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I was told that if you lived in a remote area you can enroll as member of the Life Flight service and if you were in a life threatening medical situation they would respond and transport you to the appropriate medical facility.
This would be wonderful in a heart attack/stroke type situation.
Is this how it could work?
I'm not 100% sure about this, but I think you will only be transported by Life Flight if the EMS/Hospital/Doctor makes the decision to have them transport you. It's not a case where you get to make the call because, for instance, you want to be transported to Sacred Heart in Spokane because you think that's the best place for you to go given the situation and you want to get there as quickly as possible.
The benefit of being a member is there is no cost to you if those providing care determine you need to be transported. Basically, you can think of this as an insurance policy that saves you money in the event those providing you with medical care determine you have to be transported by Life Flight. Even in that case though I think it might be a valuable thing to have.
I'm not 100% sure about this, but I think you will only be transported by Life Flight if the EMS/Hospital/Doctor makes the decision to have them transport you. It's not a case where you get to make the call because, for instance, you want to be transported to Sacred Heart in Spokane because you think that's the best place for you to go given the situation and you want to get there as quickly as possible.
The benefit of being a member is there is no cost to you if those providing care determine you need to be transported. Basically, you can think of this as an insurance policy that saves you money in the event those providing you with medical care determine you have to be transported by Life Flight. Even in that case though I think it might be a valuable thing to have.
Dave
Gotcha... Thanks Dave!
I will enroll once my family settles in Idaho in 2017. I'm gathering as much information and doing research to ease the transition from the east coast to the northwest.
Health insurance is another issue to address... I'm afraid that it is going to be a nightmare. We currently have good insurance through my husbands employer but once he retires and I'm younger and unemployed ????? I hate to think of what we're gonna do. That will be another issue to research.
I was told that if you lived in a remote area you can enroll as member of the Life Flight service and if you were in a life threatening medical situation they would respond and transport you to the appropriate medical facility.
This would be wonderful in a heart attack/stroke type situation.
Is this how it could work?
The general rules are:
1. Know which Helicopters provide coverage in that area. Lifeflight is one of five air services within 150 miles of me. If I were in the Grand Tetons or Driggs, AIR is stationed there now. I wouldn't want to wait for LifeFlight, when Air has covered that area for 20+ years.
Insurance in Idaho is easy, compared to highly capitated states. There aren't that many choices.
While I encourage you to check this out with your eventual insurance and whatever choppers cover your eventual area, the general rule of thumb is a helicopter transports to the closest facility medically able to care for what is wrong. If you want a different hospital, you pay the difference.
Some of the terminology goes over my head, but it seems the primary challange for those of us living in Bonner county is the transport time to a hospital that can perform a heart catheterization. Apparently Bonner General can't perform that procedure, so patients need to be transported to Kootenai Medical Center, or I suppose alternatively to Spokane. By changing their protocol and transporting many patients directly to KMC without stopping at Bonner General they were able to reduce the average D2B time significantly. That said, it's still well above the 90 minute target. I'd guess all this goes in spades for people living in Boundary county.
It's an interesting reality check for people who live in rural areas.
Dave
Dave,
I wanted to highlight your last sentence. Yes, life in rural areas like ID has is very different than Urban living. I always encourage folks to check with their doctors, if they have a known medical problem or more to ask how close to what type of facility can they or their family move? Idaho's medical sophistication in the Treasure Valley, Idaho Falls /Pocatello and Cd'A is where the most advanced care is given. Twin Falls is getting there and St. Luke's owns the hospital. I'm not saying certain types of advanced care isn't found elsewhere, like Lewiston, but not in as many specialties. Rural life has plusses and minuses, but patients will not get as upset when they realize not every hospital can do everything. There are several hospitals that have less than 20 beds. They don't have the staff, the room, the funding and need for more sophisticated, complex treatment.
Currently, only Boise and Idaho Falls offer minimally invasive heart valve surgery. If someone is a cardiac patient and thinking about relocating to Idaho, talk to your current cardiologist and learn what services are available at the largest hospitals in Idaho. It's far more than was available 20 years ago.
Secondly, that was a cool link you posted. In going through it, it seems like Bonner County has recognized and identified both the problems and solutions for cardiac problems. However, I may have missed it but I saw zero about stroke.
I don't know Kootenai 's stroke certification status. Someone in NID needs to check. Perhaps even faster than heart tissue, brain cells die without enough oxygen. I understand why many people arrive at E.R.'s in cars. From any significant difference, chopper is the way to go for a stroke patient to get the clot busting drugs injected, after a CT showing the localization of the stroke. ONLY neurologists and Vascular and Interventional Radiologists should make the decision of when to use those drugs. They have risks too.
I hope this helps. Maybe there should be a sticky post about which hospitals offer the most advanced medical care in Idaho
I wanted to highlight your last sentence. Yes, life in rural areas like ID has is very different than Urban living. I always encourage folks to check with their doctors, if they have a known medical problem or more to ask how close to what type of facility can they or their family move? Idaho's medical sophistication in the Treasure Valley, Idaho Falls /Pocatello and Cd'A is where the most advanced care is given. Twin Falls is getting there and St. Luke's owns the hospital. I'm not saying certain types of advanced care isn't found elsewhere, like Lewiston, but not in as many specialties. Rural life has plusses and minuses, but patients will not get as upset when they realize not every hospital can do everything. There are several hospitals that have less than 20 beds. They don't have the staff, the room, the funding and need for more sophisticated, complex treatment.
This is some good advice. I advise people thinking about north Idaho who have significant health issues to focus on CdA where KMC and Spokane are more accessible.
I tell people who ask about our decision to retire in Sagle that when it comes to health care it's a decision made with the heart more than the head. We recognized that if one of us develops a significant health issue we may have to travel to get the level of care we'd like, and that certain emergency situations could be problematic. But for us the desire to live in a more rural environment with the positives that has for us outweighed that concern.
I have a friend who retired in the Yaak in MT, and using his choice as a reference our's seems positively sane.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtn. States Resident
Secondly, that was a cool link you posted. In going through it, it seems like Bonner County has recognized and identified both the problems and solutions for cardiac problems. However, I may have missed it but I saw zero about stroke.
I don't know Kootenai 's stroke certification status. Someone in NID needs to check. Perhaps even faster than heart tissue, brain cells die without enough oxygen. I understand why many people arrive at E.R.'s in cars. From any significant difference, chopper is the way to go for a stroke patient to get the clot busting drugs injected, after a CT showing the localization of the stroke. ONLY neurologists and Vascular and Interventional Radiologists should make the decision of when to use those drugs. They have risks too.
I was encouraged when I found this report, as it does indicate Bonner County has recognized the issue and are trying to develop solutions to mitigate it. I would hope they would excercise a simular protocol for stroke victims, but I wonder if those are as clearly identifiable in the field by EMS staff. If they can't conclulsively rule out other possibilities it may be that a trip to the nearest ER for evaluation by a doctor may be required. I'd be interested in your thoughts about that MSR.
As they point out in the report greater use of helos to transport patients would reduce the time to obtain ciritical care even more. Here is where I don't understand why they don't call the life flight when they have a heart attack victim. Perhaps the time to get the helo up to Bonner County is too long, and what is really needed is to have one stationed in Bonner County.
I'll see what I can find about KMC's stroke certification status.
Here in NID we have a great benefit of reciprocal agreements between NW Medstar and Lifeflight. Each will honor the others members.
You can go to their websites and get all the info/facts. I went with NW Medstar who gave me a Rescue/First Responder discount. This is cheap coverage for what will be a min. Of 12-15k $ bill easy. ( this is the low side )
Lifeflight here in Sandpoint is quite busy and is based at our airport. NW Medstar has a base in Spokane. Check it out folks.....
Here in NID we have a great benefit of reciprocal agreements between NW Medstar and Lifeflight. Each will honor the others members.
You can go to their websites and get all the info/facts. I went with NW Medstar who gave me a Rescue/First Responder discount. This is cheap coverage for what will be a min. Of 12-15k $ bill easy. ( this is the low side )
Lifeflight here in Sandpoint is quite busy and is based at our airport. NW Medstar has a base in Spokane. Check it out folks.....
I agree with hatin 11r. When I researched info about this earlier I was going to bring the two medical helicopter programs up. The stats said one of the two usually does a transport every 36 hrs. Or about four times weekly from Bonner County. I'm guessing all the flights are from the hospital ( Bonner General) not scene flights.
Two questions I would ask local EMS if I lived there, Dave: 1. Do they use fixed wing for transports? They probably don't and may laugh, but maybe there would be an easier way to get a fixed wing located in Bonner County.
2. What would be the cost and criteria to get a chopper in Bonner County? I wouldn't expect an overwhelming positive response, but those response times were long to get a chopper sent from Spokane and back. Quote the Stemi info. At some point we outsiders wonder how come Kootenai doesn't get a chopper? They wouldn't have to upgrade to a Trauma II Center. They kind of staff their E.R. currently with what seemed like 50% Family Practice docs. They would need straight E.R. residency trained and some other changes to bEcole a Trauma II.. Review their mission statement. If their commitment is to all NID residents, then I'd again meet with Bonner General and EMS and ask how could the two hospitals to work together to better care for STEMI patients.
Kootenai has the medical staff, including Interventional and Vascular Radiologists and Neurologists to intervene with the clot busting drugs for cardiac, if appropriate, andv Strokes. But it's entirely a different discussion of whether those doctors will treat strokes emergently or defer to Spokane. They give some mixed messages about that. Many may have chosen Kootenai to practice to avoid doing some procedures and rehab care. Is there a rehab unit in the addition?
Definetly, get a family membership with one of the Chopper Services.
This is some good advice. I advise people thinking about north Idaho who have significant health issues to focus on CdA where KMC and Spokane are more accessible.
I tell people who ask about our decision to retire in Sagle that when it comes to health care it's a decision made with the heart more than the head. We recognized that if one of us develops a significant health issue we may have to travel to get the level of care we'd like, and that certain emergency situations could be problematic. But for us the desire to live in a more rural environment with the positives that has for us outweighed that concern.
I have a friend who retired in the Yaak in MT, and using his choice as a reference our's seems positively sane.
I was encouraged when I found this report, as it does indicate Bonner County has recognized the issue and are trying to develop solutions to mitigate it. I would hope they would excercise a simular protocol for stroke victims, but I wonder if those are as clearly identifiable in the field by EMS staff. If they can't conclulsively rule out other possibilities it may be that a trip to the nearest ER for evaluation by a doctor may be required. I'd be interested in your thoughts about that MSR.
As they point out in the report greater use of helos to transport patients would reduce the time to obtain ciritical care even more. Here is where I don't understand why they don't call the life flight when they have a heart attack victim. Perhaps the time to get the helo up to Bonner County is too long, and what is really needed is to have one stationed in Bonner County.
I'll see what I can find about KMC's stroke certification status.
Dave
Dave,
Maybe we can advance this discussion some when I know you'll be checking this thread. In the meantime, I didn't know if you had seen this 2015 document from 7B EMS or not? What I read earlier was a 2010 report, I believe. The map helps those not familiar with much beyond Cd'A to realize how rural 7B and 9B can be in an emergency. It may be for an EMS service only 10 yrs. old that EMS is doing very well. Unfortunately, the County Commissioners may not have better bargainin chips to get better chopper coverage.
I agree with your idea you wrote somewhere about ultimately getting a chopper in 7B. But that takes the approval of the hospital's in the area, EMS and others. The funding may be the hardest part. Which are the two or three biggest resorts in the county? Maybe it's time to approach private business to help.
In the Idaho Falls area our HCA hospital works with two choppers and a fixed week. But last summer EIRMC kept one chopper full-time at Yellowstone National Park. There are so many cardiac and strokes in visitors, along with regular traumas. But cardiac in particular is a big deal as many don't have cardiac symptoms until they get to our higher altitude. High Altitude Medicine actually a sub-specialty of Wilderness Medicine. One of the world's experts practices in the YNP clinic and has run Base Camp Everest ER for about a dozen years on Mt. Everest. So our EMS and doctors are very familiar with treatments.
I knew that was a good move, but I was taken off guard when during the winter they decided to move the second helicopter to Driggs. That's on the ID side of the Grand Teton National Park and close to Jackson. Hoowever, I knew they had to do it not only for the patients but other reasons, which can be skipped here. If they can save 18 minutes or more flight time, that gives the Interventionalist radiologists/cardiologists a little more time. Apparently, they've had great success.
But as a result, Portneuf MC in Pocatello got a chopper again and Lifeflight, the company, placed a chopper in Rexburg. So we've had four helos and one fixed wing this summer. Even with all the air power, Bonneville County is running six to seven ambulances and at times they have all been out on calls at the same time. The Rexburg chopper would probably have to fly most Bonneville and some other counties critical patients. portneuf has had to fly much more than they've done in the past.
And visitors are clueless what has been done to save their lives.
It will be interesting to see the numbers next year. We had a general surgeon who worked on training the first paramedics in Idaho here over three decades ago. Then he helped establish the state system.
A lot of paramedics here worked for years without any choppers unless one occasionally flew up from Utah. It does take time and agreement among everyone.
FWIW......to clarify the current EMS Helicopter avail.in NID and Bonner County (7B) :
The key players are: Life Flight which has a chopper at the Sandpoint airport,as well as other bases in the NW. They respond to scenes when requested by EMS/FD/PD etc. They also do emergency transfers from Bonner General to CDA Med.Center and Spokane.
NW Medstar has a base in Spokane and throughout the NW,including MT. They operate similar to LF. For an on scene emergency you will get whoever is closest. For a hosp.to hosp.you can make a request but the closest makes the best sense most times.
Both have reciprocal agreements and either program will cover the cost of transp. If anyone wants more info.go the the respective websites and get all the facts
or call them. Bottom line, this will be the best $60-$160 you ever spent......
This is some good advice. I advise people thinking about north Idaho who have significant health issues to focus on CdA where KMC and Spokane are more accessible.
I tell people who ask about our decision to retire in Sagle that when it comes to health care it's a decision made with the heart more than the head. We recognized that if one of us develops a significant health issue we may have to travel to get the level of care we'd like, and that certain emergency situations could be problematic. But for us the desire to live in a more rural environment with the positives that has for us outweighed that concern.
I have a friend who retired in the Yaak in MT, and using his choice as a reference our's seems positively sane.
I was encouraged when I found this report, as it does indicate Bonner County has recognized the issue and are trying to develop solutions to mitigate it. I would hope they would excercise a simular protocol for stroke victims, but I wonder if those are as clearly identifiable in the field by EMS staff. If they can't conclulsively rule out other possibilities it may be that a trip to the nearest ER for evaluation by a doctor may be required. I'd be interested in your thoughts about that MSR.
As they point out in the report greater use of helos to transport patients would reduce the time to obtain ciritical care even more. Here is where I don't understand why they don't call the life flight when they have a heart attack victim. Perhaps the time to get the helo up to Bonner County is too long, and what is really needed is to have one stationed in Bonner County.
I'll see what I can afind about KMC's stroke certification status.
Dave
Well Dave, I found unexpected information in a highly unusual publication, for this subject. I thought I should post this now before I forget.
Apparently, 7B and Bonner General have noticed the age of the patients and the outcomes. Bonner General entered an agreement, I believe in April or maybe March of 2015 with one of the Spokane Hospitals for Telemedicine Consults on Stroke patients. Whether Bonner General is administering clot busting drugs, or simply reviewing elapsed time, symptoms and physical findings and then deciding what to do with patients who have had strokes, IDK. It was more just a statement that an agreement had been reached and then on to other topics that were suppose to be covered in that publication.
Bonner General should know more details. I don't regret discussing this information here so those in NID could learn more, if they wanted to. At least everyone should know EMS and Bonner General are aware of Stemi scores and trying to do something to give residents a better chance of recovering from a stroke (or cardiac event).
I hope this info helps
MSR
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