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Beautiful Cooke City property. The description added “One must be rugged (or a bighorn sheep) to be the "king of this hill". Those are impressive peaks. I’m starting to realize and respect how diverse and varied “wilderness” is in the region. Impressive and makes my job all the more challenging. Yes, must filter territories prior to heading out for more paralysis in the posterior.. 5-6000 miles is a lot. You must have seen a great deal of beauty in your travels!
The Billy Creek (Buffalo WY) property was really nice too. I’ve looked at the Ten Sleep area nearby (the Indians said it took “10 sleeps” to get there) as that whole area seemed quite remote. I’ll need to actually head out there once/if I have a few properties I’m really interested in... The Red Grade Rd property had incredible views. It would be nice not to have that long of a road to deal with in the winter though. When I was in Graingeville recently I was invited to someone’s house after church to see their home in the mountains in Lucille. They were way back there up the mountain and the views were gorgeous, but they also said it takes two whole days to plow their driveway in the winter.
DuNoir Valley looks rugged, I’ll check more into it. I’ve been looking into Dubois as well. The Rams Horn Ranch was quite beautiful. Again, still hard to tell from pics if the area is for me..
Ten Sleep to up on the Big Horns an a big transition. Ten Sleep is in the Big Horn basin IIRC and is mixed dry and badlands area, as you know. Up on the Big Horns is snow country and a lot of high green pastures mixed with forest in the range of 7-8000 feet; a lot of the area is like a big high plateau at those elevations, with the higher central peaks in the middle. Going up in elevation towards the Cloud Peak area transitions into high, glacier country, much like the terrain near Cooke City. So going up on the Big Horns is quite a diverse mountain environment.
As said, Billy Creek is off of Hazleton Rd which is off of US 16 which is kept cleared in winter. So you might want to keep an eye out for properties along Hazelton Rd in northern Johnson County WY for better winter access. Here is an example not far off of Hazelton Rd, and does not cross NF land, so should be plowed/plowable in winter. I've seen other cabins for sale there. Check out the views:
Dubois is a unique little place, in between the Wind River and Absaroka's, and transitions eastward into dry areas. It is a long way from anywhere; for big box store shopping, you go 3 hours east to Casper or 3 hours west to Idaho Falls. medium store shopping is 1.5 hours either way in Jackson or in Riverton/Lander. The town has the basic supplies anyone needs, just not anything fancy.
If you like dramatic views, you can look up in the Union Pass area, which is on the south side of US26 across from the Dunoir valley area. It has a fair number of vacation cabins scattered around up there, but the main road is kept plowed all year. Some Union Pass houses have cisterns as wells cannot be put in... too deep to practically drill in some areas. But you seem like someone who would not be challenged by that. Lots are typically only a few acres. Wildlife? Someone I know there had to shoo a grizzly off their porch one morning last winter LOL
Here is a somewhat isolated place high on the Wind River mountains in the Union Pass area at about 8800' elevation. The long valley running up across pix #5 is the Dunoir Valley. Dubois is about 6 miles to the east. The pix do not do full justice to the views up there; it is amazing. (We looked at the grassy lots right below this place.) This place is about 3/4 to 1 mile off of Union Pass Rd so you have to plow that far... but this place comes with front end loader for that! Hmmm.. maybe you DO need a mule! (And much easier access than the place in Cobalt ID.)
And here is a lot for sale in that same area, about 1 mile from the above house, where you get into some high mountain valleys up around 8000'. You have road access here all year round. https://www.remax.com/realestatehome...338667192.html
Thank you for the links to these different areas and properties. I really appreciate you taking the time to do that and it is helping me a lot! It makes me smile every time I see these neat little cabins located in these remote areas way up in the mountains (big horn sheep/people properties). Makes me marvel and wonder about the people who value or crave natural beauty and solitude found in nature. Especially when I come across an old turn of the century cabin in the mountains... I imagine the people just living off the land and their own hard work in such a remote place. That’s a beautiful existence.
The views in the Johnson County WY area are expansive and really amazing. I will keep a look out for properties off of Hazelton Rd too, thanks for the tip on that. When looking at land, once I see anything resembling plains or hills I’m not as interested. Plains are to me, as boggy lands and ponds are to you. Guess we’ll never be neighbors, haha! This property in this link below is beautiful but I don’t care for the dry areas. I’m definitely a forest person!
The Dubois and Dunoir areas are incredible and I’m checking into both now. A well would be preferred of course but no, I’m not opposed to a cistern. I’ve inadvertently “shoo’d” a grizzly bear myself when out walking a property. It was only a cub but he was running straight towards me before he saw me, gave a squawk and turned around to run the other direction. I was pretty scared that momma was close behind so I quietly and quickly left the area... I had bear spray on me, and I’ve encountered bears (black) before at a distance, but I do not want to encounter a mother grizzly. I have looked at some property in the Union Pass area as well. Definitely incredible views the higher up you go. I think I’m going to build. Too picky to buy a place already built..
Last edited by VagabondForBeauty; 12-06-2019 at 01:37 PM..
Reason: Failed link
I looked at your link from Cody and feel the same way.... dry, scrubby, and in the valley bottoms is not what I am after either. Cody tends to be more dry and the land prices are being driven up by demand, so we have passed that area by. I like mixed forest and high altitude natural pastures. The Bog Horns have that mix, but get heavily forested in some areas so keep your eyes open.
For the denser alpine like forests up in that region that you seem to like, you need some combination of conditions that keeps dampness in the ground. 3 things seem to effect this most: altitude, snow, and sunniness. Up your way, you get the snow and not too much sun. So forests thrive despite the lower altitude. In areas like the Big Horns and the areas around Stanley ID, and west of Dubois WY, the altitude is much higher, and so the snow and dampness is there despite being sunnier. Plus some areas like Island Park ID get heavy natural snow fall that promotes forests, along with the altitude. Cody has lower altitude so keeps things drier and that limits the forests. So those are the things to factor into your quest.
As for that Union Pass area near Dubois, it is the view side (the north side of the Wind River range, where wells are nigh impossible to do. Just the wrong rock formations and too-deep aquifers right in that area. That area is in Fremont County WY, where, outside of the towns and the reservation, there are no building codes in force at this time. So that makes building a bit less of a hassle... but also means you need to have a good inspector on your team if you consider buying a place. Most are fine, but you just gotta be a bit more thorough.
And yes on the she-bear with cub(s).... that would be the biiiig worry!
So. Took a drive to Condon today. The Swan Valley is a truly beautiful location. I looked at land that provided stunning dual views from one property- one could wake up to the sunrise over the big Swan Range vista to the east, spend the day hiking unlimited Forest Service land out your back door, cook a nice dinner in your cozy cabin and watch the sunset over the Mission Mountains to the west... Maybe this is the place.
The town of Condon didn’t seem to have a main section, it was so spread out along the highway. Had a nice lunch at the Mission Mountains Mercantile deli (super impressed with their selection and gourmet offerings, didn’t expect that in a small town) and chatted with some friendly locals who confidently affirmed that life in the Swan Valley is special. I also met a homeowner down a gravel road I was lost on who invited me in to his and his wife’s cabin to look at a map. Very friendly people with sweet dogs curled up on their dog bed placed in front of the wood stove. They said there are plenty of sunny days during the year to outweigh the cloudy ones, and that getting outdoors makes you forget it’s a gray day. They grow fruit trees too, pear, apple, cherry.. He said he has a hard time finding work and often commutes to Missoula or Kalispell for work. I also learned of the community service group/non profit Swan Valley Connection that holds conservation, stewardship, and education programs- connecting people and nature. That is awesome.
I saw a lot of beauty today and a lot more to be discovered in the Bob Marshall nearby I know. I’m going to continue looking at properties out there and see if I can find a remote spot to call home.. WY & ID m a y have to wait. We’ll see. Thank you everyone for your help and suggestions! Especially you, theham. It was one of your property links that led me to this area (right near my own backyard) and I learned a lot about “working a region” from your example. Btw, the HallHall property was perfect in every way EXCEPT it was too close to the highway. I could hear vehicles roaring by the entire time I walked the property.
What started as an ID post may have ended up a MT one. I guess one learns as you go sometimes.
Good deal, Vagabond! That whole valley seems to be the more heavily forested type of region you seek. Plenty of snow. Thanks for the report on that one parcel! And good for you for getting out and speaking directly to folks.
Since you are looking more locally, you might also want to check out areas a bit more to the SE of that Valley, around Lincoln and also in the hills around Helmville. I've spotted a good number of forested hill properties in those 2 areas, and the drive up MT 141 is nice.
And as another aid in your research, make use of the county or state GIS/parcel map sites. These show the lot/parcel maps, and most all of them now have both satellite view and topo maps that can be viewed with the parcel lines overlaid. This enables you to somewhat better visualize the 'lay of the land' and also see how far you are from neighbors, if there is an industrial or business building nearby, and so on. This is another aid to 'filtering out' parcels that you find on-line, and optimizing your drive time.
These GIS sites also give you access to property tax info and tax assessments. (The latter can be some help in seeing if a property is priced within reason, but that is always dependent on a number of other factors, like overall demand for the property type, and the local property price pressures.)
The Montana GIS is on a statewide basis, on a site called the 'Montana Cadastral'. The WY and ID GIS sites are per county, so you look up the county for the property of interest and then go to that county's GIS site. These sites have search fucntions by address that, most of the time, can take you right to the map view of that parcel.
So. Took a drive to Condon today. The Swan Valley is a truly beautiful location. I looked at land that provided stunning dual views from one property- one could wake up to the sunrise over the big Swan Range vista to the east, spend the day hiking unlimited Forest Service land out your back door, cook a nice dinner in your cozy cabin and watch the sunset over the Mission Mountains to the west... Maybe this is the place.
The town of Condon didn’t seem to have a main section, it was so spread out along the highway. Had a nice lunch at the Mission Mountains Mercantile deli (super impressed with their selection and gourmet offerings, didn’t expect that in a small town) and chatted with some friendly locals who confidently affirmed that life in the Swan Valley is special. I also met a homeowner down a gravel road I was lost on who invited me in to his and his wife’s cabin to look at a map. Very friendly people with sweet dogs curled up on their dog bed placed in front of the wood stove. They said there are plenty of sunny days during the year to outweigh the cloudy ones, and that getting outdoors makes you forget it’s a gray day. They grow fruit trees too, pear, apple, cherry.. He said he has a hard time finding work and often commutes to Missoula or Kalispell for work. I also learned of the community service group/non profit Swan Valley Connection that holds conservation, stewardship, and education programs- connecting people and nature. That is awesome.
I saw a lot of beauty today and a lot more to be discovered in the Bob Marshall nearby I know. I’m going to continue looking at properties out there and see if I can find a remote spot to call home.. WY & ID m a y have to wait. We’ll see. Thank you everyone for your help and suggestions! Especially you, theham. It was one of your property links that led me to this area (right near my own backyard) and I learned a lot about “working a region” from your example. Btw, the HallHall property was perfect in every way EXCEPT it was too close to the highway. I could hear vehicles roaring by the entire time I walked the property.
What started as an ID post may have ended up a MT one. I guess one learns as you go sometimes.
Good for you--maybe you're about to find what you're looking for! But if I were you I'd pop over to the Montana forum and ask about the Swan Valley. You may get an additional, useful perspective.
Please be careful Vagabond when you go out on your trips. Things can become treacherous at this time of year quickly.
It's very good to go check out prospective places in a season when stuff like difficult access is more obvious than in the height of summer, but go prepared and be as ready for the worst as you can be.
I've seen far too many good folks put themselves into real danger by failing to to prepare adequately before they left. Some have suffered for the rest of their lives from that simple mistake, and a few I remember have died.
You are much more experienced than most of the folks who come to this forum with wilderness, so I'll just leave this as a cautionary note, and I hope it is unnecessary. But I've also known some outdoors people with years of experience who, when rushed, have forgotten something vital and paid dearly for it later on.
I've been caught myself a few times. Don't repeat my mistakes. Be prepared and come back safely. Let someone know where you play to go before you leave.
When the weather is bad or the suitability of the region is unclear or whatever, Google Maps street view surfing can be a quick and efficient first step.
Yes, theham, they typically do get a good bit of snow in that area. What’s interesting is there wasn’t any (hardly a dusting on the ground) while I was there. One of the locals said they should have had 3 -4’ on the ground by this time of year... Climate change. I have looked at Lincoln and Helmville but hadn’t seen anything of interest- yet. I’ll keep an eye out as I continue to check out Condon, thank you! Good tip on the Montana Cadastral. A realtor clued me into that site and it’s a must, especially when looking at these remote properties. I know of people that bought seemingly private country property only to discover they had neighbors close by their first night- when lights were seen through the trees after dark. Why a person wouldn’t check into this prior to, I don’t understand... I called a realtor this summer about a property in Priest River ID very near the WA border and after going over my “Big 7” questions:
My final question before planning to head out was, “are there any train tracks nearby (if so, I wanted to know how many trains would be passing by in a day or night), or any nuclear power plants?” He says, “well the proposed HiTest Sands silicon smelter is sited for Newport, WA a couple miles away.” Good grief. This is the form ID residents are sending to their representatives-
“According to HiTest's own data, the smelter would emit 320,000 tons of greenhouse gases, 760 tons of sulfur dioxide, and 700 tons of nitrogen oxides each year. This is roughly the same amount of sulfur dioxide as 165,000 wood stoves burning continuously at the project site.
Idaho's citizens are just downwind from the proposed smelter site – some less than a mile away. This is our backyard, yet the permitting agencies have no representative accountability to the citizens of Idaho. We shouldn't be forced to accept health problems, increased truck traffic and declining property values – especially when the smelter doesn't benefit us economically. Don't let HiTest and Washington State ruin our families’ health.”
Really horrible. I don’t know where things stand now but imagine buying your country property and not knowing what’s around you! The GIS sites are valuable. Thank you for mentioning that. And ClarkForkFantast, I am searching on the MT forum for Swan Valley threads. Ty too!
Now to Banjo. Can you tell I haven’t taken the time to learn how to incorporate multiple quotes in my reply? I apologize! I appreciate your words of caution. I make it a practice to plan for the worst case scenario with everything I do- to be on the safe side of things. This isn’t my nature because I’m more of a risk taker, but I also don’t like to be cold, uncomfortable or hungry so, in my vehicle kit for example:
-LED flashlight with USB charging port.
-Multipurpose tool
-Axe
-First Aid kit
-Non perishable, high calorie food (nuts, dried fruit)
-Dog food
-Water
-Snow shovel
-Sleeping bag
-Rain poncho
-Flares
-Fire starter
-Knife
My supplies vary with the occasion. For going to look at remote property I carry bear spray and I change my ammo up to Extreme Penetrator ammo. I still have a lot to learn about wilderness survival. I read the book Bear Attack’s, Causes and Prevention by Stephen Herrero (leading scientific authority in the field) Pretty frightening but instructive so I feel better prepared to know how to react should the worst happen. I haven’t panicked the few times I’ve encountered bears- let alone had to use my bear spray (or worse..) Reading the books by Sam Campbell have taught me to love nature and respect wildlife- and to live responsibly with wildlife. I do understand what you’ve mentioned about the seasons too. I do not want to get my vehicle stuck or injure myself in the cold, dark, wilderness because it could be the end of me I know. Again, persons going it solo tend to be overly cautious. When I looked at property in the Salmon, Challis area I spoke with a older couple who have lived in the wilderness area for 30 years. He said no matter how careful you try to be, accidents happen. He told of a recent winter he got his snow machine stuck and as he was trying to pull it around he slipped and hurt his shoulder so severely that he had to be flown out (I don’t know details but it was a private plane on a neighboring ranch maintained airstrip that got him out). Living in the wilderness successfully requires caution, respect, and a certain skill set that I am continuing to learn. I appreciate your words of caution, thank you.
All the worst case scenario stuff aside, here’s some beauty, courtesy of the Swan Valley Connections Instagram page:
Last edited by VagabondForBeauty; 12-09-2019 at 11:33 PM..
Reason: Typo
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5-6000 miles is a lot. You must have seen a great deal of beauty in your travels!
Thank you everyone for your help and suggestions! Especially you, theham. It was one of your property links that led me to this area (right near my own backyard) and I learned a lot about “working a region” from your example. Btw, the HallHall property was perfect in every way EXCEPT it was too close to the highway. I could hear vehicles roaring by the entire time I walked the property. 
