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Old 06-16-2010, 10:58 PM
 
Location: state of procrastination
3,487 posts, read 6,147,215 times
Reputation: 2883

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Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
It is a threat to our culture and langauge when millions of illegals keep coming here from mostly one ethnic group. Why do you think we have to press one for English and two for Spanish nowadays? Why do you think we have signs everywhere in both English and Spanish nowadays? It isn't because of Hispanic Americans because they are usually bi-lingual.

No, the government should not have to go through the expense of placating minority groups of people in this country by printing everything in their native langauges for them. Do you know how many different languages that is and the cost of it all? Immigrants need to know that English is our language and if they don't learn it or can't grasp it then they need to get interpreters at their own expense to help them. We are to PC in this country at the taxpayers expense and that is one of the reasont that some immigrants aren't assimilating lingually into our society is because we are pandering to them.

You last paragraph is just your opinion and irrelevant anyway. Most English speaking Americans can communicate with each other quite well. Sounds like you resent the fact that English is our national language.
Well what are you going to do if most of your customers prefer Spanish? It's just a business strategy to have a spanish option. I seriously doubt that it costs very much to print up these forms. It's also a legal issue - can invalidate contracts and agreements if somebody did not understand what they were signing - in which case the lawyers will rack up even more cost. I don't think it's really a PC issue as much as a practical issue.

I doubt that the american culture is at stake here just because of a few language options.

In Chinatown and Koreatown I'm sure they have signs and menus/forms in English - because they know they will have English customers too.
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Old 06-16-2010, 11:31 PM
 
3,863 posts, read 3,175,430 times
Reputation: 2466
Quote:
Originally Posted by miyu View Post
Well what are you going to do if most of your customers prefer Spanish? It's just a business strategy to have a spanish option. I seriously doubt that it costs very much to print up these forms. It's also a legal issue - can invalidate contracts and agreements if somebody did not understand what they were signing - in which case the lawyers will rack up even more cost. I don't think it's really a PC issue as much as a practical issue.

I doubt that the american culture is at stake here just because of a few language options.

In Chinatown and Koreatown I'm sure they have signs and menus/forms in English - because they know they will have English customers too.
If you go to Chinatown or Koreatown one would expect things to also be written in another language wouldn't they?I've been to Jon's supermarket and Jack in a Box in parts of LA and had trouble finding someone to help out that spoke English.If it was Juan's Market or Jose in a caja I could understand and expect this.
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Old 06-16-2010, 11:33 PM
 
Location: Murika
2,526 posts, read 2,511,992 times
Reputation: 1911
English is not my native language. However, when I am in the US (about twice a month), I expect to use English whenever I have a conversation or do business. For the past twenty years, this has held true - with one notable exception:

Upon arrival in Miami, I went to the South Beach Macy's (then Burdines) to purchase a watch with an alarm. The woman at the watch counter did not speak a single word of English.

The hotel I was staying at had a faulty door - I was present when the manager attempted to contact a company to repair the door. The first three companies he called had representatives who could not speak any English and who could not understand what the manager wanted.

I went to the hardware store to purchase a particular tester for electricity - the person behind the counter did not speak English.

Right before my flight, I tried to purchase a slice of pizza at a MIA terminal - I wanted a vegetarian pizza and asked the sales woman if she had one available. She did not speak English.

I was forced to purchase my watch speaking Spanish, ask for my tester in Spanish, and I had to ask the pizza lady in Spanish as well. Now, I am fortunate enough to speak several languages (Spanish, too), but I would hope that anyone who lives in the US at least tries to speak English - I don't care if it's the official language or not. Using English is certainly a generally accepted (and expected) convention.

BTW, these days, I don't even try to use English in Miami unless it is very clear that the person I am about to address is not Latino. I've given up...Can't get anything done down there unless you speak Spanish. I find that I actually get better service and a much nicer reception if I speak Spanish (I suppose it's a bit unexpected - I am tall, blond, blue-eyed and certainly not Latin no matter how delusional anybody is).
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Old 06-17-2010, 12:30 AM
 
Location: state of procrastination
3,487 posts, read 6,147,215 times
Reputation: 2883
Quote:
Originally Posted by antarez View Post
If you go to Chinatown or Koreatown one would expect things to also be written in another language wouldn't they?I've been to Jon's supermarket and Jack in a Box in parts of LA and had trouble finding someone to help out that spoke English.If it was Juan's Market or Jose in a caja I could understand and expect this.
Most things in Asian parts of town are English-translated anyways cuz not all Asians speak each other's tongue yet they all utilize each other's services. I've never been to a supermarket, restaurant, or Jack in the crack where los empleados no habla ingles. What part of town is this? Maybe I will go check it out.

If you want to be flexible in today's world it's best to be bilingual or trilingual. Look at Switzerland with 3 official languages. In Belgium you can't get a good job without knowing at least 2. India has over 18 languages many of which are accepted by the govt as official languages. I've absorbed rudimentary Spanish just from interacting with people though it is not one of the languages I have learned. But I certainly don't feel threatened by it.

Last edited by miyu; 06-17-2010 at 12:44 AM..
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Old 06-17-2010, 03:59 AM
 
Location: Earth
17,449 posts, read 23,050,692 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lentzr View Post
LET ME CHANGE THIS DEBATE AROUND -

Let's talk about individual states declaring English the official language of the state. There is an organization, I do not necessasily agree or disagree with them, called "US ENglish" that advocates the adoption of English as the official language of the U.S. On their website is a list of the 30 or so states that have declared English as the official language. What do you all think of individual states declaring English as the official language? How do you all feel that New mexico and Hawaii have more than one official state language?

LET's CHANGE THE DEBATE EVEN MORE

I believe that a couple of years ago, English was declared the "national" but not "official" language of the US? Does anyone have anything else to say about that?
Under the 10th Amendment states do have the power to declare an official language. I have no problem with a state declaring English as their official language.
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Old 06-17-2010, 04:44 AM
Yac
 
5,881 posts, read 6,310,906 times
If you have any questions (or comments) on other posters grammar/spelling, use direct messages to ask them. Here, making a personal discussion like this is not only off topic but also hijacking the thread.
Yac.
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Old 06-17-2010, 08:49 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,176,297 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by miyu View Post
Most things in Asian parts of town are English-translated anyways cuz not all Asians speak each other's tongue yet they all utilize each other's services. I've never been to a supermarket, restaurant, or Jack in the crack where los empleados no habla ingles. What part of town is this? Maybe I will go check it out.

If you want to be flexible in today's world it's best to be bilingual or trilingual. Look at Switzerland with 3 official languages. In Belgium you can't get a good job without knowing at least 2. India has over 18 languages many of which are accepted by the govt as official languages. I've absorbed rudimentary Spanish just from interacting with people though it is not one of the languages I have learned. But I certainly don't feel threatened by it.
As I have pointed out in here numerous times (perhaps you didn't read my posts) is that it is only Spanish that is being pushed on us in this country and that is due to the high influx of illegal alien Spanish speakers. I should learn Spanish to converse with illegal aliens? I don't think so! If you don't use a language you lose it and most Americans don't have any need to learn a foreign langauge because they would just lose it from non usage.
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Old 06-17-2010, 08:51 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,176,297 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by vamos View Post
English is not my native language. However, when I am in the US (about twice a month), I expect to use English whenever I have a conversation or do business. For the past twenty years, this has held true - with one notable exception:

Upon arrival in Miami, I went to the South Beach Macy's (then Burdines) to purchase a watch with an alarm. The woman at the watch counter did not speak a single word of English.

The hotel I was staying at had a faulty door - I was present when the manager attempted to contact a company to repair the door. The first three companies he called had representatives who could not speak any English and who could not understand what the manager wanted.

I went to the hardware store to purchase a particular tester for electricity - the person behind the counter did not speak English.

Right before my flight, I tried to purchase a slice of pizza at a MIA terminal - I wanted a vegetarian pizza and asked the sales woman if she had one available. She did not speak English.

I was forced to purchase my watch speaking Spanish, ask for my tester in Spanish, and I had to ask the pizza lady in Spanish as well. Now, I am fortunate enough to speak several languages (Spanish, too), but I would hope that anyone who lives in the US at least tries to speak English - I don't care if it's the official language or not. Using English is certainly a generally accepted (and expected) convention.

BTW, these days, I don't even try to use English in Miami unless it is very clear that the person I am about to address is not Latino. I've given up...Can't get anything done down there unless you speak Spanish. I find that I actually get better service and a much nicer reception if I speak Spanish (I suppose it's a bit unexpected - I am tall, blond, blue-eyed and certainly not Latin no matter how delusional anybody is).
Miami is a perfect example of non-assimilation by immigrants in this country. Do we really want to see this nationwide?
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Old 06-17-2010, 08:59 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,176,297 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by miyu View Post
Well what are you going to do if most of your customers prefer Spanish? It's just a business strategy to have a spanish option. I seriously doubt that it costs very much to print up these forms. It's also a legal issue - can invalidate contracts and agreements if somebody did not understand what they were signing - in which case the lawyers will rack up even more cost. I don't think it's really a PC issue as much as a practical issue.

I doubt that the american culture is at stake here just because of a few language options.

In Chinatown and Koreatown I'm sure they have signs and menus/forms in English - because they know they will have English customers too.
At the state and federal levels yes it does cost us a lot of tax dollars to print government documents in several languages. This needs to stop and it would no longer be required if we made English our "official" language.

I would be more comfortable if I were accomodated everywhere for my particular comfort zone needs also but then I don't expect to be treated special.

I thought I already explained to you how uncontrolled population growth by illegal immigration from mostly one lingual and cultural group is a threat to our identity. I mean why would that even have to be explained it is just common sense based on rational thought. This isn't about a "few" language options.
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Old 06-17-2010, 05:38 PM
 
11,145 posts, read 13,565,346 times
Reputation: 4209
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
You had different things to say in each of your posts and therefore I addressed each one of them. Sorry, you feel offended by that. I never made any personal attacks on you. If you think so why don't you point them out?

No, I am defining our identifying culture and language by what they are. We call it American culture. What you are describing by all these "immigrant" communities is what is called non-assimilation. Immigrants use to assimilate but our government has gotten so PC for decades now that division is more acceptable than cohesiveness. It is those things that will eventually tear our country apart. By the way, how does one become a citizen if they can't speak Engish? It is a requirement.

It isn't un-American to expect immigrants to learn our langauge. That doesn't mean they have to speak it all the time. Why even come here if one doesn't want to assimilate to our society?
1. We don't have a national language.

2. I don't know why you want government to force people to talk a language (yes, I know, you will allow them to talk whatever other language they want. Very gracious).

3. The free market will dictate what language people speak. If they lose enough business or job offers, they will learn the language to remedy that - more than likely English. Otherwise, none of our business.

4. I think discussing someone's ability to use a language she/he insists other people use is very much on topic.

5. It's not really your place to dictate what "American culture is". I couod look in 400 directions to get that answer, and they'd all be right.
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