Hospital gouging (Huntsville, Decatur, Madison: 2015, renting, health insurance)

[harry chickpea]

I've said it here before, my only question is what took the media so long to comment - even briefly. Notice how WAFF has the story only as the shortest possible blurb. "Taking Action - Getting Advertisers"
Decatur hospital included in Top 50 for highest cost of care - WAFF-TV: News, Weather and Sports for Huntsville, AL

A more full version of the story:
50 Hospitals Tied to Worst Price Gouging Gouge Prices 1,000% for Some Patients, Study Finds | Valley News

It makes little economic sense to “mark something up 10 times what it actually costs and then give a discount,” Anderson said. “Clearly, they expect someone to pay these inflated prices.”

(More accurately, obfuscation allows stuff like "The charge for this procedure is $1,000, but we will discount it JUST FOR YOU BECAUSE YOU ARE SUCH A SWEET CUSTOMER to $600" even though the cost is $100 and a fair price would be $200.)

I rarely say "There oughta be a law" but there oughta be a law against such outrageous practices in Alabama. There is in Ohio, where hospitals have to post their pricing publicly.

[txtoal]

(More accurately, obfuscation allows stuff like "The charge for this procedure is $1,000, but we will discount it JUST FOR YOU BECAUSE YOU ARE SUCH A SWEET CUSTOMER to $600" even though the cost is $100 and a fair price would be $200.)



This is pretty much the scenario in my area. I live 15 miles from one of the hospitals on this list in TX. Fortunately for me, there are 3 other hospitals within a 30 mile radius or less and a major city hospital district is 45 miles away. The comments from the locals near the hospital on the list are interesting to say the least...and not so nice. Doesn't look good for the hospital at all.

[Southlander]

Decatur Morgan Hospital, as it's called now that Huntsville Hospital has taken it over, has an extraordinarily high rate of people who don't pay. A lot of this is due to illegal immigrants, but we also have a lot of Medicare recipients, with fewer younger people using the hospital, not to mention the number of Medicaid holders.
But we're not worried.
Because our hospital is now a part of the vast complex of Huntsville Hospital ("We Buy Out the Competition"), soon EVERYONE from Cherokee to Bridgeport will be helping to tote the note!

[JJ270]

Originally Posted by harry chickpea

There is in Ohio, where hospitals have to post their pricing publicly.

I've been saying this for years. There should be a law mandating all hospitals and clinics to post prices for common procedures. Posting prices will create a price war among other hospitals and clinics. Imagine if grocery stores or gas stations weren't required to post prices. Sounds silly right? It is!

The Surgery Center of Oklahoma list prices for common procedures on their website. When other surgery centers and hospitals within the area found out about this they magically lowered their prices.

Some of the Prices from the Surgery Center of Oklahoma:

[txtoal]

Originally Posted by Southlander

Decatur Morgan Hospital, as it's called now that Huntsville Hospital has taken it over, has an extraordinarily high rate of people who don't pay. A lot of this is due to illegal immigrants, but we also have a lot of Medicare recipients, with fewer younger people using the hospital, not to mention the number of Medicaid holders.
But we're not worried.
Because our hospital is now a part of the vast complex of Huntsville Hospital ("We Buy Out the Competition"), soon EVERYONE from Cherokee to Bridgeport will be helping to tote the note!

This. The town the hospital is in here in TX, is a HUGE retirement community. Lots of Medicare and Medicaid as well as illegal immigrants/indigent care who don't pay. Where I work, we do not have a labor/delivery site which helps but it's still tough.

[DvlsAdvc8]

Had to go to the ER @ Hunstville Hospital not long ago. I had a stomach bug and wasn't able to even hold water down. My intention was to head to a clinic in the morning, but late that night (early am) I got up for the bathroom and came close to passing out. I felt like death. Was driven to the ER, had an xray, couple tests and was given an IV. Turns out I was just really dehydrated and felt infinitely better after the IV.

The bill: $9,000

Insurance paid $6300. I was billed $2,700, which they discounted to $2,000 for paying in full (how nice of them).

Then I received a separate doctor's bill of $700. Insurance covered ~$500, and I had to pay $200.

Then I received another bill for the xray, I don't even remember how much it was.

So I presume the $9,000 bill was the cost of renting their room for a couple hours and a few minutes of nurse time, because I can go buy a bag of IV fluid for less than $15 and everything else billed me separately.

You can't tell me immigrants and old people are enough to justify this crock of shhh.

[dijkstra]

Originally Posted by Southlander

Decatur Morgan Hospital, as it's called now that Huntsville Hospital has taken it over, has an extraordinarily high rate of people who don't pay. A lot of this is due to illegal immigrants, but we also have a lot of Medicare recipients, with fewer younger people using the hospital, not to mention the number of Medicaid holders.
But we're not worried.
Because our hospital is now a part of the vast complex of Huntsville Hospital ("We Buy Out the Competition"), soon EVERYONE from Cherokee to Bridgeport will be helping to tote the note!

You hit the nail on the head with the part I bolded in red in the quote above. The illegal immigrants almost bankrupted the Decatur hospital. I believe it was that hospital that had to close their maternity section and stop delivering babies except for emergency situations because they were being inundated with illegal immigrants who never paid for their deliveries and hospital stays.

All of the hospitals around here have been having a problem with this and it is one of the main reasons we had that immigration bill that ultimately was struck down by the federal government.

In the end the rest of us pay for it. The public hospitals are supported by those of us that pay and have insurance paying exorbitant prices and then the rest is covered by tax dollars. Nothing is going to change as long as we allow non-tax paying, no insurance, illegal immigrants to freely use our services.

[JuanHunt]

HH gets disproportionate share payments for treating the indigent and poor, its rare that they get paid nothing for providing services. They have insurance to cover unexpected large losses, too. When they built the new childrens hospital entryway, they wasted millions of dollars on that curved glass wall, dont tell me they're struggling, they didnt even ask how much the wall cost, just told the builder to make the architect happy.

[MisterEd51]

Begin Quote
Decatur General gets public funds and can't turn away anyone, even if they can't pay.

Decatur General Hospital officials say there are two reasons for that loss: the Hispanic population is a large portion of the charity cases; and, Morgan County has a higher percentage than the state average.
End Quote

Question of financial solvency at Valley hospital
Updated: Jul 26, 2008 5:08 PM CST
Question of financial solvency at Valley hospital - WAFF-TV: News, Weather and Sports for Huntsville, AL
================================================== =============
Begin Quote
California lawmakers moved a step closer on Tuesday to expanding health care coverage for many undocumented immigrants living in the state.

The state Senate passed a bill by a 28-11 vote that would provide health care coverage for children who are in the United State illegally. The new bill would offer coverage through Medi-Cal, the state’s healthcare program for low-income individuals. It would also allow undocumented immigrants in the state to buy health insurance with their own money through the state’s Covered California exchange — if the state is granted a waiver by the federal government.
End Quote

California moves to expand health care for undocumented immigrants
06/03/15 12:37 PM—Updated 06/03/15 02:15 PM
California moves to expand health care for undocumented immigrants | MSNBC
================================================== =============
Begin Quote
In the aggregate, both Medicare and Medicaid payments fell below costs:
* Combined underpayments were $51 billion in 2013. This includes a shortfall of $37.9
billion for Medicare and $13.2 billion for Medicaid.
* For Medicare, hospitals received payment of only 88 cents for every dollar spent by
hospitals caring for Medicare patients in 2013.
* For Medicaid, hospitals received payment of only 90 cents for every dollar spent by
hospitals caring for Medicaid patients in 2013.
* In 2013, 65 percent of hospitals received Medicare payments less than cost, while 62
percent of hospitals received Medicaid payments less than cost.
End Quote

Underpayment by Medicare and Medicaid Fact Sheet, 2015 Update
http://www.aha.org/content/15/medica...idunderpmt.pdf

[DvlsAdvc8]

The total immigrant (legal and illegal) population in Madison Co. is about 18,400 according to MigrationPolicy.org
U.S. Immigrant Population by State and County | migrationpolicy.org
Source: Migration Policy Institute tabulation of data from the U.S. Census Bureau's pooled 2009-2013 American Community Surveys.

That's about 5% of Madison county's ~350,000 total population, and that's ALL immigrants. Of those, about 5,000 are from south of the border (south and central America), or about 1.4% of the total population. I couldn't find a number for Madison county's *illegal* immigrants alone specifically, but the Pew Hispanic Center puts the number under 1.4% of Alabama's population.

So, I think it's safe to say we're looking at somewhere close to 1.4%.

I'm sorry, but I have a hard time believing that this small of a population bears the bulk of the responsibility for Huntsville Hospital et al charging over $10,000 for a scan, blood test and IV bag. It looks more like prejudice-based scapegoat.