Blurring the line between non-profit and for profit corporations (Houston: houses, salaries)

[houstonfan]

Originally Posted by Lauren_Ashley012

The thing about non-profits is that is about people. Not just the people you serve but the people that you employ as well. On every level (not just the bottom level) there has to be a value system in place. Is it right to create the same type of competition/capitalistic ideals...that may bring a large short term profit...only to be self defeating in the long term?

First, being a good leader/businessman is not exclusive to implementing good values and work ethics. In fact, many will say to be a great leader, you have to have both results and run a great workplace that nurtures integrity and ethics. Bill Gates comes to mind.

Second, healthy competition is beneficial to any organization. If ran properly, competition doesn't have to be self defeating in the long term, it makes you bigger and stronger.

Third, to successfully run any organization, there has to be accountability and productivity. Those who slack or are incompetent should be let go. In fact, many people who run these smaller NP's are too much of a 'softee' and can't make logical business decisions. While it's bad to be a heartless cutthroat CEO, it's also detrimental to be one who's a total pushover and make decisions on emotions all the time. There has to be a happy medium.

Finally, food for thought. People who truly love being businessmen love the thrill of managing, growing an organization, directing, organizing, marketing. It doesn't matter what that organization is, even a virtual business, they love to see where they can take it. Some business people truly just want to see how rich they can get, but many others want a great salary doing a job they love. Imagine getting a great salary while being able to work for a cause you truly believe in and having GREAT JOB SATISFACTION knowing you helped people. Much better than getting same salary job but living with guilt over the things you had to do to climb to the top.

[Lauren_Ashley]

Originally Posted by houstonfan

First, being a good leader/businessman is not exclusive to implementing good values and work ethics. In fact, many will say to be a great leader, you have to have both results and run a great workplace that nurtures integrity and ethics. Bill Gates comes to mind.

Second, healthy competition is beneficial to any organization. If ran properly, competition doesn't have to be self defeating in the long term, it makes you bigger and stronger.

Third, to successfully run any organization, there has to be accountability and productivity. Those who slack or are incompetent should be let go. In fact, many people who run these smaller NP's are too much of a 'softee' and can't make logical business decisions. While it's bad to be a heartless cutthroat CEO, it's also detrimental to be one who's a total pushover and make decisions on emotions all the time. There has to be a happy medium.

Finally, food for thought. People who truly love being businessmen love the thrill of managing, growing an organization, directing, organizing, marketing. It doesn't matter what that organization is, even a virtual business, they love to see where they can take it. Some business people truly just want to see how rich they can get, but many others want a great salary doing a job they love. Imagine getting a great salary while being able to work for a cause you truly believe in and having GREAT JOB SATISFACTION knowing you helped people. Much better than getting same salary job but living with guilt over the things you had to do to climb to the top.

You have made some excellent points and I am thankful for your willingness to break it down for me to understand a bit better. However I do have a question...

I hear words such as leadership, integrity, ethics... "happy medium" thrown around alot...I tend to throw these words around myself...but what standard are we measuring it by? What criteria do we use to define a good leader or good leadership?

Are we measuring it by the standard of other corporations/non-profits? Are we measuring it by the standards of the organization itself? Are we measuring by the socio-economic effect it has on the community at large? How is it measured? What do you define success/failure as? What is the standard to maintain a competitive edge?

I consider myself a layman. I do not have the knowledge nor expertise to run a non-profit. I may consider my sister Marie Jo or my brother Bob to be an excellent leader but to another...they might be a complete failure. I am just being honest. I think considering many of us will at one point in our lives have direct exposer to non-profit organizations its good to know more about what we choose to let involved in or perhaps donate our money to. The true outcome for the most part is not seen until 10-30 yrs into the future. I truly appreciate your willingness to share with me.

[Lauren_Ashley]

Originally Posted by RCH99

Not- for- profits need funding to operate. Many are set up as foundations, or endowments, or other entities that hold large corporate stock funds. Therefore, they have a vested interest in the profitability of these held corporations. Many rely entirely upon corporate contributions. Those are made out of corporate profits. It takes money to do most things, good or bad.

You are absolutely right. You truly summed it up so well. From one perspective (again no bias) it is to everyone's benefit to create healthy competition that fosters a refreshing amount of change and efficiency which is to the benefit of everyone. For some, that may be by any means necessary. For others, it requires a particular balancing act...of course we all hope it is the latter and not the former.

[Lauren_Ashley]

Originally Posted by houstonfan

First, being a good leader/businessman is not exclusive to implementing good values and work ethics. In fact, many will say to be a great leader, you have to have both results and run a great workplace that nurtures integrity and ethics. Bill Gates comes to mind.

Second, healthy competition is beneficial to any organization. If ran properly, competition doesn't have to be self defeating in the long term, it makes you bigger and stronger.

Third, to successfully run any organization, there has to be accountability and productivity. Those who slack or are incompetent should be let go. In fact, many people who run these smaller NP's are too much of a 'softee' and can't make logical business decisions. While it's bad to be a heartless cutthroat CEO, it's also detrimental to be one who's a total pushover and make decisions on emotions all the time. There has to be a happy medium.

Finally, food for thought. People who truly love being businessmen love the thrill of managing, growing an organization, directing, organizing, marketing. It doesn't matter what that organization is, even a virtual business, they love to see where they can take it. Some business people truly just want to see how rich they can get, but many others want a great salary doing a job they love. Imagine getting a great salary while being able to work for a cause you truly believe in and having GREAT JOB SATISFACTION knowing you helped people. Much better than getting same salary job but living with guilt over the things you had to do to climb to the top.

Accountability is so important. In fact I truly believe it is the foundation of what makes a person a good leader. Do they believe they are accountable for their actions? Do they believe others should be held accountable? When there is no accountability there is no moral compass (justice) which creates balance. The problem isnt often with one individual, it is the precedent they set for others.

Even with my limited exposure Ive met quite a few non profit managers and from what I personally know...they were trustworthy, honest, hard working people.

[houstonfan]

^^Huh??
I hope you're not trying to elicit us to collectively to write a term paper for you, lol. I've said my 2cents and that's all I know.

[Lauren_Ashley]

Originally Posted by houstonfan

^^Huh??
I hope you're not trying to elicit us to collectively to write a term paper for you, lol. I've said my 2cents and that's all I know.

I've written many term papers in my day and I am DONE!

I like learning for the sake of learning. I think it is sad to live in a city and not understand how the businesses around you directly or indirectly impact your life.

While I can certainly get this information from a book there is nothing like sitting down in a "virtual cafe" and having a conversation with a person that I am likely never to have a conversation with due to the political, economic, and social barriers that are set in place. If you saw me in a cafe you would probably be more opt to hand me a People Magazine than The Economist (not that I read it often). I learned a very hard lesson about reaching out to people. Reality of this world that we all live in =).

[Texascrude]

I think the phenomena is unique to this current generation -- they simply feel they are entitled to do whatever they'd like to do (that's a good thing), and shouldn't have to work at some lousy job just to make a buck. I do think, however, that their experience with non-profits will tend to be short lived.

I had at least 2 friends that graduated from the top of their schools that got a job with Teach for America. They enjoyed it, felt fuzzy inside, then went to work for industry after they had their fill. You also see a lot of people going to what they see as more stable careers (Fed jobs) because of what they've seen over the last 4 years. Job security is no laughing matter.

[Supermac34]

Don't over look the fact that many not-for-profits are NP's in name only. There are huge amounts of NP's that are set up strictly for enriching the executives and employees that run them, that generate revenue, etc. that goes into the pockets of those who run them depsite that the entity itself does not "profit".

[testmo]

running a non profit like a for profit businesses exposes you to the same type of practices that ultimately corrupt many in the business field. when you have to depend on your corporate board for how to run a "non profit" suddenly all these business execs on your "non profit" board blur the lines heavily.

you can look at several of the large for profit agencies that for some reason people believe are non profits. the workers have to run up numbers whether they are helping people or not. it turns helping people into a numbers game and a profit game that a true non-profit doesn't depend on in the same type of way

i chose to leave the corporate world because it was killing people around me and killed the US as we once knew it. i escaped that world and i dont want it to start infiltrating what i do now (i previously worked for a large banking/investment firm)


to the OP: your friends sound like sludges!

[chris_ut]

Non-profits actually pay their executives quite generously, for example the CEO of the Bill Gates Foundation is paid 1 million per year and the CEO of the Red Cross make 500k a year.