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I saw a property on MLS today for $286k in Millstone.
I remember when we visited the site and took a brochure maybe a little under a year ago they were advertising homes starting in the 300's; whether low, mid or high 300's doesn't matter (my brain blanked out at the site of 3), but it sure wasn't $286k.
Are they selling a mixed development now, or just cutting into interior finishes to bring the price down a bit, while maintaining the appearance of a high-end community on the outside?
Doesn't seem to me as if they've left much out. They still offer granite, tile, full brick, side entry garage, etc. I'm sure JB keeps a close eye on the market. He's had great success in his neighborhoods...if they sit long, they seem to be reducing them. That's what it takes right now in that price range. Seems to be offering a fair value for Madison City. They are on slab, and that's a bit cheaper to build than a crawl space typically.
They have closed on 8 this year, to date. Average price per square foot (dare I even MENTION square footage) was $108. Lowest sale price to date has been $304,430 and the highest has been $372,400. There were a few price reductions.
Millstone has 7 under contract today, with an average price per square foot of $99. Low end of $310,224 and a high of $400,920. (None of these ever had price reductions...I checked the history).
There are currently 5 active listings, with an average price per square foot of $107. Lowest price is $282,970 and a high of $369,900. Looks like they have reduced a couple of them.
When looking at Millstone, you need to look at his standard spec sheet. Take the model...as it stands it is priced at $355k. It starts at around $312k. Where is the difference? In the amenities you put in it, and it does not take long. That model does not have every upgrade he offers, but it does have much more than his base price.
Just about everything you see in that model is an upgrade. He is using granite counters as a standard, but the standard carpet he is using is the cheapest builder grade (you would definately want to upgrade it...Alabama Heritage is using the same thing, comes from Haley's.). I mean, that carpet is CHEAP. Michael Haley told me that carpet maybe would last about 2 years with a family that had children. He refers to it as a "builder value carpet" The model is the only floorplan that includes hardwoods in the greatroom/kitchen (that plan is completely open, so it needs continuous flooring). Benton actually is putting a higher grade carpet in the great room, and cheaper carpet in the bedrooms. All the cabinetry is upgraded. He gives a pittance for a lighting package...about $2400. Last 3200 sft home a client built her lighting totaled over $4000 and she was pretty thrifty. You actually go to Richard's to pick out your lighting. Little things down to the shower doors, cabinetry hardware, door hardware...well, it adds up very quickly.
Just remember, from the ground up, every single thing in that house will cost something...from the knobs on the doors to your closet shelving. It is generally cheaper to upgrade when building that to pay out of pocket later...the builder can get better pricing, and you are just paying the difference from his standard to the upgrade.
When you are building with a builder, many do not include full gutters...AL Heritage doesn't I know. You have to ask for them, roll them into the offer, or you will be paying extra. A client has just closed on an AL Heritage, and our additional provisions was two pages long with everything we rolled into our contract price. We upgraded almost everything, from the flooring, to gutters, additional brick landscaping work, lighting allowance, concrete, bathroom countertops, framed bathroom mirrors, ect. We also rolled in a $3500 front door/sidelights/transoms that turned out absolutely phenominal.
Ken McDaniel, by comparison, is including most of these amenities standard, including hardwoods in greatrooms/kitchens, nicer appliance packages, upgraded lighting, gutters, ect.
Mike Friday is really going cheap on Spencer Green...smaller cabinets, cheaper carpet, orange peel finish sheetrock wall, ect.
In Madison with these builders, the best approach when building a property is to look at several of their finished products, identify the details/amenities you like/dislike, review the spec sheet of the standards and amenities you want to add, and offer a price that includes the specific upgrades you want. Most of the builders will make you pay out of your pocket for upgrades you want to add after contract, sometimes we can do change orders to the contract depending on what the buyer wants to do and how much it will cost.
When you look at the four main builders in that price point in Madison (Ken McDaniel, AL Heritage, Jeff Benton, and Woodland) and add in the same amenities to each house, they all come out to be very comparable in price per foot ($114-$118 average). Ranchers are going to be more per foot, as well as crawlspaces. Some of these will build these houses on a crawl for an additional cost (average about $8000). Also, ask who is doing block and fill slabs vs standard slabs. Benton does a standard poured slab, but the slabs that Ken McDaniel is doing are block and fill, which is a better option and reduces settling. Right now, with what you get standard in the house, all the amenities, and the quality of the product considered, Ken McDaniel and AL Heritage are the best values. Windstone has exploded this past year, and they have very few lots left over there...they are also still building their original upper end crawlspace homes that are in the $400's and up. The one I sold was in the low $300's...the house next door that was being built was over $500k.
And Jeff Benton is negotiating...and some of those have been reduced in price. One was just reduced almost $12k a few days ago. When you look at the sold comps, there are several that have sold for a significant amount under list. Some have sold over...most of those are presales and the final price will have any added amenities reflected. Looking at the pending comps can be deceptive...they usually put those pending at the base price, then they will usually close higher, sometimes lower (just depends on what each buyer decided to put into the house). Ken has $10k on most of his spec homes. Jim Wright (AL Heritage) is extremely flexible and a great builder to build with...he is very negotiable. And Woodland...he is actually withdrawing his homes from the market and not recording sales data. The only reason he would do that is because he is selling low, and he is one that does not want anyone knowing his business. MLS committee just had a task force about this issue and should be addressing that soon.
Jeff Benton also has bought out all the lots in the Arbors (Browns Ferry Crossing) on the street behind Meadow Wood. Can't remember the street name
All the builders are negotiating now...all except Breland and Adams.
Last edited by LCTMadison; 11-19-2009 at 07:14 AM..
I saw a property on MLS today for $286k in Millstone.
I remember when we visited the site and took a brochure maybe a little under a year ago they were advertising homes starting in the 300's; whether low, mid or high 300's doesn't matter (my brain blanked out at the site of 3), but it sure wasn't $286k.
Are they selling a mixed development now, or just cutting into interior finishes to bring the price down a bit, while maintaining the appearance of a high-end community on the outside?
Those plans that are under $300k are all the same plan, and he has discontinued building that plan at Millstone. Two were presales that both fell through. They have reduced the prices on them as well (one almost $12k) They are only 3 bedrooms (she has one listed as a 4, but that room still really is more like a study with the placement at the front of the house off the foyer), unless you add the optional upstairs bonus with full bath. I don't think he was making enough profit off that plan and decided to not offer it anymore.
LCTMadison: Adams did just negotiate on a contract with an agent from our office...took them a month to come around, but they called and told the agent they would deal. I'm sure they are ready to offload some inventory that has been sitting and sitting
I have seen him negotiate on inventory that has been sitting, but not on presales....he is about as stubborn as Louis Breland, but, he can be!
Now, Breland has forced Adams to drop their prices a good bit across the board, he was underselling him. It was kinda funny how it all played out!
I had a client a couple of months ago that got a slamming deal on an Adams in River Landing. It was a custom that fell through at the last minute, and it was overloaded with upgrades. EVERYTHING was upgraded.
When looking at Millstone, you need to look at his standard spec sheet. Take the model...as it stands it is priced at $355k. It starts at around $312k. Where is the difference? In the amenities you put in it, and it does not take long. That model does not have every upgrade he offers, but it does have much more than his base price.
Just about everything you see in that model is an upgrade. He is using granite counters as a standard, but the standard carpet he is using is the cheapest builder grade (you would definately want to upgrade it...Alabama Heritage is using the same thing, comes from Haley's.). I mean, that carpet is CHEAP. Michael Haley told me that carpet maybe would last about 2 years with a family that had children. He refers to it as a "builder value carpet" The model is the only floorplan that includes hardwoods in the greatroom/kitchen (that plan is completely open, so it needs continuous flooring). Benton actually is putting a higher grade carpet in the great room, and cheaper carpet in the bedrooms. All the cabinetry is upgraded. He gives a pittance for a lighting package...about $2400. Last 3200 sft home a client built her lighting totaled over $4000 and she was pretty thrifty. You actually go to Richard's to pick out your lighting. Little things down to the shower doors, cabinetry hardware, door hardware...well, it adds up very quickly.
Just remember, from the ground up, every single thing in that house will cost something...from the knobs on the doors to your closet shelving. It is generally cheaper to upgrade when building that to pay out of pocket later...the builder can get better pricing, and you are just paying the difference from his standard to the upgrade.
When you are building with a builder, many do not include full gutters...AL Heritage doesn't I know. You have to ask for them, roll them into the offer, or you will be paying extra. A client has just closed on an AL Heritage, and our additional provisions was two pages long with everything we rolled into our contract price. We upgraded almost everything, from the flooring, to gutters, additional brick landscaping work, lighting allowance, concrete, bathroom countertops, framed bathroom mirrors, ect. We also rolled in a $3500 front door/sidelights/transoms that turned out absolutely phenominal.
Ken McDaniel, by comparison, is including most of these amenities standard, including hardwoods in greatrooms/kitchens, nicer appliance packages, upgraded lighting, gutters, ect.
Mike Friday is really going cheap on Spencer Green...smaller cabinets, cheaper carpet, orange peel finish sheetrock wall, ect.
In Madison with these builders, the best approach when building a property is to look at several of their finished products, identify the details/amenities you like/dislike, review the spec sheet of the standards and amenities you want to add, and offer a price that includes the specific upgrades you want. Most of the builders will make you pay out of your pocket for upgrades you want to add after contract, sometimes we can do change orders to the contract depending on what the buyer wants to do and how much it will cost.
When you look at the four main builders in that price point in Madison (Ken McDaniel, AL Heritage, Jeff Benton, and Woodland) and add in the same amenities to each house, they all come out to be very comparable in price per foot ($114-$118 average). Ranchers are going to be more per foot, as well as crawlspaces. Some of these will build these houses on a crawl for an additional cost (average about $8000). Also, ask who is doing block and fill slabs vs standard slabs. Benton does a standard poured slab, but the slabs that Ken McDaniel is doing are block and fill, which is a better option and reduces settling. Right now, with what you get standard in the house, all the amenities, and the quality of the product considered, Ken McDaniel and AL Heritage are the best values. Windstone has exploded this past year, and they have very few lots left over there...they are also still building their original upper end crawlspace homes that are in the $400's and up. The one I sold was in the low $300's...the house next door that was being built was over $500k.
And Jeff Benton is negotiating...and some of those have been reduced in price. One was just reduced almost $12k a few days ago. When you look at the sold comps, there are several that have sold for a significant amount under list. Some have sold over...most of those are presales and the final price will have any added amenities reflected. Looking at the pending comps can be deceptive...they usually put those pending at the base price, then they will usually close higher, sometimes lower (just depends on what each buyer decided to put into the house). Ken has $10k on most of his spec homes. Jim Wright (AL Heritage) is extremely flexible and a great builder to build with...he is very negotiable. And Woodland...he is actually withdrawing his homes from the market and not recording sales data. The only reason he would do that is because he is selling low, and he is one that does not want anyone knowing his business. MLS committee just had a task force about this issue and should be addressing that soon.
Jeff Benton also has bought out all the lots in the Arbors (Browns Ferry Crossing) on the street behind Meadow Wood. Can't remember the street name
All the builders are negotiating now...all except Breland and Adams.
I'm not sure, I'd like to hear what the REALTORS think; I would think it would depend on the buyer. What happened to the property values of the homes that border the new Publix on County Line Road?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdbiron
Any idea on what this will do to Whitworth and Cambridge property values? I imagine it would hurt those bordering the high school.
I'm not sure, I'd like to hear what the REALTORS think; I would think it would depend on the buyer. What happened to the property values of the homes that border the new Publix on County Line Road?
I don't think it has hurt the existing properties a bit. There are a few homes that back up to Publix and of course that is not a first choice for buyers, but overall, no problem.
We'll have to see about the high school, but I can't see that being an issue either. I really think it will depend on the buyer. Some are more tolerant of traffic, noise, etc.
From my experience, I don't believe it will. I was a Realtor in the Nashville area before relocating here. Because of the growth another high school was built. It became a huge plus for the surrounding neighborhoods for resale. Everyone was sceptical in the beginning because of the after school events, etc., but it was not a problem at all.
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The model is the only floorplan that includes hardwoods in the greatroom/kitchen (that plan is completely open, so it needs continuous flooring). Benton actually is putting a higher grade carpet in the great room, and cheaper carpet in the bedrooms. All the cabinetry is upgraded. He gives a pittance for a lighting package...about $2400. Last 3200 sft home a client built her lighting totaled over $4000 and she was pretty thrifty. You actually go to Richard's to pick out your lighting. Little things down to the shower doors, cabinetry hardware, door hardware...well, it adds up very quickly. 
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