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Old 06-12-2010, 12:46 PM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,313,536 times
Reputation: 326

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Quote:
Originally Posted by puki View Post
I'm glad you aren't a lawmaker.
So am I. There are not enough jails...LOL

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But you can always talk to your lawmaker who allowed Jose to be pardoned for his civil law violation of entering the country illegally.
Well, that's part of the problem. Less and less of the law makers speak Alabama English...
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Jose was not rewarded. He was pardoned.
You mean one criminal pardoning the other? The one wearing the suit that pardons the one who dry cleans it? They're both the same in my book.
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He was legally granted residency on a number of conditions after his US citizen spouse sought to make it right. Because guess what? There is a way to make it right because of your elected officials in Congress.
Well, you've raised another issue. Congress. They're really no different than Jose. Both are criminals. That doesn't make "it right" though...LOL I vote for the guy that will make the best choices for America. Not what will get them re-elected by pardoning criminal activity.
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This had nothing to do with his all-powerful brownness. It had everything to do with following the laws set forth in the US by Congress.
Congress is always happy to sell America to the highest bidder (read special interest groups). Nothing really new there.

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Many of us US citizens have also violated civil laws so aren't we all morally corrupt? By your logic we should be on the road to acting as criminals. See you in jail! Maybe we can be cellmates?
But I don't think we want illegal immigrant law breakers seeking immigration, do you? Kind of like bank robbers applying for bank management positions. The two are really not compatible. Don't you think?

Quote:
Have you ever been to Guatemala? If you are lower class, you very rarely stand a chance at leaving that class.
Yes, on a cruise ship that needed to make a port run for more liquor and cigars. We we're a little light that day...It wasn't a bad stop, really...Hotter than hell though...if I recall the dock was not big enough and we used tenders to get to shore...a couple of hours in port to re-load and we were off to Panama...Now that I think about it, the stop was rather entertaining, thank-you Guatemala!

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One last thing about the ESL classes. You want people to learn the language if they come here, right?
No, I think you've got me all wrong....I don't want illegals coming here...at all...forget about learning English.
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But then when they do, you find something else to ***** about...confusing.
It's not really confusing, I don't want illegal aliens sneaking across the border, whether they speak English or not. We don't need more criminals, we need less. That's why Jose needs to stay in Guatemala. Don't you think so?
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Old 06-12-2010, 12:52 PM
 
Location: Massachusetts
10,032 posts, read 6,860,628 times
Reputation: 4207
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambient View Post
I agree that this is a problem with illegal immigrants.

But guess what? It's also a problem with US citizens. seeing as a good 40-50 million of them can't afford health insurance, either... What happens when they go to the ER? And Conservatives seem perfectly fine with that system.

Which is exactly why we don't need additional crimmigrants adding to the burden and further stressing our resources. Thanks for helping to solidify that point.
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Old 06-12-2010, 12:56 PM
 
Location: Massachusetts
10,032 posts, read 6,860,628 times
Reputation: 4207
Quote:
Originally Posted by puki View Post
Rick, does it also disgust you that your congressperson's laws allowed my husband to re-enter the country legally after filing a waiver for his illegal presence? He is a legal permanent resident now. Again, misguided anger is annoying, but kind of humorous at the same time. If your panties get in a bunch thinking about illegal immigrants talk to your lawmakers. Yep. That's who controls who gets in and out of this country. YOUR elected officials.

If you go back to my first post, I recognized that there are a number of people here illegally that should not be, but I suppose people like you only read what you want to read. Living in ignorance is so much easier than admitting your logic is terribly flawed. Good luck with being successful in life with that tactic.

But....your husband wasn't one of those people who was here illegally but shoudn't be? Living in ignorance is a subject that you're clearly well versed in. You obviously can't debate this issue due to your asinine bias resulting from your green card marriage. Watch out...now that he got what he needed he may just dump your ass.......
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Old 06-12-2010, 01:00 PM
 
364 posts, read 184,416 times
Reputation: 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by puki View Post
Oops, I apologize for that graphic being so large. :/

Here is a link to the graphic in case anyone would like to educate themselves how difficult immigrating or coming as a non-immigrant can be.

http://cominganarchy.com/wordpress/w...mmigration.jpg
it need to be tuff
to come tio tha usa
especialy for ppl who
have no skills
we owe mexico etc nothin
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Old 06-12-2010, 01:02 PM
 
364 posts, read 184,416 times
Reputation: 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by puki View Post
I don't know if any of the anti-immigrant crowd has done much research on how many conditions you need to enter the country legally. I would like to share this very helpful graphic that demonstrates very simply and accurately how one can enter the US legally:

I agree that anger at immigrants is misguided. Rather than direction towards anyone with skin darker than white or if they are white, if they have a "funny accent", write to your congresspeople and complain about current immigration laws, enforcement, etc. Your congresspeople are the people who have written certain laws and they are the ones that have the power to change them.

One last note, I am not saying that all illegal immigrants that are here are good people because there are some that are plain out bad. HOWEVER, there are a number of people here that are responsible, pay taxes with an ITIN, stay out of trouble with the law, respect others, etc. It is just too bad that all the extremists see is brown=bad and they must be annihilated.
race card dont work
ilegal aliens need to leave tha usa
black anglo hispanic watever
they all need to leave
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Old 06-12-2010, 01:15 PM
 
27 posts, read 19,909 times
Reputation: 13
Iceman, I would like to see where you are getting your percentages. I can make up percentages like 73% of white people who earn less than $45, 00/yr live in trailers in south Georgia, and maybe it sounds accurate, but is it really? Where would I get a statistic like that? And why would you believe it if I don't site my sources (besides the two I always run to to show that illegal immigrants are more powerful than anyone else in the US)?

You are missing a huge point about anchor babies. Their parents will NEVER be permanent residents OR citizens. Never. Their US citizen children will never be able to help their parents gain immigration benefits, at least how current immigration law is written today. You can read through INA 212 (pay close attention to sections (a)(9)(B) and (a)(9)(C) ) and you will see that their parents will most likely fall under one of these violations for whom waivers are available if your qualifying relative IS NOT A CHILD. A child cannot file a waiver for their parents. Their parents have no hope of immigrating through their children. So please, please, please correct yourself. It will make your extremely slanted biased slightly more believable. Immigration and Naturalization Act - Section 212 - Golish Law Office

Welfare fraud is a different issue.

By the way, that last immigration reform took place in 1996 (IIRIRA) and made immigration laws much more stringent. The 80s amnesty you keep talking about is old news and most people who support immigration reform do not support amnesty as what happened in the 80s. Listen what even the most liberal politicians talk about when they refer to immigration law reform. Most of them do not talk about amnesty. In fact a number of them would like to see better border security, including the current president. But let's not forget who wanted the guest worker program. His Holiness G. W. Bush.

More personally my husband is able to naturalize next year. He is not a citizen yet. He graduated high school in his home country but had to earn a GED when he came here. He no longer works in a restaurant and is preparing to take the SAT so he can try to get into college.

He did pay off his hospital bill. When I married him, he was still paying of the debt to the hospital. Like I said, it took a few years, but he did it. How does that make your statistics feel?

The other illegal immigrants you referred to have a very difficult time entering without inspection. In fact, most of them entered with inspection but misrepresented a visa and a passport. Misrepresentation is not easy, but is done frequently. A number of immigrants are also granted different types of non-immigrant visas and then simply overstay, thus making them "illegal". There is also the VWP (Visa Waiver Program) who much of the "Eurotrash" I talked about earlier enter through and then never leave.

Alabama, he can come and go to Guatemala as he pleases now that he is a legal permanent resident, again pardoned by a US citizen adjudicator who has strict guidelines on waiver approval. The waivers are allowed by Congresspeople who make laws.

Are you okay with people who enter legally but don't speak English? There are plenty of those. Is this an "if it ain't white it ain't right" type of situation?

Rick, the type of people that do not belong here are violent criminals or repeat offenders.

You do realize that people who overstay visas, despite their legal entry, are illegal immigrants too? This could be the IT guy from Asia with perfect English working right next to you. Yikes, get ICE on the phone right away. I see an Asian with an accent and I'm sure he's here illegally because he's not white.

And please, Rick, let's not talk about "asinine" bias because you clearly have your own. This is definitely the pot calling the kettle black. Or should I not call you black because that would highly offend you?
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Old 06-12-2010, 02:08 PM
 
358 posts, read 332,712 times
Reputation: 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by puki View Post
Iceman, I would like to see where you are getting your percentages. I can make up percentages like 73% of white people who earn less than $45, 00/yr live in trailers in south Georgia, and maybe it sounds accurate, but is it really? Where would I get a statistic like that? And why would you believe it if I don't site my sources (besides the two I always run to to show that illegal immigrants are more powerful than anyone else in the US)?

You are missing a huge point about anchor babies. Their parents will NEVER be permanent residents OR citizens. Never. Their US citizen children will never be able to help their parents gain immigration benefits, at least how current immigration law is written today. You can read through INA 212 (pay close attention to sections (a)(9)(B) and (a)(9)(C) ) and you will see that their parents will most likely fall under one of these violations for whom waivers are available if your qualifying relative IS NOT A CHILD. A child cannot file a waiver for their parents. Their parents have no hope of immigrating through their children. So please, please, please correct yourself. It will make your extremely slanted biased slightly more believable. Immigration and Naturalization Act - Section 212 - Golish Law Office

Welfare fraud is a different issue.

By the way, that last immigration reform took place in 1996 (IIRIRA) and made immigration laws much more stringent. The 80s amnesty you keep talking about is old news and most people who support immigration reform do not support amnesty as what happened in the 80s. Listen what even the most liberal politicians talk about when they refer to immigration law reform. Most of them do not talk about amnesty. In fact a number of them would like to see better border security, including the current president. But let's not forget who wanted the guest worker program. His Holiness G. W. Bush.

More personally my husband is able to naturalize next year. He is not a citizen yet. He graduated high school in his home country but had to earn a GED when he came here. He no longer works in a restaurant and is preparing to take the SAT so he can try to get into college.

He did pay off his hospital bill. When I married him, he was still paying of the debt to the hospital. Like I said, it took a few years, but he did it. How does that make your statistics feel?

The other illegal immigrants you referred to have a very difficult time entering without inspection. In fact, most of them entered with inspection but misrepresented a visa and a passport. Misrepresentation is not easy, but is done frequently. A number of immigrants are also granted different types of non-immigrant visas and then simply overstay, thus making them "illegal". There is also the VWP (Visa Waiver Program) who much of the "Eurotrash" I talked about earlier enter through and then never leave.

Alabama, he can come and go to Guatemala as he pleases now that he is a legal permanent resident, again pardoned by a US citizen adjudicator who has strict guidelines on waiver approval. The waivers are allowed by Congresspeople who make laws.

Are you okay with people who enter legally but don't speak English? There are plenty of those. Is this an "if it ain't white it ain't right" type of situation?

Rick, the type of people that do not belong here are violent criminals or repeat offenders.

You do realize that people who overstay visas, despite their legal entry, are illegal immigrants too? This could be the IT guy from Asia with perfect English working right next to you. Yikes, get ICE on the phone right away. I see an Asian with an accent and I'm sure he's here illegally because he's not white.

And please, Rick, let's not talk about "asinine" bias because you clearly have your own. This is definitely the pot calling the kettle black. Or should I not call you black because that would highly offend you?
I am tired of wasting time on you. My statistics are easily verifiable (for the links I did not give) copy and past the portion you are wondering about in google.. .and FYI I have yet to see you post anything backing your opinion (except for some path to citizenship post). The whole point is that "Feelings" are of no consequence, it's about facts and being logical. You only "Feel" a certain way, with nothing to prove what you are saying. Show me numbers- on the gangs, welfare, etc.. then we will talk. Lol... you are funny. The Asian overstaying his visa in America has a skill, very valuable one. Bet he's not draining the system. Nice try though. And the whole point of anchor babies.. I know their parents will not become citizens, and good for that! WHEN DID I EVER SAY THE PARENTS WOULD BECOME CITIZENS? the point is people cry "compassion" and "dont tear the families apart".. that is something I am tired of hearing. Now the parents DO benefit from food stamps, housing, etc because their American born children qualify and the house, food, cash, etc BENEFITS THE ENTIRE FAMILY UNIT-INCLUDING THE ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT PARENTS. You are so dense, but thanks for footing your husbands bill on our society, a brave woman you are.
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Old 06-12-2010, 02:28 PM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,313,536 times
Reputation: 326
Quote:
Originally Posted by puki View Post
Alabama, he can come and go to Guatemala as he pleases now that he is a legal permanent resident, again pardoned by a US citizen adjudicator who has strict guidelines on waiver approval. The waivers are allowed by Congresspeople who make laws.

Are you okay with people who enter legally but don't speak English? There are plenty of those. Is this an "if it ain't white it ain't right" type of situation?
I'm fine with anyone that comes here legally and under lawful terms. Although I feel immigration should be limited to only those that can make America a more law abiding, skillful, financially stable and competitive nation in a global economy. Importing third world immigrants without having those traits will not really achieve these ideals. And I do think that all immigrants should have a command of the English language that will allow them to be highly productive upon arrival, rather than becoming a burden to those already here trying to make a living. I also do not feel that America "needs" more immigrants. We have plenty of people now to care for.

America does not need more people to educate and spend it's resources on, but rather those that are already educated and will be resourceful to us when they arrive. We don't need more poor people to care for (we have plenty of those here now). We need those who have already acquired wealth and those that can create more wealth and stability for those of us here now.

At some point, a nation can only sustain so much poverty before it too will sink into poverty. There is a limit to what resources America has to draw from and what we can produce and supply to the world's poor, without becoming the very thing we're trying to overcome. You can only load a buildings foundation so much before it too will collapse. And then, what good will it be to those who seek it's support? To whom then will America prosper for if it has no longer wealth to give? A country is really only as strong, intelligent and resourceful as those that reside within it's borders. There is no reason to believe that bringing in uneducated, unskilled and unlawful immigrants from third world nations will cause them to blossom into productive American's, particularly if they want to hold on to their cultures that created the very poverty they seek to escape.

PS: What makes you think I would be against some one that does not have my skin color. Do you know what my skin color is?

Out of curiosity, I'll turn the tables : Are you by chance anti-white or against white Europeans in general?
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Old 06-12-2010, 02:36 PM
 
Location: east of my daughter-north of my son
1,928 posts, read 3,110,100 times
Reputation: 885
No one disputes the fact that there illegal aliens in this country who are decent, hard working, and trying to better their lives and their families. In fact the vast majority of them are.

The point is they are here illegally. Millions of them from many different countries.

This country has very serious issues right now and we cannot afford to see our medical institutions and our schools absorb the illegals. The majority pay no taxes yet live off the American taxpayer. It is just not feasible for us to continue to give them a free ride.

I said it before and I'll say it again. I know too many people who did it the right way when they immigrated here. It wasn't easy for many of them. It's a slap in their face for abiding by the rules of immigration.
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Old 06-12-2010, 04:25 PM
 
27 posts, read 19,909 times
Reputation: 13
Iceman, you are still wrong about state and federal welfare.

The income of illegal immigrants in the home must be claimed, but they are not counted for the purpose of receiving the benefits. While we know that there is welfare fraud (and I have never denied this, but of course you didn't see that), it is up to the states and federal government to follow up on cases of suspected fraud. The benefits go to the people in the house with a valid SSN - they are the only eligible recipients. That, and income is how benefits are calculated. If the parents abuse the benefits that have been given to their children it is a very sad thing.

Are you aware how long a waiting list for section 8 is? Literally years long in most areas.

Again, US citizen children born to illegal parents do not really "anchor" anything.

I understand you do not want to waste time anymore. Playing Sociology 101 with questionable or very limited statistics can be very exhausting, especially when you can only name two of your sources.

I can go based on Census statistics, ICE/USCIS statistics (here is a briefing on a recent ICE meeting http://www.ice.gov/doclib/foia/secur...sentations.pdf and your favorite, numbers!, are discussed!), and state demographic material, and the numbers you are quoting are largely inflated. I have never denied that there are illegal immigrants here who are in jail, violent, not helpful to overall society, etc. In fact, I have explicitly said things like that. Your numbers also appear to be based in statistics from the early 2000s and clearly, the immigration process has dramatically changed since then.

I have also said that the majority of lawmakers, who allowed my husband -- who so heavily and single-handedly burdened US society -- to become a legal permanent resident, do NOT support amnesty. This is extremely clear and has been consistent over the years.

Last thing, how do you know that skilled IT Asian worker next to you isn't burdening US society? Because he speaks better English than the guy from Honduras who cleans your office bathrooms at night? Is it because Asian guy came on a visa?

Alabama, what do you suggest the government do with US citizens who don't contribute, aren't highly skilled, have criminal history, etc? Should they be deported outside the US or perhaps sequestered in internment camps so that way the highly skilled, wealthy, "contributing" members of US society can do even better?

Simply because a person is a US citizen or a permanent resident does not equal success, procreating children that don't need an education, etc. Should we try to make sure our own citizens don't continue to overburden US society by limiting the amount of children people have or other measures to make sure the wealthy succeed more and the poor just eventually go away?

I can see your point about labor if I squint and tilt my head a little bit, however you fail to mention a huge aspect of job loss in the US today -- outsourcing. This is a huge problem and has certainly very negatively affected the US job market. I have been laid off twice due to outsourcing. Both times the company outsourced our jobs to the Philippines. So while capitalism has its charms, it frequently leaves its own US citizens and permanent residents eating its dust while someone overseas, usually in Asia (or even in Latin America), so the company higher ups can keep on earning while paying people less. Maybe it is just business as usual, but outsourcing has done a huge number on the US job market and has nothing to do with illegal immigration.

PS - Definitely not anti-white. Definitely anti-ignorance. So if you happen to be white and ignorant, then I'm not a fan, but not because of your skin color.



Catrick, thank you for sounding somewhat reasonable, but you have to realize that only a very small amount people are saying "amnesty". Amnesty is an extreme just like deporting everyone is an extreme.

The people who have immigrated legally or were granted residency (again, according to federal laws) have had it hard, I agree.
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