Japanese Internment Camp in Northern Idaho

[Toyman at Jewel Lake]

Originally Posted by mistyriver

Pretty sure the Japanese-Americans imprisoned here WERE our guys too. As in, Americans. Only they were civilians and not soldiers who were prisoners of war. You can't even make a comparison. It's an apples vs. oranges thing.

That's quite true, and as I said, not exactly a shining example of our history. However, our government's actions pale in comparison to the attrocities committed by the Empire of Japan. Their actions against both our POWs and the defeated civilians of China were beyond barbaric. Ours with the Japanese (and German for that matter) internment programs, were an inconvenience. This at a time when the future of our country, and free countries throughout the world, were in doubt. WWII was a whole lot different than say GW-I.

[mistyriver]

Originally Posted by Toyman at Jewel Lake

That's quite true, and as I said, not exactly a shining example of our history. However, our government's actions pale in comparison to the attrocities committed by the Empire of Japan. Their actions against both our POWs and the defeated civilians of China were beyond barbaric. Ours with the Japanese (and German for that matter) internment programs, were an inconvenience. This at a time when the future of our country, and free countries throughout the world, were in doubt. WWII was a whole lot different than say GW-I.

When you as an American citizen, are forcibly taken from your home and made to live in a prison camp, and forced to work for pennies on the dollar building a highway for the government that imprisoned you...you are welcome to call this an inconvenience. Till then, I'm going to differ with you and call it an atrocity to those who suffered through it.
Still not sure why you are comparing the imprisonment of innocent American citizens and others to the atrocities and barbarities of the Japanese to POW's in WW2. I would hate to be made responsible for the acts of the IRA during the "Troubles" even though my family is Irish.

We do our country no favors by sugar coating the inevitable mistakes we have made in our history. If we deny mistakes, how can we honestly take credit for the successes?

[pimit2]

Try as I might, I can't see your point, Toyman. Nobody is cheering the attrocities committed by the Japanese, nor is anyone suggesting that they be overlooked. What they did to the Chinese and to our captured soldiers was - as you said - barbaric.

It makes no sense to compare those inhumane acts to the imprisoning of men, women and children who were, for the most part, United States citizens. These innocent and legally untried victims of racial paranoia were involuntarily removed by our government from their homes, businesses and property. Some of them never recovered their belongings or property and most never recovered their dignity.

I pray this never happens again to any of our fellow citizens.


pimit2 (Bob)

[banjomike]

Originally Posted by Toyman at Jewel Lake

That's quite true, and as I said, not exactly a shining example of our history. However, our government's actions pale in comparison to the attrocities committed by the Empire of Japan. Their actions against both our POWs and the defeated civilians of China were beyond barbaric. Ours with the Japanese (and German for that matter) internment programs, were an inconvenience. This at a time when the future of our country, and free countries throughout the world, were in doubt. WWII was a whole lot different than say GW-I.

Two wrongs do not make a right, Toyman. If your name had been Tokai instead of Toyman, you would never have written this trash.
What our government did to our Japanese citizens was wrong. Period.

And what they were subjected to was much, much more than an 'inconvenience'. You really need to spend a week living in a hut in Manzanita for a week in the middle of a Wyoming winter to get some true perspective of what they endured.

Even that would not give you the full experience. To really get the full experience, when you went back home, you would find that all your property, land, home, and everything you were forced to leave behind was gone. Other people were living in your house, farming your land, and all your possessions were completely gone. You would need to get legal action and win to get any of it back.

[Toyman at Jewel Lake]

Originally Posted by mistyriver

When you as an American citizen, are forcibly taken from your home and made to live in a prison camp, and forced to work for pennies on the dollar building a highway for the government that imprisoned you...you are welcome to call this an inconvenience. Till then, I'm going to differ with you and call it an atrocity to those who suffered through it.
Still not sure why you are comparing the imprisonment of innocent American citizens and others to the atrocities and barbarities of the Japanese to POW's in WW2. I would hate to be made responsible for the acts of the IRA during the "Troubles" even though my family is Irish.

We do our country no favors by sugar coating the inevitable mistakes we have made in our history. If we deny mistakes, how can we honestly take credit for the successes?

There is truth in what you say...as well as a good bit of hyperbole. I don't disagree with you, that these internment programs were wrong, and are not things we want to see this country repeat. They are a stain on our principles.

However, like everything else, you have to look at the big picture. First was the times. In the 1940s, the respect for individual liberties was not what it generally is now (though some would say we are going backwards these days too). Second, this happened AFTER the Empire of Japan committed a cowardly attack on a country at PEACE. There was not a declared war when Japan bombed Pearl and murdered 2000 of our citizens. When the leadership of a nation commits such an act, it creates suspicion for citizens from that country. It's not fair, not right, but it is what it is. You also have to keep in mind that the same thing was done with citizens of German ancestory/citizenship. You also have to remember that there were Japanese/American spies that operated in this country during WWII, and that contributed to their success at Pearl.

You are justifiably concerned about Japanese/Americans that were forced from their homes during this time. Keep in mind however that we did not have a volunteer military, we had a draft. As such, several million Americans were "forced from their homes" to fight for their country. They didn't just build roads...they died. Around 500,000 of them. And when at the hands of the Japanese, especially when POWs, they were treated brutally. The Japanese soldiers displayed a brutal disregard for any sort of human decency, both with POWs and with civilians in captured areas. These soldiers were products of the same culture that first-generation Japanese immigrants were, further leading to the distrust or suspicions of the time.

It is important to study history with a view to the situation at the time. In that vein, it's perfectly reasonable to study Japanese internment...while doing so with some degree of balance with regards to things like Pearl Harbor, the Baton Death March and the treatment of occupied China. Or Dachu or Auschwitz with regard to the German/American internment program.

I do have to ask, what is your point concerning Ireland and "the Troubles"? Have we ever been at war with Ireland?

[Sage of Sagle]

I don't see a "meeting of the minds" happening on this issue, but everyone has remained civil. I think we should call it good. Seems like everyone has gotten to speak their mind as we've strayed into debating the ethics of these places over the history of the discovery of this camp being in Idaho...

[Toyman at Jewel Lake]

Sage, you're right, and my apologies. I kind of took us off on the tangent.