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Old 12-13-2007, 06:36 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,620,778 times
Reputation: 2983

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kele View Post
My ex-husband works for a waste water treatment plant--same place he's been since he was 18. Although he's now worked his way up into the lab and pre-treatment, he worked as a plant operator for years, a very nasty job.

Strange, but you know...there are to this day, still no illegal aliens doing this job.
I worked for Water Districts for many years, in wastewater treatment plants as well as water distribution. A modern treatment plant has relatively little "yuck" factor. (I never cleaned sewers, and that CAN get 'gross'). The reason there are few or no illegals in this work is that most positions require lots of certification, and don't they don't usually staff "off the street".
At the plant, we got frequent requests from contractors, etc., about "getting a job here". But the need to be certified and licensed turned most of them away.

 
Old 12-14-2007, 12:32 AM
 
9,742 posts, read 9,064,640 times
Reputation: 2049
Quote:
Originally Posted by User 2 View Post
Maybe you should watch a few more of those Honeymooner tapes, Norton and Ralph's story was essentially a depiction of Italian and Irish immigrants trying to make it in America.
Where are you getting this? Cramden and Norton don't sound either Irish or Italian, and neither were depicted as immigrants.
 
Old 12-14-2007, 05:42 AM
 
1,252 posts, read 726,912 times
Reputation: 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
Where are you getting this? Cramden and Norton don't sound either Irish or Italian, and neither were depicted as immigrants.
Not a student of early radio and tv, I see.......

Ah, but there's so much you don't see. I read quite a bit about it many years ago.

Did you know the set was a recreation of Gleason's tenement home from when he grew up?

Do some searching about Gleason and his immigrant roots and how that all got played into his shows.

The TV show was 'updated' or carried forward into the 50's era, and maybe it's possible some people were never aware what the original story was all about, and they wouldn't necessarily see the figurative or metaphorical underpinnings throughout the many different scenes if they didn't think to look.

It's no secret, it's really a story that more people should read about.

Especially if you're a Gleason fan, his story, and the story of his shows, is worth your time.

It has a lot to do with the poignancy and popularity of Gleason and his shows.
 
Old 12-14-2007, 08:54 AM
 
16,092 posts, read 35,796,018 times
Reputation: 6264
Whatever. I'm sure they did not sneak across the border and steal, commit fraud etc ..plus it took over 100 years for the Irish to reach several million in number..Mexicans have done that in less than a decade. Questions of assimilation, no?
 
Old 12-14-2007, 10:04 AM
 
9,742 posts, read 9,064,640 times
Reputation: 2049
Quote:
Originally Posted by User 2 View Post
Not a student of early radio and tv, I see.......
LOL. I'll leave the trivial studies to you.

Quote:
Ah, but there's so much you don't see.
The irony is blinding.

Quote:
I read quite a bit about it many years ago.
Good for you.

Quote:
Did you know the set was a recreation of Gleason's tenement home from when he grew up?

Do some searching about Gleason and his immigrant roots and how that all got played into his shows.

The TV show was 'updated' or carried forward into the 50's era, and maybe it's possible some people were never aware what the original story was all about, and they wouldn't necessarily see the figurative or metaphorical underpinnings throughout the many different scenes if they didn't think to look.

It's no secret, it's really a story that more people should read about.

Especially if you're a Gleason fan, his story, and the story of his shows, is worth your time.

It has a lot to do with the poignancy and popularity of Gleason and his shows.
Gleason's parents immigrated legally. Gleason was born in Brooklyn. The Honeymooners is fiction. Sorry, no connection to the subject matter.
 
Old 12-14-2007, 11:37 PM
 
1,252 posts, read 726,912 times
Reputation: 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
....no connection to the subject matter.
Oh, there's plenty of connections, ....you may not choose to relate those connections to your version of the subject matter, but that doesn't negate the connections.

What you call trivia is an intrinsic part of our history, you might not like the connections or wish not to be reminded of them, but that doesn't make them any less real.
 
Old 11-26-2009, 08:14 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,637,375 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kisss View Post
This is ridiculous.. No American wants to do hard humiliating work, and they should not have to ... we pay a lot of money to get an education, so we should have better jobs.

Lots of illegal immigrants pay taxes in the hope someday they will have a chance to become Americans.... if it was easy to be legal, most of them would have already done it. It's not just a matter of having a job. Companies are not willing to deal with loads of paperwork and expensive lawyers even for people who a better qualified than Americans... Plus, immigration rules only give visas to those who can offer things no other american can - like a certain degree, fluency in many languages, extensive experience in a certain domain, etc... It's not a fair game...

It's not helpful and not in the American spirit to judge people unfairly. We do need people who will do hard work. Construction pays $20/hour, it's rather good, but I don't want to do it because , at least in Texas, you have to be under the burning sun or out in the freezing cold doing it. It's horrible. No American would choose to do that.

I don't like the fat Mexican who cannot take care of his health, and then costs thousands of dollars to the health system because he can't keep his mouth shut and empty for a few hours. Like that kid who was so fat at such an young age , he needed a liver transplant at the age of 15.

I don't like Mexican kids who choose African Americans gangsters and hip hop idiots as role models. They only cost money to tax payers, promote crime, and make our cities dangerous.

I don't like the French idiot who is illegal in my country, and it's bad mouthing the US in my face. If France is so good, what the hell are they doing here ? if they hate capitalism so much, why they don't live in their sorry ass socialist country ?

I can give many examples of immigrants I don't like, but It's not fair to punish the ones who are here just to have a chance of having a decent life. There are immigrants who are decent people born in the wrong countries.

My point is: It is time to let them be legal. They will have to pay fees that would help our country in time of crisis. Also, they would be liable. Right now, they don't have rights, so they don't have to think about their future here since it is uncertain. Make them legal, and they have to pay their bills, pay for healthcare, etc just like all of us.

Something should be done to solve the problem. You have to close the boarders, and do something about the people who are here. It could be something like giving them green cards or citizenship, but make its validity depend on their behavior such as ability to pay the bills, clean records, pay taxes, follow the laws. That way you can keep only the ones who will not be exploiting the system.. those who are just looking for an opportunity...
Define 'humiliating work': trust me; if there are enough $$$ in front of it---------even college educated Americans/green card holders will do it.

As for the rest of your comments: we certainly do not need illegal aliens to do anything except leave the USA----------especially in this nasty recession.
 
Old 11-26-2009, 09:18 AM
 
14,813 posts, read 18,825,463 times
Reputation: 11777
Quote:
Originally Posted by Parkerpa View Post
#1- They dont carry any insurance.
#2- They dont pay taxes
#3- They collect state aide
#4- They wont speak english, so that costs
#5- THEY HAVE ZERO RESPECT FOR THE REST OF US!!
The good folks of Oklahoma have got an answer for these people.
It takes place Nov.1, 2007. We have had enough, and have passed a law
to not tolerate anymore.
Good luck buying a cheap house or finding a cheap hotel if all illegals get kicked out of here.

I bet the price of houses and hotels would instantly go up 50%
 
Old 11-26-2009, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Houston
3,567 posts, read 3,823,370 times
Reputation: 931
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dopo View Post
Good luck buying a cheap house or finding a cheap hotel if all illegals get kicked out of here.

I bet the price of houses and hotels would instantly go up 50%

There used to be Americans doing those very same jobs. And the prices were not more expensive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kisss View Post
This is ridiculous.. No American wants to do hard humiliating work, and they should not have to ... we pay a lot of money to get an education, so we should have better jobs.

Lots of illegal immigrants pay taxes in the hope someday they will have a chance to become Americans.... if it was easy to be legal, most of them would have already done it. It's not just a matter of having a job. Companies are not willing to deal with loads of paperwork and expensive lawyers even for people who a better qualified than Americans... Plus, immigration rules only give visas to those who can offer things no other american can - like a certain degree, fluency in many languages, extensive experience in a certain domain, etc... It's not a fair game...

It's not helpful and not in the American spirit to judge people unfairly. We do need people who will do hard work. Construction pays $20/hour, it's rather good, but I don't want to do it because , at least in Texas, you have to be under the burning sun or out in the freezing cold doing it. It's horrible. No American would choose to do that.

I don't like the fat Mexican who cannot take care of his health, and then costs thousands of dollars to the health system because he can't keep his mouth shut and empty for a few hours. Like that kid who was so fat at such an young age , he needed a liver transplant at the age of 15.

I don't like Mexican kids who choose African Americans gangsters and hip hop idiots as role models. They only cost money to tax payers, promote crime, and make our cities dangerous.

I don't like the French idiot who is illegal in my country, and it's bad mouthing the US in my face. If France is so good, what the hell are they doing here ? if they hate capitalism so much, why they don't live in their sorry ass socialist country ?

I can give many examples of immigrants I don't like, but It's not fair to punish the ones who are here just to have a chance of having a decent life. There are immigrants who are decent people born in the wrong countries.

My point is: It is time to let them be legal. They will have to pay fees that would help our country in time of crisis. Also, they would be liable. Right now, they don't have rights, so they don't have to think about their future here since it is uncertain. Make them legal, and they have to pay their bills, pay for healthcare, etc just like all of us.

Something should be done to solve the problem. You have to close the boarders, and do something about the people who are here. It could be something like giving them green cards or citizenship, but make its validity depend on their behavior such as ability to pay the bills, clean records, pay taxes, follow the laws. That way you can keep only the ones who will not be exploiting the system.. those who are just looking for an opportunity...
1. Just the way it's supposed to be. A very fair system.

2. Like I said before, Americans used to work in those fields. Don't make things up.

3. How many french illegals do you know? Probably 0. Why the hell would an European be here illegally? Because our health care system sucks? Because they would leave a wealthy country just to live in a ghetto here ? Yeah, that must be it
 
Old 11-26-2009, 10:07 AM
 
Location: somewhere in the woods
16,886 posts, read 12,546,843 times
Reputation: 5210
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsPR_USA View Post
Here’s the truth about immigrants, taxes and the economy:
· All individuals who work in the United States are required to pay federal income taxes. The only exception is if they are exempted due to their level of earnings, a provision of the tax code that results in no taxes, or a bilateral tax treaty.

· Significant total taxes are paid by immigrants. Immigrant households paid an estimated $133 billion in direct taxes to federal, state, and local governments in 1997, according to a study by Cato Institute economist Steve Moore.

· State level tax payments approximate natives. Immigrants in New York State pay over $18 billion a year in taxes, over 15 percent of the total, and roughly proportional to 3 their size in the state’s population, according to a study by the Urban Institute. Average annual tax payments by immigrants are approximately the same as natives—$6,300 for immigrants versus $6,500 natives.

· Long-run benefit. The National Academy of Sciences concluded that “Over the long run an additional immigrant and all descendants would actually save the taxpayers $80,000.”

It is not true that immigrants take jobs away from Americans. Here’s why:
· Immigrants do not increase unemployment among natives. A study by economists Richard Vedder, Lowell Gallaway, and Stephen Moore found that states with relatively high immigration actually experience low unemployment. The economists believed that it is likely immigration opens up many job opportunities for natives.

Here are the facts on immigration statistics:
· The number of immigrants living in the United States remains relatively small as a percentage of the total population. While the percentage of U.S. residents who are foreign-born is higher today than it was in 1970 (currently about 11 percent), it is still less than the 14.7 percent who were foreign-born in 1910.

· The annual rate of legal immigration is low by historical measures. Only 3 legal immigrants per 1,000 U.S. residents enter the United States each year, compared to 13 immigrants per 1,000 in 1913.

· The 2000 Census found that 22 percent of U.S. counties lost population between 1990 and 2000. Rather than “overrunning” America, immigrants tend to help revitalize demographically declining areas of the country, most notably urban centers.

Here are the facts on immigration statistics:
· The number of immigrants living in the United States remains relatively small as a percentage of the total population. While the percentage of U.S. residents who are foreign-born is higher today than it was in 1970 (currently about 11 percent), it is still less than the 14.7 percent who were foreign-born in 1910.

· The annual rate of legal immigration is low by historical measures. Only 3 legal immigrants per 1,000 U.S. residents enter the United States each year, compared to 13 immigrants per 1,000 in 1913.

· The 2000 Census found that 22 percent of U.S. counties lost population between 1990 and 2000. Rather than “overrunning” America, immigrants tend to help revitalize demographically declining areas of the country, most notably urban centers.

· Immigrants identify with America. “Nearly 70 percent of foreign-born Hispanics say they identify more with the United States than with their country of origin,” according to the New York Times/CBS News poll. Only 16 percent, including those here fewer than 5 years, said they identify more closely with their native country.

· Immigrants believe in the American Dream. A CNN/USA Today poll reported that more immigrants than natives believe that hard work and determination are the keys to success in America, and that fewer immigrants than natives believe that immigrants should be encouraged to “maintain their own culture more strongly.”


· Immigrant children learn English. In San Diego 90 percent of second-generation immigrant children speak English well or very well, according to a Johns Hopkins University study. In Miami the figure is 99 percent.

**Even Sebastian Lantos, of The Coalition of Hispanic Organizations says he, too thinks immigrants should learn English, but it's not a matter of not wanting to. “The reason they probably can’t do that is because they’re working 12-15 hours a day, from sunset to sunrise, and there’s nothing organized for them to go and study.”*******************

This is all from the COHO

it seems to me the OP was talking about Illegal immigrants, not legal immigrants in what you are talking about.
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