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Old 06-22-2010, 06:48 AM
 
349 posts, read 394,109 times
Reputation: 161

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 12GO View Post
You also avoid bringing all of the 14th Admenment to this, most likely because to make your point, you do not want the part about the person is not able to be a citizen IF they are the result of criminal activity. Coming to the USA illegally is a criminal act! If the child suffers because of the parents, oh well. The facts are they are not legal citizens because of the parents illegal act. Now what do you have to say?
Here is what I quoted from the 14th Amendment

Quote:
1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
2. Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice-President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.
3. No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
4. The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.
5. The Congress shall have power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.

That is the entirety of the 14th Amendment. Nothing more and nothing less. I'm not sure what you're trying to say, and I'm not sure you are either because you persist in error.

I won't address the rest of your post because you are making up your own information. If you want to actually support your position, then you need reliable sources that actually state what you claim.
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Old 06-22-2010, 06:56 AM
 
349 posts, read 394,109 times
Reputation: 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by UpNort View Post
The federal government never went after Missouri when they passed their laws.

American Thinker Blog: Why sue Arizona and not Missouri?
Read the bill here

http://www.house.mo.gov/billtracking...ly/HB1549T.htm

Then read SB 1070 as amended by HB 2162 here

http://www.azleg.gov/alispdfs/council/SB1070-HB2162.PDF

Notice any differences? What is the state crime for unlawful presence in MO? Is there any difference when status investigation may commence?
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Old 06-22-2010, 07:54 AM
 
563 posts, read 442,456 times
Reputation: 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mauiwowie View Post
Can you present your reasons why you believe federal preemption to be invalid? It is well documented.

I do not buy the "nothing to hide" line. Innocent people are convicted of crimes and put to death by the state. Leaving that aside, there are privacy concerns for citizens and resident aliens.

You can not pass this law and magically have it only impact undocumented migrants. All statuses will be effected.

Of course, when talking about Constitutional protections, they apply to all persons in the US.
Well, as far as the federal preemption to be invalid? And the reference to it being well documented....At least something in that filed is documented and it's not the law breakers burdening our country.

If someone is here illegally, I really do not care if their feelings or their families and friends feelings are hurt. Break the law, not here legally, we don't need or want ya here.

If they don't like it, let them call Obama.....he likes to bow down to maroons and appologize to them.

How alone is he going to feel after November 2nd?

I guess Michele will no longer be proud anymore. They have a few more months to spend money that shouldn't be spent.

It is time re retake our Country back. It sickens me to go into a city like Miami and see it named "Little Cuba" or "Little Haiti"....it is Miami, USA. If you want the Cuba title or any other, then go back to your country if life is that much better.

What also sickened me was I was in a retail store, customer goes up to the security guy at the front of the store and in plain English asked if he speaks spanish to be told no, he didn't.

She then scolds him like a kid saying you are in Miami and need to speak spanish. I was ready to chime in, but he did it before I could and said Ma'am, we are in the United States and we speak English here. Now, she spoke perfect English too. She then asks for the manager who happened to be Cuban too as she spoke in her language to him and then she left the store upset.

She had the nerve to ask him for a discount because he didn't speak Spanish and told her to take a walk.

I was proud to be an American at that moment!! We need more of that!

New birthday game....Pin the Tail on the Illegal!!!
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Old 06-22-2010, 08:23 AM
 
Location: Chicagoland
41,314 posts, read 38,479,833 times
Reputation: 7106
Sources: Justice Department to File Lawsuit Against Arizona Immigration Law, Likely Next Week - Political Punch

Quote:
Obama administration sources tell ABC News that Attorney General Eric Holder is expected to file a lawsuit against the state of Arizona for its immigration law, likely next week.
I guess he thinks pandering to the hispanic community will help him in the fall if he goes ahead with the lawsuit.

The only problem - the nation seems to be on the other side of the issue.

Excellent idea, barry.
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Old 06-22-2010, 08:46 AM
 
349 posts, read 394,109 times
Reputation: 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy Storm View Post
Well, as far as the federal preemption to be invalid? And the reference to it being well documented....At least something in that filed is documented and it's not the law breakers burdening our country.

If someone is here illegally, I really do not care if their feelings or their families and friends feelings are hurt. Break the law, not here legally, we don't need or want ya here.

If they don't like it, let them call Obama.....he likes to bow down to maroons and appologize to them.

How alone is he going to feel after November 2nd?

I guess Michele will no longer be proud anymore. They have a few more months to spend money that shouldn't be spent.

It is time re retake our Country back. It sickens me to go into a city like Miami and see it named "Little Cuba" or "Little Haiti"....it is Miami, USA. If you want the Cuba title or any other, then go back to your country if life is that much better.

What also sickened me was I was in a retail store, customer goes up to the security guy at the front of the store and in plain English asked if he speaks spanish to be told no, he didn't.

She then scolds him like a kid saying you are in Miami and need to speak spanish. I was ready to chime in, but he did it before I could and said Ma'am, we are in the United States and we speak English here. Now, she spoke perfect English too. She then asks for the manager who happened to be Cuban too as she spoke in her language to him and then she left the store upset.

She had the nerve to ask him for a discount because he didn't speak Spanish and told her to take a walk.

I was proud to be an American at that moment!! We need more of that!

New birthday game....Pin the Tail on the Illegal!!!
I said nothing about anyone's feelings, however, you spent some effort explaining yours.

I get it. You want to re-take the country back. What does that mean?

You have problems with cultural and ethnic neighborhoods? Is that what you're saying? Why only name Little Cuba and not all the others.

You don't like people speaking in Spanish? So what? We still have the 1st Amendment. Let me be clear that from the limited info and your own viewpoint, the lady you mention was rude and her behavior unseemly. It does not mean I approve of such disrespect.
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Old 06-22-2010, 04:59 PM
 
563 posts, read 442,456 times
Reputation: 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by mauiwowie View Post
I said nothing about anyone's feelings, however, you spent some effort explaining yours.

I get it. You want to re-take the country back. What does that mean?

You have problems with cultural and ethnic neighborhoods? Is that what you're saying? Why only name Little Cuba and not all the others.

You don't like people speaking in Spanish? So what? We still have the 1st Amendment. Let me be clear that from the limited info and your own viewpoint, the lady you mention was rude and her behavior unseemly. It does not mean I approve of such disrespect.
Taking back our country is just like it says. We are too busy making sure we do not hurt other countries feelings. If they don't like it, they can go back to wherever it is they came from. I do not like them renaming an american city after another country.

If people want to speak their native languages, that is fine, I have no problems with that. What I do have is a problem when they come into my country and demand that I speak their language.

I was out shopping with my wife who needed some "tools of her trade" and it was owned by a hispanic family. Because my wife did not speak spanish, nobody would help her, even though they did speak English.

I was in a poker tourney, well a qualifier game first and there were people playing that spoke different languages and was happy when they were told when the cards are in play that they may ONLY speak English. They tested the waters and were disqualified right then and there after one warning.

I don't mind multi-cultural anything. I do have a big problem when they want to change this country to mirror their own. If they love their country that much then like Obama said so elequently in his little speech, Adios Amigos!!!!!!

November 2nd, call ahead for your trash pick up. AMERICA is coming home!!!!!
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Old 06-22-2010, 11:34 PM
 
Location: Eastern Missouri
3,054 posts, read 5,029,987 times
Reputation: 1377
Quote:
Originally Posted by mauiwowie View Post
Here is what I quoted from the 14th Amendment

Quote:
1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
2. Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice-President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.
3. No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
4. The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.
5. The Congress shall have power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.

That is the entirety of the 14th Amendment. Nothing more and nothing less. I'm not sure what you're trying to say, and I'm not sure you are either because you persist in error.

I won't address the rest of your post because you are making up your own information. If you want to actually support your position, then you need reliable sources that actually state what you claim.

why is it that you continue to skip this line;
" except for participation in rebellion, or other crime,"
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Old 06-23-2010, 09:06 AM
 
349 posts, read 394,109 times
Reputation: 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by 12GO View Post
why is it that you continue to skip this line;
" except for participation in rebellion, or other crime,"
Do you always do this? Make up your own info? You said I didn't include all the 14th Amendment when I clearly had and are again claiming I'm doing something I'm not.

You are inventing your own reality.

Your 1st post on the topic

Quote:
Originally Posted by 12GO View Post
for all the legal "scholars" on here, I havea simple question;

Why is it supposed to be ok for the illegals to have babies here and that baby get citizenship when the 14TH Admendment CLEARLY states those babies are not elgible because their parents are involved in a crime against the US? Kinda throws a wrench in that sellout idea that anchor babies are a reason to allow the parents, the baby or their siblings to even stay now doesn't it!!!!
Round 'em up and ship them ALL out!
Just so we are clear. You asserted that the 14th Amendment prohibits children from being citizens based on the 14th Amendment. Right?

I then quoted the entirety of the 14th Amendment 2X.

The relevant portion about citizenship is Section. 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

That is the entirety of the citizenship clause. I've left out the rest of sec 1 because I've already quoted it.

You are focused on Section. 2. Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.

I wish I had your creative flair.

This section does not modify Section 1. It deals with Congressional Representation. It modified the horrid 3/5 rule and ensured that representation would be divided among all the population (excluding Indians nontaxed). Further, it included language to punish those states that did not let all males aged 21 or older vote by reducing their population accordingly.

The specific provision you wrote about denies the right to vote on a state provisioned basis for felonies.

Let's be clear. Section 2 has nothing whatsoever to do with Section 1. The only 14th Amendment language dealing with citizenship is Section 1 and it gives citizenship to everyone born within US jurisdiction.
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Old 06-26-2010, 04:09 AM
 
3,849 posts, read 3,162,024 times
Reputation: 2451
Obama administration poised to challenge Arizona immigration law - latimes.com An Update:

Time for Americans to stand up and Impeach this COWARD TRAITOR OBAMA!!!!

With record foreclosures, bankruptcies and Unemployment He defends and wants to reward Foreign invader criminal parasites. Instead of Jobs for Americans as His priority He is hell bent on ruining America!!!

This Coward's word is worthless,What a liar after telling Ari. Gov. Jan Brewer He will work with Her and Arizona, He lies in Her face and stabs Her and Arizona's citizens in the back. It's high time to Impeach this Traitor that undermines America's Laws and act against America's Citizens.
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Old 06-27-2010, 02:18 AM
 
Location: Eastern Missouri
3,054 posts, read 5,029,987 times
Reputation: 1377
Quote:
Originally Posted by antarez View Post
Obama administration poised to challenge Arizona immigration law - latimes.com An Update:

Time for Americans to stand up and Impeach this COWARD TRAITOR OBAMA!!!!

With record foreclosures, bankruptcies and Unemployment He defends and wants to reward Foreign invader criminal parasites. Instead of Jobs for Americans as His priority He is hell bent on ruining America!!!

This Coward's word is worthless,What a liar after telling Ari. Gov. Jan Brewer He will work with Her and Arizona, He lies in Her face and stabs Her and Arizona's citizens in the back. It's high time to Impeach this Traitor that undermines America's Laws and act against America's Citizens.
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