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Old 04-13-2016, 02:58 PM
 
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I have an older house in Limestone county for sale. The front porch rails are approximately 6 inches apart. An inspector said that the code currently says they should be 4 inches apart. Is there any requirement to bring an older house up to current code?
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Old 04-13-2016, 05:00 PM
 
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Residential codes are not enforced in the county (but are in Athens). However... you won't be able to find an insurer willing to accept that.
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Old 04-13-2016, 05:50 PM
 
Location: Madison, AL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harry chickpea View Post
Residential codes are not enforced in the county (but are in Athens). However... you won't be able to find an insurer willing to accept that.
Yes they are.

No, you cannot be required to bring a house up to code as long as it was code when house was constructed (or work was done).

Insurance is not going to care.
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Old 04-13-2016, 07:11 PM
 
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As stated, no, you cannot be required to bring a house up to current code. If they did that, most houses more than a few years old would have to be brought up to code. Some, especially some built by a particular builder in the past, would nearly have to be condemned and torn down. lol
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Old 04-14-2016, 05:22 AM
 
Location: Alabama
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Oh yes you can, When we sold our last house I was required to install folding steps up to the attic, install GFI outlets in the garage, laundry room, kitchen and bathrooms.
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Old 04-14-2016, 05:29 AM
 
Location: Madison, AL
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Unless additional verbiage was put in the contract (I am assuming the OP is using the HAAR financed sales contract and inspection addendum), that is not the case. Here is the EXACT verbiage (I actually worked on this on Forms Committee):

"Conditions which meet current governmental guidelines are not considered hazardous; neither are conditions which met the local building codes in effect at the time of construction or modification unless such codes have been changed to require retroactive correction

I cannot even think of a code that requires retroactive correction, if there is one at all.

Its technically a contractual issue, and under the terms of our contract (again, assuming this is the document being used since it is Limestone County) the buyer can ASK, but they do not have grounds to terminate the contract if the seller refuses. A seller may agree to the corrections or they may not...that is up to them.

If OP is dealing with another contract document package then he would need to refer to the terms agreed to between himself and the purchaser. Morgan County sometimes uses their docs in our area but their terminology is quite similar with some very slight differences. It still doesn't require action in this case, but purchaser would have grounds to terminate as their verbiage is very open and vague regarding the negotiable items.

It also doesn't matter if this is Limestone County, Athens, Madison, Madison County, Huntsville....none of those are going to REQUIRE a specific item to be "brought up to code" unless a modification is being done, then work does have to be performed at the CURRENT code. For example, if the railings in this case were rotted (could argue major defect) and being replaced, the seller would have to go by the current code of 4".

Being "required" and "agreeing to" are two very different things. Buyers can ASK for whatever they want, that does not mean the seller has to perform to keep the transaction together. The terms of the agreement between the two parties is what dictates what can be required and what is not required. Right now, the ONLY items REQUIRED to be corrected by a seller are not "normally operating" heating, cooling, electrical, plumbing, septic. Seller agrees to those repairs when the sign the contract documents, all other items are negotiable and there is verbiage in the inspection addendum dictating what are items that a buyer can contractually terminate the contract over, major defects and hazardous conditions. Per the above verbiage, under the assumption as stated by the OP that the railings were built to code at the time of construction, that is NOT a hazardous condition under the contract terms.

I'll also say there are a good many inspectors who like to insert themselves into what a seller is going to do or not do. That is not their job. Their job is to report any and all findings, and then we advise the buyer or seller per the terms of the agreement between the two parties. An inspector is always going to find things that fall outside of the terms of the contract.

Like dijksta said, we would literally be rebuilding houses if that was the case.

Last edited by LCTMadison; 04-14-2016 at 06:07 AM..
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Old 04-14-2016, 06:26 AM
 
3,456 posts, read 4,798,590 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unlblkrubi View Post
Oh yes you can, When we sold our last house I was required to install folding steps up to the attic, install GFI outlets in the garage, laundry room, kitchen and bathrooms.
Obviously, the prospective buyers asked for that in their offer and it most likely came from a home inspection report. It wasn't a requirement by code, it was something you agreed upon and was put into the sales contract. You could have refused and they may have bought anyway or may have walked away without signing the contract.

Some home inspectors are kind of funny. They act as if they are the home sales police when in fact their job is pretty simple. Go down the check list and write a report. They typically go by the latest building codes for the area in which they are inspecting and try to enforce those codes on a home whether it was built two weeks, two decades or 100 years ago. It is like, yeah ok, let me go find some of those huge oak balusters that were made in 1898 and add one in between all of them on the porch because he said they are out of code.
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Old 04-14-2016, 06:39 AM
 
Location: Madison, AL
3,297 posts, read 6,234,731 times
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Appropriate inspector response in this case:

"Mr. Buyer, I just want to point out the front porch railings, and I am going to include this in my report. The code was changed so railings have to be no more than 4" apart, these are 6" which was how homes were built during this time period. If you have small children, you may consider altering the railing.

Inappropriate inspector response:

"Mr. Buyer, the current code for railings is 4" and in these older homes they are wider. This seller needs to correct this defect."

I'll add that some things are dictated by the buyer's financing...FHA and VA has specific requirements that may conflict with the code at the time of construction...for example, handrails. Required by FHA and VA although that might not have been a code requirement at the time of construction. In those cases, the buyer's loan is contingent upon those corrections so the seller would need to decide to continue with the transaction or satisfy the requirements. Those issues come up on appraisal. I've never had a FHA or VA appraiser bring up the railing issue...but some of them are nit picky and the loan is at their mercy.

When you buy an older home, you need to understand that it will NOT be like a newer home...it may not have grounded plugs, could have lead based paint, aluminum wiring, steeper, more narrow stairs with no handrails, etc. That does NOT mean that we can demand a seller rewire a house, tear out all painted surfaces and replace, and tear out and rebuild stairs. If a buyer does not want to deal with those type of issues, they need to look at newer homes.

Last edited by LCTMadison; 04-14-2016 at 07:02 AM..
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