Swine Flu in Idaho (Boise, Clark Fork: middle schools, gated, closing)

[Clark Fork Fantast]

Originally Posted by cleosmom

So check this out, I have a sinus infection and was up all night coughing. I was supposed to go to my niece's graduation today down to Holt Arena. Not happening In the first place I don't need to be around others who might be sick or carrying something else and the way I'm coughing I'm certain people would stare at me.

Sorry to hear you're sick and missing out on a family celebration! But you're doing a nice thing for everybody by not scaring them to death, sitting there, coughing. Something we haven't mentioned here is that one of the best cures, in addition to Airborne, Zicam and saline nasal spray, is simply getting some sleep...

[Mtn. States Resident]

Originally Posted by cleosmom

So check this out, I have a sinus infection and was up all night coughing. I was supposed to go to my niece's graduation today down to Holt Arena. Not happening In the first place I don't need to be around others who might be sick or carrying something else and the way I'm coughing I'm certain people would stare at me.

Cleosmom,

I have to second what NCM said: YOU DID THE RIGHT THING!!!!

You are exactly correct in that not all risk is in what YOU have; part of the risk is what you may get from others and their bugs.

I do hope you get feeling better soon. Stop worrying about work and take care of Cleosmom for a while!

Great post!

MSR

[Mtn. States Resident]

Originally Posted by Clark Fork Fantast

Sorry to hear you're sick and missing out on a family celebration! But you're doing a nice thing for everybody by not scaring them to death, sitting there, coughing. Something we haven't mentioned here is that one of the best cures, in addition to Airborne, Zicam and saline nasal spray, is simply getting some sleep...

CFF,

You introduce another excellent point. Sleep is the most natural way a body can fight an infection, regardless of the bug. Besides, it can happen at any point and doesn't have to be started like the anti-virals within 48 hrs. Plus, one doesn't have to ask someone to go get even an OTC medicine like Zicam or other medicines. Not that the OTC medicines can't help - and with so many bugs managing a fever with OTC medicines is a key. Plus, herbal and other remedies can help as well, if one knows how to use them appropriately, But, nothing can take the place of sleep, IMHO.

The question for me is how do adults who have so many different commitments make sure they get enough? Perhaps sleep has to become a priority and if one thinks of it as a way to protect health, maybe some of us (like me) will attempt to get more. It's not that I don't want it; however, the needs of others seem to always interrupt it.

I'm glad you brought the subject of sleep to the discussion, CCF. In no way can it hurt a person who is ill or well.

[Mtn. States Resident]

I saw some literature yesterday that suggested if one was going to sneeze and/or cough and didn't have tissue that that person sneeze or cough in his/her elbow.

It sounds reasonable to meet. Better than what I posted previously (eww, but the official recommendation at the time). And while NCM also offered an option, the potential problem is if one bends over and any part of the inside of a shirt/blouse etc. can come in contact with your hands much easier than some think.

If you are struggling to understand how the inside of clothing can come in contact with a surface, a pen, hands etc., put a clothes pin or something else in a button down shirt/blouse. Count how many times that area either exposes your cough/sneeze to others, or comes directly in contact with something else you use. Let us know, as inside the clothing may be better than the elbow. We can call this "The Idaho Experiment in Epidemiology," where all opinions are valid and wanted.

So, experts in living and dealing with people of different ages, perhaps you've either wondered if others who have flu-like symptoms should be tested for
N1H1 or not. Or perhaps you've taken someone yourself to get tested (like I did this last week - thank you for your support, Torrie that day) and learned new information clinically about N1H1 and thought about many things as you waited and waited and waited for the results of the tests. What do you think of one's elbow as a place to sneeze? An elbow doesn't come in contact with hands as naturally as some other parts of the body.

Please share your opinions. And please continue to be smart about contact with those who are ill.

Thanks,

MSR

[Mtn. States Resident]

I think we're far from finished with this round of the H1N1 flu. For those who don't think it's a big deal, consider who may be carriers and the medically fragile, "Special Populations," who may be infected and unable to fight off the virus compared to others.

There have been three more deaths reported in about the last 24 hours (outside of Mexico). One in Costa Rica, another in Canada and now this man in his 30s in Washington State.

Apprently, the WA State man reportedly had symptoms start on April 30, 2009 and was treated with anti-viral medications. He died on May 6, 2009. It is unclear to me why his death wasn't announced earlier, unless his samples were backlogged at the CDC and by the time his sammples were tested, he had died. (If others have any other ideas/theories, please share here). The repoted story said he died of pneumonia with H1N1 being ONE FACTOR, along with others. Nonetheless, he tested positive for H1N1 and I wonder how many others may have been exposed in the hospital prior to the CDC confirmation of his lab samples?

Washington state records first swine flu death | KOMO News - Seattle, Washington | Local & Regional

Per the KOMO news story, the U.S. currently has 2,254 confirmed cases of
H1N1 flu. The CDC also reports that number as of 05/09/09 at 11:00 a.m. EST. As the CDC has written in one of their updates, as soon as they put out numbers, they are already outdated. Idaho only shows one case, but the Health Dept. says that number will change soon, possibly today. Credit the fact ID can finally do their own testing now, instead of having to wait for results from the back-logged samples at the CDC, before the Health Dept. can announce confirmed cases in a more timely manner.

CDC H1N1 Flu | CDC H1N1 Flu Update: U.S. Human Cases of H1N1 Flu Infection

For me, there are a couple of questions I still ask.

First, when is the sick person most vulnerable to worsen or even have death? Plus, if you look at the CDC data, not only are more states now reporting cases (all but six), but there is an odd pattern I see. Check out the number of cases of Confirmed H1N1 in IL (421) and WI (317). Just a few days ago, WI had less than ten or no confirmed cases and IL had less than \20. I started to notice IL about 4 days ago when they had almost as many cases as NY, then had almost double the amount of cases the next day.

Is it the train between Chicago and WI where commuters are being exposed? Or what do you think is causing these two states to have almost 1/3 of the cases to date in the U.S.?

If you doubt that 1/3 of the cases, per 05/09/09, were in these two states, please do the math: 421 + 317 = 738 Cases. 738/2254 U.S. Cases = .327 X 100% or 32.7% = 33% of the Cases in IL and WI.

While many continue to quote 36,000 annual deaths from the flu, check out how many deaths have occured in Mexico vs. how many confirmed cases.

Instead of relying upon the 36K for the amount of deaths annually from the flu, ask yourself if this is the same percentage as the "'normal flu," or different? Thankfully, the U.S. seems to have a less virulent presentation in confirmed cases, nonetheless, I plan to watch closely for a few more days to see how rapidly this spreads.

For those who have people in your life who just can't comprehend how rapidly infectious disease can spread (thus the Pandemic Level still at Level 5), perhaps showing them the CDC and WHO charts 2-4 days in a row and noting the changes in some states will help. However, I think those who don't want to think of how serious this could be won't necessarily pay too much attention to the numbers.

The biggest concern, again, is what will be both how many will have confirmed Infections and what % will result in death? Those in the know expect a much more virulent strain in during the regular flu season.

What do you think? Are you watching the numbers and considering what you would do if someone in your family or work place tested positive? Or, are you one that thinks you are safe since ID is more rural than some states, thus the chances of someone you know getting sick won't happen in your circle of friends/family?

I look forward to your thoughts.

MSR

[Mtn. States Resident]

Originally Posted by norcalmom101

Protecting pens in an office environment can be tricky. I've got my own color, only pen like it in the building. Today I got distracted for a minute, an employee reached over and signed her name with my pen! And she was sick!! I picked up the offended instrument with a post it and cast it into a corner, where it will await sterilization until Monday morning. Call me paranoid, but if you ask me there seem to be quite a few people who don't understand basic infection control.

NCM,

Have you got any of those little alcohol wipes around? You could wipe your pen down with those. Or, the one standard for some virus control - Clorox (or generic -it doesn't matter). Wipe with a Clorox wipe for the best possible containment of whatever bugs your co-worker has. The bigger problem is more than your pen; this sick co-worker has been coming to work.

I hear ya, people just don't get it! I hesitate to ask if this employee had been sneezing etc. in her hand previously. EEWWW.

You aren't paranoid, rather just trying to protect yourself and ultimately your kids and other co-workers by keeping yourself healthy.

You might want to post one of those CDC posters I had in an earlier post up at work. The CDC wants people to download and use them. If you can't find them, send me a DM and I will send them to you.

I don't let others use my pens. I try to keep a cheap plastic pen around so if others want ask to borrow mine I produce the other one and tell them to keep it. I'm lucky in one sense, I have congenital wrist problems that have required 3 surgeries and 2 more to go. So I really have a reason to keep my pens as there are only certain brands I can use. Unfortunately, they are expensive, so NO ONE uses them but me. However, you can use the same principle. Tell others you LOVE your pen and must keep it due to X reason. Consequently, you can't risk losing by letting someone else use it, given what it means to you. Keep some cheap plastic ones around for those who give NO THOUGHT whom they might be infecting.

Thanks for sharing the example for two reasons: First, much like CFF and you and I discussed this past week, there are indeed situations that present that could be uncomfortable when some appear clueless. However, even talking about them in this thread has helped me. Preparing ahead of time mentally gets one ready of how to deal with certain situations.

A couple of days ago I didn't have my mask on and went to a store for something. A person was sneezing. I thought of this thread and although it wasn't me sneezing, I instinctively covered my mouth and nose with my elbow and arm. I'm not sure I would have done that had we not problem solved here ahead of time. So mega thanks to both you and CFF!

Secondly, reframing a situation is good. Your story makes me feel better about my difficult wrist surgeries and the corrections that had complications. People don't hassle me when I tell them I don't share my pens as it's obvious I can't use all pens. Thanks for reminding there can be something positive come out of a very frustrating situation.

I hope these ideas help you. Do you have inservices or training regularly? If so, can you ask the trainer to go over basic principles of Infectious Disease? The CDC has a lot of material to utilize. If you have to, volunteer to teqch it yourself.

BTW - I still can't give you or hardly anyone rep points. So I'll have to do it in posts. Great post!

Hang in there. Maybe your co-worker will stay home until she is well. Oh well, we can fantasize can't we?

And Happy Mother's Day! I hope your kids realize some of how adaptable you've been to make this move work for you and your entire family.

MSR

[pw72]

I saw a guy today in E. Idaho wearing a mask. Don't know the details of his particular situation. This threat seems to be widely overblown in my mind. Yes, it could come back in the fall. I think a vaccine would be likely by then. I'm not concerned.

[norcalmom101]

My issue isn't with my office co-workers so much as with our employees. The worst is on payday, where they all come in to get their checks - and sign for them. Then there are the applicants, who hope to make a good impression and want to shake hands. All the employees are trained in infection control, but when they are coming in from clients homes -> their cars -> to my desk that is little comfort. The alcohol wipes are a great idea. The funny thing is, my coworkers think I'm paranoid, but then they are always getting sick and I'm not!

[pw72]

This thing seems to be overblown by the media. The media is trying to build this into a story, but there really isn't any story. Yes, wash your hands, be aware, but don't freak out. There is no real danger right now.

[Mtn. States Resident]

Originally Posted by pw72

This thing seems to be overblown by the media. The media is trying to build this into a story, but there really isn't any story. Yes, wash your hands, be aware, but don't freak out. There is no real danger right now.

pw72,

Glad you joined the discussion. I'd be more lost about all of this, if I hadn't had molecular biology so I could understand the international discussion better. Plus, having something like 24 emails sent from a regional healthcare provider with which of their hospitals have X supplies, which patients should be seen where, and what supplies they were out of etc.

Needless to say when I've had to wear a N95 mask, I have a bit more information than the general media to form my opinion. However, every piece of info I've seen is referenced in the CDC and/or WHO or a state Health Dept. So anyone who really wants to understand this or at least ask questions can.

I'm sure you are aware per your source of news, every channel, newspaper, radio, Internet site I checked had the same story, that China has their first case of N1H1 as of Sat. (5/9/09). That is reflected in the WHO stats and press release on Sun. (5/10/09):

http://www.who.int/csr/don/GlobalSub...90510_0800.jpg

Please make sure to scroll all the way over to the far right to see the case in China and other Asian countries.

Why does China matter? Bird flu is 60% lethal. We already know H1N1 has portions of human, swine and avian viruses making it different than anything seen previously. The CDC has a cool EM image of the structure if you want to look at it.

You don't need to take my word for it. Please, research the subject yourself. WHO Director Margaret Chan urged Asia on Friday (5/8) to, ""Do not drop the ball in monitoring H5N1".

Wait, is that a typo or what is the number 5 doing where a 1 usually goes? First, it's no mistake or typo and secondly, H5N1 is then name for Bird Flu Virus. So why worry, one case of H1N1 confirmed in China, and only two new cases last week from H5N1 (Bird Flu) - a man in Vietnam who died and a patient in Egypt who is still recovering.

Did we all know that WHO was still monitoring active cases of bird flu throughout the world?

My understanding this link is the largest (and perhaps the only official) web portal out of China. Read the info for yourself: China Daily Website - Connecting China Connecting the World
there are several side stories including those that use the words that Bird Flu is still ENDEMIC. The Story is titled, "China confirms 1st mainland H1N1 case."

It's probably best for me to not give any further links but a simple one to MSNBC as they write the story as well as Reuters, BBC and others. They just get to the questions earlier.

Expert: Swine flu could mix with bird flu - Swine flu- msnbc.com

After you read this, please explain to me why we shouldn't be worried? We KNOW pigs in Alberta got the flu from a male caring for them. And is coincidental or not that Canada's only death is a female also from Alberta. I don't know the answer to that question yet.

The point is we know this virus is defying principles of all other viruses and jumping species and adding viral properties of (swine, bird and human flu). If it mutates again in China with their current rate of Bird Flu (yes, H5N1) and how densely populated China is, help me to understand why we should expect anything good from China.

BTW - the director of the Health Dept. in Snohomish County has released publically the third U.S. victim, the male who died in WA State, can't be traced to any of the previously thought risk factors. Hmmm, something to think about. Hype or preparation?


Finally, I did want to address the hopes of those who want a vaccination for H1N1 so it isn't as deadly as many fear on the second wave. Don't line up for your vaccination for quite a while. How can industry make a vaccination to something that is still mutating?

The CDC was "slow" getting kits to the states due to the problems they had growing the virus in vitro. If the CDC can control for all other factors and still can't have the virus spread like other viruses, how can industry even begin to know what they are working on to design a vaccinae?

Not to discourage folks here, I want a vaccine too. I've perhaps read a bit more literature about the delays already forcast. The U.S. Gov't and others don't focus on that info right now.

Looking forward to all the comments of why we should or shouldn't be more concerned about H1N1 given more U.S. deaths, one who had NO CONNECTION to TX, CA, or MEXICO; the ever-increasing infection rate and now that China has a confirmed case.

Every post and comment are useful in this thread. Different people have different backgrounds and experiences, so it interesting to have others post their views. If I didn't have to look certain information up to link I wouldn't have realized Bird Flu caused a death in the world this past week. So we all learn from data we share.

Thanks to all and stay well

MSR