Ways in which you would design your kitchen (floors, granite, dishwasher)

[home2010]

I asked a question about some kitchen design elements and the answers were so helpful and made many other questions pop in my mind so I wanted to kind of group them here.

I am basically trying to design a brand new kitchen in terms of figuring out types of cabinets and so on. I see some things that look impressive, but I always wonder what is it "really" like in practice and are the features really "all that".

Some of the questions I have for anyone who can share their experience or shed some light, are:

- where is it most convenient to store pots/pans, a rack, a deep drawer, or a pull-out where they hang?

- is it convenient to have the microwave above the oven? (I like the look, but is there a reason to avoid that?)

- Speaking of ovens, I LOVE the look and the thought of the new single/double oven from GE (a double oven that takes the space of a single oven where you don't have to turn on a huge oven to heat a casserole dish that would fit into something much smaller). The cost is similar to a traditional double oven. My fear is, if I get the single/double oven, it would look like there isn't a "full oven" in the house. I do have the space for double ovens, so it would be purely preference (not a space saving issue). Would the single/double oven be something you would choose for a kitchen that's on the bigger side?

- where is the convenient place to locate a pull-out for trash? Near the dishwasher? Near the prep area?

- are pull-outs for spices (or anything else for the matter) a good idea or do they just "look" cool?

- what is the most convenient way to store lids (for pots/pans)?

- what's the most convenient spot for smaller appliances (toasters/blenders/etc)?

[bay]

- I put my pots in the lower cabinet besides the cooktop so that I still can reach them while I am cooking.
- I do not like microwave above cooktop. I use wall microwave and oven combo. They are located on the same counter side of cooktop.
- We do not have pull out trash bin because it smell really bad.....
- spice storage will be upper or lower cabinet besides the cooktop. I am right hand person so I will put it on the right hand side.
- frequent use small appliance will stay on counter. Otherwise, they will stay in the pantry cabinet or island cabinet.

I am short person so I do not like to use wall cabinet too much. I will try to utilize all base cabinets as possible. I have sink and dishwasher on the island and cooktop, micro/oven on the other side. I store whatever cooking stuffs (pots, spice, big dish) on the side of cooktop and serving/pre stuffs (small dish, container, spoon etc) on the island cabinets.

[desertsun41]

I have a really good idea for you. Most every kitchen cabinet showroom (except the big orange and big blue) have Certified Kitchen Designers and planners on staff. Most all offer FREE basic design service. Please do not take advantage of these people. Free design service is based on the hope/assumption/prayer that the consumer will buy. I said "basic" design. If the Designer goes back and forth with the customer they may charge a small fee and refund that when you buy.

So why take advice anywhere else? Ask a pro who knows. If you are stuck then go to National Kitchen & Bath Association and click on find a pro in your area. They are highly trained with many years experience in how to lay out your kitchen for the best function and use.

Here are some tips from my book. Don't worry, I'm not selling anything. I give them away to my customers. Hope this copy & paste works.......
Hope this helps you in the right direction without fear.
.
The big box stores charge a hefty fee for design service. And every change you make they charge you again. Many small Kitchen Cabinet Showrooms offer free basic design service. That don't make the Designer a low life middle man during the entire process. The Kitchen Designer earns their living by selling cabinets but are highly trained in how to make a kitchen work. The Designer does not disappear from your life once you hand them a check. The Designer keeps you informed as the cabinets are ordered, the due date, arranging for the installers to show, and any plumbers, electricians or other tradesmen that have to complete a task before the cabinets even show up. The Designer should be on the job site when the cabinets are delivered and supervise the Installers to be sure they do as the plans shows.

Lets back up.
1. Be prepared to tell your Designer what your budget is. There is no sense in showing expensive cherry doors when you have an oak or maple budget.

2. Have pictures of kitchens you saw pictures in that you like.

3. Be prepared to change your mind because you will be introduced to things you never knew existed.

4. Be prepared to change your tastes. Designers come into your project with a fresh viewpoint and (hopefully) a lot of knowledge with ideas you may not have heard of.

5. Put function first, then looks. Your kitchen can be drop dead gorgeous but if you have to trip over the island to get to the oven then what good is it.

6. Expect to look at 3D drawings looking at your new kitchen from several angles.

7. Finally expect to get a firm price based on the drawing. Keep in mind any change will change the price. And many times the design is changed several times before it's to your liking.

*Do not expect anyone to give you a price either by phone or just by walking in your door and looking though many try.

*Do not accept a price per lineal foot from anyone. It is not even close to being accurate.

The only way to price a kitchen is to measure it and place the boxes on a design program. The program does all the pricing and shows the list price. From there many Cabinet Showrooms will discount from list price. The big box stores charge full list price. You would not pay list price which is MSRP or sticker price when you buy a new car, why pay it for cabinets?

Most designers are not contractors, but their job includes guiding you through the process right to the end - and holding your hand when you need it.

Do your homework. Window-shop for cabinets, appliances, countertops, floors - everything that's going into the room. Do your window shopping during weekdays, when show rooms are the quietest

[K'ledgeBldr]

I wholeheartedly agree with ds from the practical standpoint. But I'm guessing you were probably looking more for the actual ideas.
This is probably way more than you were imaging but, I resurrected a post of mine for a little dreaming and inspiration-
As a builder- I didn't advertise or even use the word "gourmet". They were large and functional. And since I used an appliance allowance- I guess the buyer could call it gourmet if it's S/S, granite, etc.
My take on a "gourmet kitchen" goes something like this:
12X16' minimum.
Cabinets: Base cabinets have full extension pull-out shelving, Wall cabinets don't necessary have to be 42" (depends on ceiling hgt.) but they should be well placed- with appropriate sizes in the right places (example; don't have 9-12" cabinets directly above the dishwasher- you don't want to carry plates half way across the kitchen). Decorative doors (glass/open) are for decorative areas- Kitchens are for function! Islands (other base cabinets) should have at least two different level. One is std. counter hgt.- the other kneading hgt. The third level, if so desired would be bar hgt. for a tasting/ breakfast bar. This "bar" would be contained within the kitchen- not a physical barrier that defines the kitchen.
Counter tops should be both function and decorative. Main work stations should be S/S while all other areas can be granite, quartz, solid surface, or marble.
Appliances: Don't necessary have to be commercial grade but, should function or have similar features. I also like to use a lot of ergonomics in the design. For instance, I dislike ovens in ranges and base cabinets. I also dislike (conventional) double ovens. If there is to be two ovens- I like to see single wall ovens (bottom at approx 32" AFF) flanking a microwave and warming drawer. A cooktop is gas fueled- no if's, and's, or but's about it! There should be a minimum of five burners with one that has a BTU rating required for a wok. Dishwashers; normally I'd say two, flanking each side of the main sink. But with the newer drawer washer- you may want to go with one regular D/W and two drawer types. The mix allows you to use only the amount of D/W you actually need.
Now, refrigeration. For a true gourmet kitchen the "big-honkin'" Sub-Zero is out- Component "systems" are in. A refrigeration unit is flanked by base cabinetry, and the freezer unit is flanked as well. Between them in the base cabinetry could be an ice maker and a winecooler or beverage cooler. The main work station or a secondary work station should have a refrigeration drawer.
Other areas/ things of interest:
Main work station- prep sink with disposal. Main sink should be deep-trough commercial-type in S/S. The cooktop area should have an overhead venthood with a remote fan (keeps the noise down), it should also have a pot filler faucet. A trash compactor can be a nice feature and/or a built-in recycling center.
Another key "ingredient" to this recipe (sorry, I couldn't resist) is lighting. I prefer all ceiling lighting to be recessed, in either line voltage halogen, low voltage halogen, or CF. Flush mounts, semi-flush mounts and track systems will get dirty and dusty- too much up-keep. Also undercabinet lighting (wherever there's wall cabinet, and base cabinet below), you want the brightest possible lighting you can get for these areas- especially if they are considered work areas/stations. All should be line voltage, or dimmable low voltage or CF.
And probably not the last- but just as important as everything else- the pantry. I prefer an actual "walk-in pantry", galley style with wood shelving on both sides that starts from 18" AFF and goes to about 18" from the ceiling. And its all adjustable.

I hope that stirs your pot a little!

[plaidmom]

is it convenient to have the microwave above the oven? (I like the look, but is there a reason to avoid that?)

If by "oven" you mean range, I dislike them because a) It seems dangerous to reach above hot pans on the cook top and b) they usually include puny little "vent hoods" that don't actually vent!

If you mean above a wall oven, the downfall would be too high in the wall for short people/kids and you have to reach over a hot oven while baking. The other thing I don't like a microwaves mounted flush in an oven-wall is not having a space on which to set things as they come out the micro.

[M3 Mitch]

I have had good experiences with very small to small kitchens - when I was single anyway. But we are not big entertainers and are essentially "empty nesters" so smaller stuff works for us.

Remembering the very small kitchen in an apartment in Atlanta, sink with under-counter small fridge, small gas range. No dishwasher, would have liked to have one but there ya go - this was in the dark days before microwaves were common anyway - what impressed me is the "triangle" was very small, you could glue my boots to one spot on the floor and I could cook whatever I wanted without moving my feet.

Small kitchen in Colorado house, I downsized the existing huge range and fridge to small ones, put in glass-front cabinets, shrunk a 2-basin sink to a 1-basin (with the little disposal cubbie in the corner) and this expanded the cabinet-top space considerably. Had an under-counter small Sub-Zero fridge with a nice big old antique Maytag chest freezer in the basement. Again for someone who wants to make mass quantities of complicated dishes, it would not have been so good, but for what I actually used it for it was excellent.

[golfgal]

From various houses we have lived in:

pots/pans--hands down, deep drawers near the cooking area are the best way to go

microwave above the stove--we have that now and I like it but I think any built in microwave is fine, I don't like them on countertops. If you have several people in your kitchen cooking at a time, build the microwave in a wall away from the cooktop, if you are the only cook, put it above the cooktop.

The single/double range-for practical purposes they are ok, They basically removed the drawer and added a small oven but think about taking the Thanksgiving turkey out of the large, lower oven, which is basically on the floor. Personally I would prefer double wall ovens and a cooktop.

Put the trash near your workspace.

Spices--the BEST spice storage we ever had were drop down boxes hung UNDER the cabinets. Spices take up so much room in your cabinets, this option takes advantage of unused space.

Lids for pots/pans--if you do the deep drawers you can just keep the lids on the pots and pans. If not, dividers in cabinets work well for lids and for cookie sheets, etc.

Small appliances--we have extra deep cabinets in our island and our pantry cabinets and they work well for small appliances. The cabinets have pull out shelves-which is another suggestion, pull out shelves for EVERY lower cabinet.