Living in Greater Houston, a huge disappointment so far
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Same copy and paste again? You already admitted on the other thread that you have never been to Houston!
Umm...that's the previous Exxon office before they moved to the Exxon building in 1963. Very historic!
That's like me saying that the Tribune Tower is ugly and could be mistaken for a church, because the architect had no imagination but to Gothic like a cathedral. But we do have the acclaimed second-place design built here ironically. It's called the Chase Bank building.
It features a beautiful banking hall. This is the main location for Chase in the Greater Houston area and the regional office and support departments are above the hall.
You might want to have an in-person visit. The camera of Google's Steetview can distort the images slightly. The curvature of the Hilcorp Building is missing on Streetview. And it's dated because there have been a number of changes since those photographs were taken 2 years ago. The Americana is one, the finishes on Capitol Tower is another.
I was pleasantly surprised that the Capitol Tower was finally built. The street view shows only the podium because the confidence in the Houston office market was lacking due to the oil recession the year before.
Meanwhile what happened to The Spire? I saw some renderings turning it into a deep swimming hole like Centennial Beach in Naperville. It's already been 12 years and it's still a big hole in the ground. Meanwhile Harris County is trying to find another use for the Astrodome!
Chicago is a great place to work--The Loop can't beat anywhere else, even NYC! Luckily it's the suburban office market that is suffering right now, since everybody is trying to go back to The Loop even as Chicagoland's population decreases.
Living there is another story. The climate is horrible--must be the reason that you get moody from the long winters, especially last weeks' bitter cold. The lake finally froze over for many years! Guess why the Brady Bunch was not set in Chicago, but in suburban Los Angeles?
It's also a very expensive city to maintain. The L tracks should have been replaced decades ago. Instead we are treating a rusted bridge like sliced bread. The concept of a train loop is novel and innovated but letting it rust over for charm is not! Sadly State Street has been eclipsed by Michigan Avenue for some time--that's why the Loop is empty on the weekends. The only walking in the Loop is from the Metro stations to the buses that take suburbanites to Michigan Avenue or Grant Park/Museum Campus.
I would rather have the Astros play in the Astrodome again so we can have a commuter rail station like Ogilve or Union station where Minute Maid sits.
If you wanted to talk about sterile, it's the younger Daley that created the Disneyland atmosphere that appeals to tourists at the expense of the rest of the city (especially the South Side), such as the Parisian Metro touches on State Street.
Brady Bunch ... Well Home Alone was set in suburban Chicago. Ferris Bueller's Day Off and others ..... NO ONE disses the Tribune Tower ..... now being converted to apt and high-end cods. Plans for a Super-Tall behind it reveled but not further yet.
On the former YMCA building in Houston being ugly? Sorry, good idea for a thread though with poll. Asking "Is this building Ugly"?
Not to me ..... I could see a Boutique Hotel there, surrounded by large palms .... Call it dreaming. I was told it was to have a Big Oil building that did not happen on that sight then. So its a empty lot ... unless something has changed?
Some of most vibrant street-level locations, are where some of what if Old-Houston remains. Luckily some made to a historic list to save it. I noted already in threads. But huge Parking garages .... never. Bank of America, not street-level at all. Looks like a fortress in need of a moat.... but its a bank. But Houston did a great job allowing the majority of old Houston downtown .... to be lost. That I wouldn't applaud. Luckily final some getting saved.
Nothing is as ugly as the building that replaced the old Macy's in Main St. Totally inappropriate for a cities main street with total lacking street-level or the parking garages I noted at any cities worst. Sorry.
I read Big Oil seems to refer expanding NOT in downtown Houston. So that was my point and not sure why? They COULD BUILD A SUPERTALL .... as STANDARD OIL did in Chicago in 1969 70. Then it became the AMOCO CENTER and today the AON CENTER and getting a exterior elevator and Observatory on top.... approved to build and may start in the Spring.
Just surprises me Big Oil did not give Houston or Dallas one in their cores ....
As for Young Daley Improvement's. Navy pier a huge earlier success ..... started the ball rolling before young Daley was Mayor. Its been ongoing decades. State St had to have the 90s failure if a mall closed to traffic. To gain the revival in the 200os redo again a full success.
The RiverWalk goes back to the 1909 Burnham beautification plan. Lower Wacker Dr got built. But the river's plans took to the era for a cleaner river .... and his idea waaaay back re-awakes with Huuuuge success today and ongoing. Trump Tower Chicago did NT embrace the river and allowed due to sight restrictions.
Lakeview East (New East Side) became a new skyscraper neighborhoods (over rail tracks, old docks and parking) started in the very early 70s. Its ongoing since was thru a few Mayors since. Young Daley longest I believe .... but not his original idea. But key role in plans completed and ongoing for its last tower plans.
Millennium Park had much controversy as costly, overruns, change in plans even during it and did not open for 2000 as planned. But the RESULT was a TOTAL SUCESS and Maggie Daley Park next door that too had a rebuilding of the underground taking garage a readon to remake the surface too.
As for Young Daley neglecting the South and far west sides. He was paramount in removing the total failure of the city's Notorious high-rise Housing Projects .... all demolished thru the 90s and 2000s.
The L expansion pans south and new stations. Clearing out the WORST blight of homes to ther buildings throughout. It made aesthetics in hoods MUCH MUCH BETTER. Even pave streets streets got mere attention there ten the 50s 60s areas I lived in the 80s Chicago on the Northwest side. I was surprised to see Englewood got mere it seemed.
Also Daley maintained street-sweeping throughout the hoods still. City sense to make sure frontage gets maintained and not allowed to get overgrown and proactive in bearding up newer abandoned homes that rise and clearing out trashed lots as posted each year in the Chicago data forum.
Planting trees and planting greens and flowers thru the core and gentrifying areas sure was his agenda too. Surely his wife also gave insight to others in all visitors can appreciate.
Tree-lined neighborhoods was a Chicago trait chosen waaaaay back. You can't just plant a soaring tree-canopy. Former warehousing areas that lacked green as lofts became big... Were given tree-planting priority.
I never recall ever saying I never visited Houston. Only driving true Dallas. I did very few post in the Dallas forum.
The Gulf building in Houston is surely gorgeous and historic. I never would diss it. Glad to know it exist.
On the former CHICAGO SPIRE SIGHT. Yes a looooong wait. Sadly the 08 crash stopped its construction and no ther SuperTall made it 20-stories up. It was finished a decade later as a 50-story building today.
But the SPIRE SIGHT HAS PLANS TODAY. This is the CLASSY rendering presented to the city for approval. Nearby residents said adds a it too much congestion with a Hotel too. The Aldermen wants the developer to tweak plans. That is the next step to approval its in.
This is the SPIRE TOWER-TOWER residential and hotel plan.
I expect the hotel eliminated. Still awesome and one tower is super-tall.
But people hate their views spoiled. But something WILL be approved and built ....
You asked on the SPIRE SIGHT.... The plan again, will get tweaked and hopefully approved.
Alderman pumps the brakes on Related’s plan for former Chicago Spire site.
Across the river I believed the final buildings
of the Lakeshore East neighborhood begun in the 70s
The 90+ Super-Tall there nearing completion.
It did get approved after tweeks. Its final building will rise 85-sories.
Rendering from link below in photo.
Massive three-tower plan for Lakeshore East returns with changes
Area pretty built-up so Spire sight and other bound to get more.
The rendering from the link for the Spire site and Lakeshore East:
A renderings 400 N - Lake Shore East also-TODAY ACTUAL PHOTO shows River
Lake Shore ⤵ SOM ↔ bKL⤵ Architect - the ⤵LSE & Spire site to bottom right off photo
They hate Houston because Houston is winning. I've noticed here on the Texas forum that if you call out a troll who's talking down on Houston you'll get banned.
Houston is free to get bashed here not other Texas cities tho. By the time u read this I'm prob gonna be banned lol.
This is why in Houston we stick up for this great city . Houston vs errrbody
NO ONE disses the Tribune Tower ..... now being converted to apt and high-end cods. Plans for a Super-Tall behind it reveled but not further yet.
The 19th century architects were getting tired of the Gothic style because that was only appropriate for churches. But it was the only high-rise type available in Western culture at the time. Some architects got creative and ended up with the modern glass and steel high rises that soared way above Gothic.
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On the former YMCA building in Houston being ugly? Sorry, good idea for a thread though with poll. Asking "Is this building Ugly"?
Not to me ..... I could see a Boutique Hotel there, surrounded by large palms .... Call it dreaming. I was told it was to have a Big Oil building that did not happen on that sight then. So its a empty lot ... unless something has changed?
Actually that is the big park-and-ride corridor for points west and northwest. An office building would certainly be more appropriate there. The hotel cluster is adjacent to the historic district and the civic center near the bayou.
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Some of most vibrant street-level locations, are where some of what if Old-Houston remains. Luckily some made to a historic list to save it. I noted already in threads. But huge Parking garages .... never. Bank of America, not street-level at all. Looks like a fortress in need of a moat.... but its a bank. But Houston did a great job allowing the majority of old Houston downtown .... to be lost. That I wouldn't applaud. Luckily final some getting saved.
Actually the office building itself has street level access. The adjacent banking hall annex was the result of keeping the Western Union main office building intact because the telegraph cables (at the time it was built--1982/3) were cost-prohibitive to relocate and disruptive to a service still relevant to Houstonians. If you go inside the banking hall, it looks a little corporate and a little Neo-gothic at the same time. The pointedness was inspired by the architect's then-recent trip to Amsterdam's Dutch Gothic canal houses. (I would have called it the Matterhorn!)
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Nothing is as ugly as the building that replaced the old Macy's in Main St. Totally inappropriate for a cities main street with total lacking street-level or the parking garages I noted at any cities worst. Sorry.
The Hilcorp building is Energy Star certified and has a green roof park on the 9th floor. Houston has embraced green roofs since BG Group Place was completed in 2011. Hilcorp's tower is much better than the decrepit, unaesthetic windowless (modern at the time) Foley's store reeking of stench. The old Sakowitz department store across Main Street is a very nice, classy, historic space for Macy's new Downtown Houston store.
The new YMCA is LEED certified and has amenities on the level with the commercial chain gyms, something impossible to pull off in the old building.
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I read Big Oil seems to refer expanding NOT in downtown Houston. So that was my point and not sure why?
Probably because The Big 6 were spooked by Occupy protests that were popular at the beginning of the decade. Two of the Four left Downtown for more suburban parts. Chicagoland's suburban to urban exodus was an anomaly in the U.S. Usually it's the opposite. Only Total (the smallest) and Chevron are still dedicated to Downtown. Perhaps the vacant YMCA block will be the new executive headquarters once they move out of S.F.
Houston is known for its multiple business districts (like around Triangle Plaza in O'Hare). Historically suburban office development consisted of corridors of edge city districts (seen on the southwest/west sides of town) full of skyscrapers, instead of the corporate campuses popular in suburban areas in the rest of the nation. Corporate campuses are still rare in Houston, unlike in other cities in the region like Dallas and Atlanta where they are more extensive.
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They COULD BUILD A SUPERTALL .... as STANDARD OIL did in Chicago in 1969 70. Then it became the AMOCO CENTER and today the AON CENTER and getting a exterior elevator and Observatory on top.... approved to build and may start in the Spring.
Just surprises me Big Oil did not give Houston or Dallas one in their cores ....
Don't know about Dallas but Houston has a height limit imposed by Hobby Airport (secondary, almost exactly like Midway in form). It would be nice for the Southside airport to shift to the city-owned, former Air Force base, Ellington Field or a partnership with suburban Sugar Land transforming their general aviation airport to commercial.
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The L expansion pans south and new stations. Clearing out the WORST blight of homes to ther buildings throughout. It made aesthetics in hoods MUCH MUCH BETTER. Even pave streets streets got mere attention there ten the 50s 60s areas I lived in the 80s Chicago on the Northwest side. I was surprised to see Englewood got mere it seemed.
I really admire the L concept. Houston needs it to replace the intra-downtown Greenlink buses. But Chicago needs to replace the rusted out old bridge before it collapses. It's just not aesthetically pleasing (a big turn-off) to tourists!
Speaking of the '50s, '60s, and the '80s, Chicago's skyscraper boom was during the mid '60s-early '70s. The International was the rage at that time. A decade later, Houston's skyscraper boom happened. Post-modern was the rage at that time. Chicago's buildings are showing their age--the elevator incident a few months ago at the John Hancock reminded everyone how far behind North America is to Asia in the skyscraper game.
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I never recall ever saying I never visited Houston. Only driving true Dallas. I did very few post in the Dallas forum.
You might want to make an extensive visit to make up for the extensive comments about this place you have never stepped foot in. (I have visited and done my research on Chicago.)
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On the former CHICAGO SPIRE SIGHT. Yes a looooong wait. Sadly the 08 crash stopped its construction and no ther SuperTall made it 20-stories up. It was finished a decade later as a 50-story building today.
But the SPIRE SIGHT HAS PLANS TODAY. This is the CLASSY rendering presented to the city for approval. Nearby residents said adds a it too much congestion with a Hotel too. The Aldermen wants the developer to tweak plans. That is the next step to approval its in.
This is the SPIRE TOWER-TOWER residential and hotel plan.
I expect the hotel eliminated. Still awesome and one tower is super-tall.
But people hate their views spoiled. But something WILL be approved and built ....
You asked on the SPIRE SIGHT.... The plan again, will get tweaked and hopefully approved.
I couldn't stand a having big hole in the ground in place for the building with nothing to show for it (except a rainwater/river-filled cenote) for 10 years. Some people were relived that it wasn't built since it was shaped like a d!ldo. People will be taking crotch pics at Grant Park with that, shifting attention away from the Sears/Willis tower.
The Trump Tower may have turned into a big regret a decade later. Some people wished that the d!ldo was built instead of Trump.
The Capitol Tower delay was starting to turn into The Spire but the Houston economy recovered after a couple of years. I was afraid of another Bank of the Southwest Tower:
And still have to drive everywhere, and in much of it deal with substandard pedestrian infrastructure, that's good by Texas-average standards but not major city standards. I can live like that in a lot cheaper places than 1300/mo, before driving expenses, before utilities, including running my air conditioner all night in January because it's 65 degrees with a 63-degree dewpoint.
If you run your A/C when it's 65 degrees that's on you. I haven't run my A/C since October but I do live in Austin where it's less humid.
I do remember having to use heat in the Midwest in May as well as it was in the 30's.
The 19th century architects were getting tired of the Gothic style because that was only appropriate for churches. But it was the only high-rise type available in Western culture at the time. Some architects got creative and ended up with the modern glass and steel high rises that soared way above Gothic.
You bring up the ICONIC Tribune Tower again. Seems you hate this building.... FYI It is iconic in reverence to Chicago and BUILT IN THE 1920s not 19th century. This design was the result of an international competition for "the most beautiful office building in the world," held in 1922 by the Chicago Tribune newspaper. It was given Landmark status in 1989. (see picture below)
Actually that is the big park-and-ride corridor for points west and northwest. An office building would certainly be more appropriate there. The hotel cluster is adjacent to the historic district and the civic center near the bayou.
Actually the office building itself has street level access. The adjacent banking hall annex was the result of keeping the Western Union main office building intact because the telegraph cables (at the time it was built--1982/3) were cost-prohibitive to relocate and disruptive to a service still relevant to Houstonians. If you go inside the banking hall, it looks a little corporate and a little Neo-gothic at the same time. The pointedness was inspired by the architect's then-recent trip to Amsterdam's Dutch Gothic canal houses. (I would have called it the Matterhorn!)
The Hilcorp building is Energy Star certified and has a green roof park on the 9th floor. Houston has embraced green roofs since BG Group Place was completed in 2011. Hilcorp's tower is much better than the decrepit, unaesthetic windowless (modern at the time) Foley's store reeking of stench. The old Sakowitz department store across Main Street is a very nice, classy, historic space for Macy's new Downtown Houston store.
CHICAGO AMERICA'S GREENIST CITY.
https://www.bisnow.com/chicago/news/...est-city-76307
- Chicago is the top market in the U.S. for sustainability, with 66% of its office building footprint qualified as green, according to the fourth annual Green Building Adoption Index study by CBRE and Maastricht University.
[color="RoyalBlue"][b]I never referred to keeping the OLD YMCA as that. I meant repurpose into another use. "Boutique Hotel" conversions of old structures is a thing today in Cites. Like the "Hotel Burnham" in the old "Reliance Building". A 1895 historic building in Chicago restored. Clad in glass and terra cotta .... it was the first skyscraper to have large plate glass windows.
Street-view of the converted building to the "Hotel Burnham" today
This 2014 link show 11 historic other structures. Just in the Loop part of downtown Chicago, that got conversions to "Boutique Hotels". Just as examples of one thing some got repurposed into. https://chicago.curbed.com/2014/8/29...ilding-rescues
Probably because The Big 6 were spooked by Occupy protests that were popular at the beginning of the decade. Two of the Four left Downtown for more suburban parts. Chicagoland's suburban to urban exodus was an anomaly in the U.S. Usually it's the opposite. Only Total (the smallest) and Chevron are still dedicated to Downtown. Perhaps the vacant YMCA block will be the new executive headquarters once they move out of S.F.
Houston is known for its multiple business districts (like around Triangle Plaza in O'Hare). Historically suburban office development consisted of corridors of edge city districts (seen on the southwest/west sides of town) full of skyscrapers, instead of the corporate campuses popular in suburban areas in the rest of the nation. Corporate campuses are still rare in Houston, unlike in other cities in the region like Dallas and Atlanta where they are more extensive.
Don't know about Dallas but Houston has a height limit imposed by Hobby Airport (secondary, almost exactly like Midway in form). It would be nice for the Southside airport to shift to the city-owned, former Air Force base, Ellington Field or a partnership with suburban Sugar Land transforming their general aviation airport to commercial.
I'm only referring to downtown getting a Super-Tall. Some sights say no actual height restrictions. Yet some note this Chase skyscraper might have had something restricting it by the FAA. Just all too strange. There are a lot of cities with airports, closer to their respective downtowns and they don't have issues with large structures going up. Midway airport is 10-miles from Downtown Chicago. O'Hare is 15-miles. Hobby airport is 11-miles. La Guardia Airport is 8-miles from Manhattan (more specifically central park). Logan Airport is 4 miles from downtown Boston. The list goes on...
I really admire the L concept. Houston needs it to replace the intra-downtown Greenlink buses. But Chicago needs to replace the rusted out old bridge before it collapses. It's just not aesthetically pleasing (a big turn-off) to tourists!
No it isn't. Just the crew alone gets all its bridges repainted. But old iron does re-rust gradually. Constant work in progress. I NEVER heard visitors on a Chicago river "Boat Tour" to see its architecture..... have occasional rust seen below the bridge. (See picture of river bridges below raised below) Doesn't deter the beauty of the city-scape. Yes a tourist notes everything. But within reason too. Seeing some fully repainted then one some rust is going to happen.
Again Tourist numbers HIT RECORDS AGAIN. UP 2-MILLION IN ONE YEAR. (See below link I will post) Nearly, 60-million last year for city-proper alone.
Speaking of the '50s, '60s, and the '80s, Chicago's skyscraper boom was during the mid '60s-early '70s. The International was the rage at that time. A decade later, Houston's skyscraper boom happened. Post-modern was the rage at that time. Chicago's buildings are showing their age--the elevator incident a few months ago at the John Hancock reminded everyone how far behind North America is to Asia in the skyscraper game.
The Hancock (now nameless till a new buyer) is revered still. Its sunken plaza has vibrancy still. Over halo is residents too. DO YOU KNOW .... the HANCOCK, SEARS, TRUMP CHI and DUBAI'S BURJ KHALIFA (Tallest in world) has the same Architectural firm. SOM Chicago?
Chicago has skyscrapers from every era. Most blend together well. When I visit dubai's burj khalifa..... I'm impressed in the FULL RESTORATIONS I see to its older buildings. It all were the Modernist boxes .... no I would not love it. But its EVERY ERA SIDE BY SIDE.
Showing ther age is also ridiculous. Redo's of bases of buildings are big. They want relevance. Modernist mixed with newer and older add diversity. Much of Chicago's core is all new. No one EVER SAYS CHICAGOS BUILDINGS LOOK OLD AND OUTDATED IN ITS BLENDING AND ALL THE NEW.
Even the Sears (Willis) Tower you mentioned. Completed in 1973 I believe. It was far from the best design in street-level. But is CURRENTLY UNDERGOING a $500-Million renovation with 300,000 sq/ft of retail, dining and entertainment, 150,000 sq/ft new tenant amenities and a 30,000 sq/ft outdoor deck and garden. All added to its lower street-level base.
Under-construction over a year now to look like...
You might want to make an extensive visit to make up for the extensive comments about this place you have never stepped foot in. (I have visited and done my research on Chicago.)
I couldn't stand a having big hole in the ground in place for the building with nothing to show for it (except a rainwater/river-filled cenote) for 10 years. Some people were relived that it wasn't built since it was shaped like a d!ldo. People will be taking crotch pics at Grant Park with that, shifting attention away from the Sears/Willis tower.
The Spire was extreme and many did not care for its mega-tall shooting out from the lakefront. But spectacular it would have been and proves Chicago had warrant for one. It was to be ALL Residential too and many units were pre-sold to get it started. (See picture below).
The hole isn't visible river or street-level. Its off Lake Shore Dr bridge in its own island of sorts. Only overhead views show it ... but the whole area is built in new skyscrapers. IT WAS A "SCEW" looking building in most comparisons ... not a D!ldo. But guess both go into holes. . The crash of 08 stopped construction from foreign investors loosing their funding to build. Trump Tower was too far up to stop.
The Trump Tower may have turned into a big regret a decade later. Some people wished that the d!ldo was built instead of Trump.
No offense.... but that's ridiculous. The "Trump Tower Chicago" IS A SUCESS and was fully accepted and liked by Chicagoans in 2009. They merely HATED him putting his Name in lights on it in 2014. Its positioning on the bend in the Chicago river gave it instant center-stage. (See picture below).
The Capitol Tower delay was starting to turn into The Spire but the Houston economy recovered after a couple of years. I was afraid of another Bank of the Southwest Tower:
Yes, unfortunate the Bank of the Southwest Tower had a economic downturn (more regional) scrap it. Chicago had 2 that started construction stopped in 08. As I noted before, one was at 20-stories and took 5-6 years till it was competed as a different building 50+ stories today. That Super-Tall was with Japanese investors that the crash killed then. 2- others planned were then never built.
CHICAGO's core was under a boom in 08 when so many plans were then canceled for towers. It took 5+ years to really get into another boom-stage. This one seems to continue loner then most. But once more ins of over-building occurs. A slow-down till filled sill occur.
One more Super-Tall is the break-ground soon that seems likely and past just planning to get built. Others still in planning till approved to build. This next one is all residential I believe with a smaller sister-Tower. The Spire sight as I noted .... a twin-Tower plan. Was rejected with a hotel. So a re-submission with changes requested is the next step.
This next Super-Tall also needed request by the city to get approval.
Nearly 58-million city-proper alone. Its one core gets by far the bulk.
Iconic Tribune in mix - river, Trump, bridge - part of overview - Streeterville
Last edited by DavePa; 07-20-2019 at 12:55 AM..
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Well Home Alone was set in suburban Chicago. Ferris Bueller's Day Off and others ..... 
NO ONE disses the Tribune Tower ..... now being converted to apt and high-end cods. Plans for a Super-Tall behind it reveled but not further yet. 
That I wouldn't applaud. Luckily final some getting saved. 
as STANDARD OIL did in Chicago in 1969 70. Then it became the AMOCO CENTER and today the AON CENTER and getting a exterior elevator and Observatory on top.... approved to build and may start in the Spring.
