a day/week/month.
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Old 12-15-2009, 04:59 AM
 
20,793 posts, read 61,069,672 times
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My BIL had radiant heat installed in their house. They have a cement floor in their family room where the radiant heat is. It works just fine, except that they keep their house at 65 degrees on purpose. They have an open concept floor plan and have the radiant heat in the family room and kitchen area that is open to their second story.
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