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The problem with most of the Public School GT classes is a low entry standard that defines gifted. Brilliant children are mixed in with "Gifted Learners." You may have child with a 145 IQ, who studies and builds microchips to make his sisters Pink,Barbie Car go faster and drive her off a cliff (ok maybe only in my house) , in the same class with a child with a 118 IQ who studies 5 hours a night with parents cracking the whip for them to have straight A's. 118 is close enough the border line if the teachers really like the kid. There is a big difference between the two. I'm sure the teachers know the difference, but a different set of studies is not provided. Pretty much if you're from college educated parents, middle to upper middle class, have good conduct, teacher like you, and pass a test that Texas feels can determine intelligence...you're gifted. Have a cookie.
My brother's girls were in "GT" out here in Western Memorial, SBISD. They're going private next year for various reasons. He claims it was just more work, not different work. Some of the Mom's throw it around like a status symbol. It's gross. Nice ladies and all.......but... I am so often tempted to ask, "so were exactly DID Timmy get the brains from?"
One of my best friends has a son that's in the SBISD GT program while at Hunters Creek. He goes off campus a few times a week for "gifted experiences." Of course, when one put his "gifted experience" side by side with another friend's St. John's course load, it's pretty much the same. Minus bunnies. Don't get me wrong, I think it's a great way for the public school system to seperate the good students from the thugs. They definately will learn better there. I just feel bad for the nice/hardworking B students who don't make it into GT or AP classes. It's not PC to have "neighborhood" classes for them anymore like they did back in the day...when there wasn't GT. You know, before every kid was gifted.
The flip side is a neighbor who's boy is really a genius. You can tell within a few minutes of talking to him. Top athlete, great kid, very nice an polite...but he never stops moving and cracking jokes. Actually a pretty neat person to be around. He rebuilt my Polaris motor when I threw it in the trash and brought it back over to me! I was told that he was denied GT in past school district because of his energy level and he would slow down the class.Apparently he scored very high on their test. He goes to private now. They seem happy with the school.
I'm not sure of what exactly the "Vangaurd" program provides at HISD. Vicman seems to know it pretty well and he might be able to break it down.
Edit: Come to think of it...I seem to know tons of people with Gifted Kids. hmmmm.
Last edited by EasilyAmused; 04-18-2009 at 07:20 AM..
I was in TAG as a child, but we moved around a lot (military) so it was always a chore to keep up with the schools, locations, etc...I don't know about everyone else on here that was in TAG or any other advanced program, but personally I hated the disconnect with my friends, I hated going to different schools, different classes, and field trips to pointless places. I missed the actual "kid" part of growing up, and I ended up telling my parents to stop sending me to these places, and I went back to a regular public school, was able to enjoy myself some, got to play sports through school in a competitve program, and still left my school years with a 4.0 that I didn't have to work for, got scholarships to go to numerous colleges, etc...and I did everything from the public school system. I learned to acclimate myself with people of varying backgrounds, I learned that violence and crime do exist, that there is no such place as Utopia. I watched some of my friends fall down due to poor judgement with drugs, sex, etc...but this is what real life is.
I personally feel that my son, even though he is only 2yrs old, has an incredible mind. He can hold a conversation with you just as good as a friend of ours 5 yr old can. Now, he is not anywhere ready for any kind of TAG program, he doesn't know how to write, do difficult math, etc...but even so, I don't want to take away his youth by placing him into a school designed to challenge him that he may hate. This to me, is just like people who have athletically talented children and send them off to "tennis school" at age 6, and when they become 16-18, they are professionals, making serious money, but hating their parents through it all....Andre Agassi Syndrome (made that up). I will simply focus on a good public school system that can challenge him, but short of him being a Doogie Howser, I want a kid who can grow up living a normal life, making friends (that live in the neighberhood), playing sports, etc...
Here in Tomball ISD our GT testing procedure is quite involved and can start as early as Kindergarten.
All children are given the Naglieri Nonverbal Abiltity test in Kindergarten. Children with a score over 130 are nominated for further testing. It's been a while since my kids did this so I may leave something out. From there, the parents and the teacher separately complete the GATES (The Gifted and Talented Evaluation Scale) survery. From there, the child is also given the Stanford 10 test. They must score in the 95% percentile or above. From there, the child has an interview with a GT specialist. Meanwhile, the parents were asked to compile "a portfoilo" of the child's artwork, videos, etc (anything really) that would help the school understand why that child is gifted. Our school also recognizes children that are gifted in creativity and leadership and there are other tests for that.
When the child scores within a certain range on each part of this process they are given a single point. That child needs to earn a certain threshold of points to be recommended to the GT program. FINALLY, it the child's has enough points, their scores and portfolio go before a committee that makes the final decision for inclusion in the program. Our kids are not accepted as GT or not, they are identified in areas like math, language arts, creativity, etc. I had heard they are wanting to add musically gifted at some point.
Once accepted into the program, the kids are clustered into a classroom. That class is taught by a GT specialist and those kids learn at an accelerated pace. There is a "pull-out" program for any kids that are still not being challenged enough.
As a group, in the 5th grade these kids cover both 5th and 6th grade material. In 6th grade they cover 7th grade material so they can skip those classes when they enter Junior high.
Many kids also chose to take a standardized test that gives them credit for 8th grade math when they enter Jr High. Those kids are then 2 years ahead in math so they take Algebra I in 7th grade, Geometry in 8th, etc. They could take AP calculus or AP statistics their Junior year.
I will agree that in Jr high and high school the biggest difference is more work or more involved projects. For the truly gifted child, these projects are a lot of fun because they usually start with the instructions "do what you want, do the most creative thing you can think of"!
I wanted to add something:
The Nageli test is treated as a defacto IQ test. The score to even be considered for the GT program is 125. A score of 130 is considered gifted in this process. My daughter scored a 148 in Kindergarten. She was placed in the GT cluster but was not accepted into the program until 3th grade. She was rejected 3 times but SHE insisted on the testing every year until she was finally accepted.
Last edited by citizen_jane; 04-18-2009 at 08:24 AM..
I was told that he was denied GT in past school district because of his energy level and he would slow down the class.Apparently he scored very high on their test. He goes to private now. They seem happy with the school.
I really don't have a good understanding of the GT testing thing and maybe someone could answer my question....
I have a friend who a few years back tested her than first grade child for a GT program in SBISD. The child scored well but not high enough to be placed into a GT program. Later the child was seen by district math and english/language specialists and the parents were told that she was two years ahead educationally than her peers.
So if a child that is ahead that far academically is not getting into a GT program, are they looking for more than sheer intelligence with the tests? Maybe it differs from district to district because it looks like Tomball's program is well defined. Are they all structured that way?
I really don't have a good understanding of the GT testing thing and maybe someone could answer my question....
I have a friend who a few years back tested her than first grade child for a GT program in SBISD. The child scored well but not high enough to be placed into a GT program. Later the child was seen by district math and english/language specialists and the parents were told that she was two years ahead educationally than her peers.
So if a child that is ahead that far academically is not getting into a GT program, are they looking for more than sheer intelligence with the tests? Maybe it differs from district to district because it looks like Tomball's program is well defined. Are they all structured that way?
Some kids don't test well. Often really bright kids don't test well, sometimes for the sheer reason that it's boring. I have a feeling that Public School GT kids have to be excellent testers.
So if a child that is ahead that far academically is not getting into a GT program, are they looking for more than sheer intelligence with the tests?
Yes they are. I always found this to be a strange inconsistency with the testing. Parents are told the true Gifted children has nothing to do with what they know but more how they think. (That's a simplification). And yet, the testing for inclusion is based on what they know (ie the Staford 10 test).
Yes they are. I always found this to be a strange inconsistency with the testing. Parents are told the true Gifted children has nothing to do with what they know but more how they think. (That's a simplification). And yet, the testing for inclusion is based on what they know (ie the Staford 10 test).
I know this may be hard to generalize since all districts are different but what would they do with a child that was well ahead academically but did not make the "cut" for a GT program.? How do they address the needs of those children? Do they remain in a "regular" classroom or are there programs designed to help them as well.
Maybe they don't b/c my friend pulled her child from public school and put her in a private school. I will have to ask the mom what kind of support was offered to her child in the public school. It has been a few years so my memory is fuzzy on the experience.
I have a child in GT (SBISD). They meet 1 day a week at Bendwood for GT classes. The class work is much more interesting & complex than the regular work at the home school. They meet with engineers who build city bridges. They study at NASA's space center & simulate flights and fix problems on their simulated shuttles. They have mock court trials and on and on........
The GT selection process is tough in SBISD and the top 97% of i.q. scores are accepted into the progam.
I am wondering if you can help me with some information.
My daughter is currently at a school in the LCISD region in Richmond (she is in 1st grade) and although she is in that schools GT class she is bored to tears and is failing because of it.
She tested in the top 2% nationally (although who knows what they tested) and the school are insisting that she has ADD because she is not 'the same' and 'can't concentrate' on the same repetetive stuff the other kids are doing and to be honest, she hates going to school already at age 6.
Their GT class only meets for 4 hours a week and only in their school and to be quite honest, it seems like they do not do very much different teaching from the normal classes.
My question is, does anybody know of any resources that we can use to try get her out of this situation?
Our problems are further compounded by the fact that we also have a Son that will be starting kindergarden this year too and we would like them both to go to the same school but I am not sure he is up to her academic level.
We are willing to consider private schools, but in the current economic climate, that might be a bit of a stretch and we don't mind a drive to anywhere in the southern/western region of the greater Houston area towards downtown (Katy, Richmond, Sugarland etc).
Thanks in advance for your help.
Brit
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He rebuilt my Polaris motor when I threw it in the trash and brought it back over to me! I was told that he was denied GT in past school district because of his energy level and he would slow down the class.Apparently he scored very high on their test. He goes to private now. They seem happy with the school.
Thanks!
You have given me lots of input to take into consideration.
