Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Texas > Houston
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 05-10-2011, 08:33 AM
 
Location: Underneath the Pecan Tree
15,982 posts, read 35,042,168 times
Reputation: 7427

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by ethanw View Post
Why do you need a study? seriously? Just do it... Asia and Europe is full of high-speed rail links.. This is SO need it in Texas..... I love those things when I go to Europe or Asia.....

TxDOT gets grant to study Houston-Dallas high-speed rail | Houston & Texas News | Chron.com - Houston Chronicle
This isn't news. That's all these idiots do in Texas is waste money studying. We've studied enough! Build the damn thing!

Why not focus on building rail within our cities before building this damn thing. Worst planning EVER.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 05-10-2011, 09:27 AM
 
1,416 posts, read 4,416,539 times
Reputation: 1128
Quote:
Originally Posted by rb4browns View Post
I have two small kids. Yes, it's a PITA. No it is not worth spending hundreds of millions of dollars for. And will it pay for itself? LOL, does Amtrak pay for itself? Just say no to this boondoggle. If people want the convenience of a high speed rail, let private investors pay for it and charge those who want to ride it accordingly. You want it? Pay for it yourself.
While airport funding is complicated, generally government or quasi-government entities own and run our airports. They didn't just appear one day, and Southwest, Continental, United, and American didn't get together and build them (they spend a lot of money to update them and keep them competitive, but that's a different story).

I like the idea of the government spending our tax dollars on putting the infrastructure in place, then having private companies run the operations. One way or another, tax dollars WILL be part of the equation, whether through government-built tracks, or government subsidies (i.e., condemnation of land).

The challenge is having adequate infrastructure in place at the destinations. It is an apples-and-oranges comparison to look at Europe and Asia and think that their rail plans can be implemented here. A different approach (by people who are transportation experts) is needed. I guess that is where the TXDoT study comes in.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-10-2011, 09:53 AM
 
Location: Texas
1,922 posts, read 2,765,150 times
Reputation: 954
Quote:
Originally Posted by milrtime83 View Post
Does Dallas have any useful public transportation within the city?
Dallas has the DART, similar to the Metro light rail, but I believe DART is older, and generally considered better planned than the Metro rail.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-10-2011, 09:54 AM
 
1,211 posts, read 3,538,513 times
Reputation: 1592
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelguy_73 View Post
A different approach (by people who are transportation experts) is needed. I guess that is where the TXDoT study comes in.
TxDoT? We should just pay chad.roper $5.00 to study the issue, prepare a detailed plan, and present it on here.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-10-2011, 10:15 AM
 
Location: Fondren SW Yo
2,783 posts, read 6,650,478 times
Reputation: 2224
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelguy_73 View Post
While airport funding is complicated, generally government or quasi-government entities own and run our airports. They didn't just appear one day, and Southwest, Continental, United, and American didn't get together and build them (they spend a lot of money to update them and keep them competitive, but that's a different story).

I like the idea of the government spending our tax dollars on putting the infrastructure in place, then having private companies run the operations. One way or another, tax dollars WILL be part of the equation, whether through government-built tracks, or government subsidies (i.e., condemnation of land).

The challenge is having adequate infrastructure in place at the destinations. It is an apples-and-oranges comparison to look at Europe and Asia and think that their rail plans can be implemented here. A different approach (by people who are transportation experts) is needed. I guess that is where the TXDoT study comes in.
Yeah, I get the concept. It's not relevant though, as an airport serves exponentially more people and generates/facilitates exponentially more revenue for the public and private sectors than a high speed rail would between the cities. The challenge is not having adequate infrastructure in place at the destinations, the challenge is justifying spending billions of dollars on something that is not needed and will not pay for itself.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-10-2011, 01:24 PM
 
Location: Louisiana to Houston to Denver to NOVA
16,505 posts, read 26,096,575 times
Reputation: 13275
Quote:
Originally Posted by rb4browns View Post
Yeah, I get the concept. It's not relevant though, as an airport serves exponentially more people and generates/facilitates exponentially more revenue for the public and private sectors than a high speed rail would between the cities. The challenge is not having adequate infrastructure in place at the destinations, the challenge is justifying spending billions of dollars on something that is not needed and will not pay for itself.
If it wasn't needed, they wouldn't study it. How do you think I-45 paid for itself? Sure as hell wasn't no private investors.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-10-2011, 02:15 PM
 
Location: Tysons Corner, VA by way of TEXAS
725 posts, read 1,233,584 times
Reputation: 875
Quote:
Originally Posted by rb4browns View Post
Yeah, I get the concept. It's not relevant though, as an airport serves exponentially more people and generates/facilitates exponentially more revenue for the public and private sectors than a high speed rail would between the cities. The challenge is not having adequate infrastructure in place at the destinations, the challenge is justifying spending billions of dollars on something that is not needed and will not pay for itself.
I think you can definitely make the argument it's needed from a few perspectives (energy independence, emissions of aircraft, better mode, etc.) but it definitely won't pay for itself in the traditional sense. Some taxpayer money will be required.

Where it will pay for itself is down the road via decreased intercity air and automobile traffic due to the presence of the train. This will free up roadway capacity and allow truck-based freight to move more quickly and efficiently. This saves money and gas. Given the Texas energy mix trains will emit about 5-10% of the NOx and about half of the carbon dioxide per passenger mile traveled than do airplanes. These are huge environmental benefits.

The three problems are the money, the lack of public transit that businesspeople and high-end travelers would use on the Houston end (not so much on the Dallas end), and the huge outcry from land owners when the inevitable condemnation conversation comes up.

Overall I think it's a good idea to get out in front of HSR, but we're probably not going to see it anytime soon. Only when I-45 reaches a certain level of congestion will it make enough sense to enough people to get the ball rolling. Somewhat similar to how I-5 is in California or I-95 on the East Coast.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-10-2011, 02:34 PM
 
Location: Houston, TX
17,029 posts, read 30,773,910 times
Reputation: 16264
Why do we need this? How often is would someone use this rail line. The key is, would it be faster or cheaper than taking Southwest to Love field. I highly doubt it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-10-2011, 03:01 PM
 
Location: Sugar Land
2,465 posts, read 5,761,220 times
Reputation: 2733
If done right it should be much cheaper. In Europe and Asia the rail lines are a fraction of the airfare cost. I used to comute from Paris Gare du Nord to London St Pancras for almost 6 months, about a 2 1/2 hours ride by Eurostar pass. Best time ever, comfort, food, drinks and get work done as well.

Now imagine having the ability to take a train to Dallas or Austin and be there in no time for your job. Now imagine the potential of people being able to look at jobs in other Texas cities as well.... This open a world of posibilities. The only requirement for some folks is to just be "Open Minded"

I would love to stick my kids in that train and don't have to drive them to Dallas or Austin.... And so many other things....


Quote:
Originally Posted by Oildog View Post
Why do we need this? How often is would someone use this rail line. The key is, would it be faster or cheaper than taking Southwest to Love field. I highly doubt it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-10-2011, 04:44 PM
 
1,416 posts, read 4,416,539 times
Reputation: 1128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oildog View Post
Why do we need this? How often is would someone use this rail line. The key is, would it be faster or cheaper than taking Southwest to Love field. I highly doubt it.
Faster or cheaper at this exact point in time? Probably not, but much of this transportation debate is about trying to predict the future, which humans are notoriously bad at.

Putting all our eggs in the air basket doesn't seem like a good idea, just as Houston putting all its eggs in the car basket is equally foolish.

Regarding air travel, we expect that advances in technology will hopefully allow us to put more flights into the air at the same time, but if we assume that there are only two ways to get from Houston to Dallas--car and air--then both routes will have to be expanded dramatically as the population increases. And there is a price to that as well. Rail will be another way to get people between two points.

Yes, the price will be high, but when air travel was being developed, the price there was high as well.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Settings
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2020 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Texas > Houston

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top