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Old 10-14-2010, 01:44 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,824,744 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackandproud View Post
Your post act as if this is something new. That this is NOT the ONLY administration that looked to provide amnesty to illegals. For the record, there are those who are here illegally or past their visa stay that are working, that are paying taxes, property and business owners and have commited no crimes. So before you go on these "Obama is trying to give a free pass" and make it appear as if this is something new, I recommend you check the archives on Presidents with the help of the house and Senate that allowed this in the first place.
While illegal immigration has been an issue for many years, the current administration is hell-bent on granting amnesty, and refuses to enforce our laws. We can’t dwell on what prior administrations did or did not do. Obama is our current president, and it is now his responsibility.

As for illegals “committing no crimes” if they are here working, they are either using a stolen or fake SSN. Those who overstayed visas have also failed to comply with our laws. They are as illegal as those who crossed the border without permission.
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Old 10-14-2010, 01:51 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,310 posts, read 18,897,953 times
Reputation: 6517
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackandproud View Post
Your post act as if this is something new. That this is NOT the ONLY administration that looked to provide amnesty to illegals. For the record, there are those who are here illegally or past their visa stay that are working, that are paying taxes, property and business owners and have commited no crimes. So before you go on these "Obama is trying to give a free pass" and make it appear as if this is something new, I recommend you check the archives on Presidents with the help of the house and Senate that allowed this in the first place.
Please show me where I said it is something new. Obviously I did not. This thread is about current approach.
Can you please provide me with anything I posted in this thread was not accurate.
Other admins have looked for ways of providing an amnesty. Reagan actually provided an amnesty and it has been shown to be a huge mistake.
Because others have done something wrong does not make it acceptable or less wrong just because it was done before.
In fact given the current economy it can be argued to be more wrong.
Because someone over stayed or is paying taxes does not make it less a crime or less wrong. It simply means they have not been caught. Those who have over stayed a VISA and are working in fact make it worse. They are more likely to be doing a job a citizen is qualified to do and would do if they had the chance.
You can defend Obama all you like. I would suggest that you be equally critical of his decisions as you would someone you disagree with. Accountability is the only tool we as citizens have to keep elected officials in check. Hardline support is what politicians count on to keep them in power. Isn't this how GWB got away with so much? What about the stimulous package? How did we waste so many billions? Because they counted on hardline support. GWB gets a lot of blame and he deserves it. Lets not forget many of the things that caused our current woes were whole heartedly supported by the otherside. Lets not forget that the Dems controled congress GWB's last 2 years. Lets not forget that bad decision making isn't a partisan issue.
Any form of amnesty for illegals is a mistake. Rewarding criminals for their crimes only serves to entice others into doing the same thing. Reagan's amnesty is proof enough of this.
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Old 10-14-2010, 01:54 PM
 
6,899 posts, read 6,379,721 times
Reputation: 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
While illegal immigration has been an issue for many years, the current administration is hell-bent on granting amnesty, and refuses to enforce our laws. We can’t dwell on what prior administrations did or did not do. Obama is our current president, and it is now his responsibility.

Your statement is extremely generic. Considering deportation under this administration refutes your statement completely on the inactions and dedication by Homeland Security and ICE. Again as far as amnesty, although you would like to completely forget history, can't its out there. Amnesty is NOT a new method, in fact until the end of Bush reign even the beloved Republicans were trying to figure out the so called "path to citizenship".

As for illegals “committing no crimes” if they are here working, they are either using a stolen or fake SSN. Those who overstayed visas have also failed to comply with our laws. They are as illegal as those who crossed the border without permission.

There are Citizens who fail to comply with our laws as well.
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Old 10-14-2010, 02:01 PM
 
6,899 posts, read 6,379,721 times
Reputation: 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
Please show me where I said it is something new. Obviously I did not. This thread is about current approach.
Can you please provide me with anything I posted in this thread was not accurate.
Other admins have looked for ways of providing an amnesty. Reagan actually provided an amnesty and it has been shown to be a huge mistake.
Because others have done something wrong does not make it acceptable or less wrong just because it was done before.
In fact given the current economy it can be argued to be more wrong.
Because someone over stayed or is paying taxes does not make it less a crime or less wrong. It simply means they have not been caught. Those who have over stayed a VISA and are working in fact make it worse. They are more likely to be doing a job a citizen is qualified to do and would do if they had the chance.
You can defend Obama all you like. I would suggest that you be equally critical of his decisions as you would someone you disagree with. Accountability is the only tool we as citizens have to keep elected officials in check. Hardline support is what politicians count on to keep them in power. Isn't this how GWB got away with so much? What about the stimulous package? How did we waste so many billions? Because they counted on hardline support. GWB gets a lot of blame and he deserves it. Lets not forget many of the things that caused our current woes were whole heartedly supported by the otherside. Lets not forget that the Dems controled congress GWB's last 2 years. Lets not forget that bad decision making isn't a partisan issue.
Any form of amnesty for illegals is a mistake. Rewarding criminals for their crimes only serves to entice others into doing the same thing. Reagan's amnesty is proof enough of this.

Take a breath...My statement AGAIN is...Your post acts as if "amnesty" is something new and can only be associated to this administration. As far as the rest of your diatribe. NO WHERE did I indicate that it was right or wrong that Reagan gave blanket amnesty of 5 million which could have included violent felons. No where in my post did I indicate that Obama should give blanket amnesty to 11 million including violent felons. What my post did indicate was everyone is in a uproard with this Administration concerning a debate as well as the possible path forward that both sides have been trying to circumvent for years. I would really be interested to know how YOU believe 11 million who are here illegally are supposed to be ushered out of the country and who will pay for it?
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Old 10-14-2010, 02:05 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,310 posts, read 18,897,953 times
Reputation: 6517
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackandproud View Post
There are Citizens who fail to comply with our laws as well.
The difference is they are in fact citizens. There are employees of companies that violate policy but would a company hire someone off the street that came to the interview knowingly violating policies? Doubtful as that would indicate what kind of employee they would be.
This is an old excuse well citizens break laws too. As if this some how justifies an illegals activities and crimes.
If an immigrants first statement upon entering is ********* and your laws are they really the kind of immigrants we would want to reward with a VISA ?
If an immigrant opts to violate the terms of their VISA are they the kind we want to keep?
OR
Do we want those who respect our laws enough to obey them?
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Old 10-14-2010, 02:11 PM
 
6,899 posts, read 6,379,721 times
Reputation: 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
The difference is they are in fact citizens. There are employees of companies that violate policy but would a company hire someone off the street that came to the interview knowingly violating policies? Doubtful as that would indicate what kind of employee they would be.
This is an old excuse well citizens break laws too. As if this some how justifies an illegals activities and crimes.
If an immigrants first statement upon entering is ********* and your laws are they really the kind of immigrants we would want to reward with a VISA ?
If an immigrant opts to violate the terms of their VISA are they the kind we want to keep?
OR
Do we want those who respect our laws enough to obey them?

First of all NO not making an excuse, just a statement. So your stating that its alright for a CITIZEN to break the law because they have the right too as a citizen . I would much rather have a law abiding person who over stayed their visa living next door to me than a drug dealer or child molestor. Let me be clear, I don't believe in blanket amnesty, but I also do not believe in removing a young person from this country that was bought over by their parents. I also do not believe that illegals should recieve welfare, social security or medicaid.
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Old 10-14-2010, 02:12 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,824,744 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackandproud View Post
Your statement is extremely generic. Considering deportation under this administration refutes your statement completely on the inactions and dedication by Homeland Security and ICE. Again as far as amnesty, although you would like to completely forget history, can't its out there. Amnesty is NOT a new method, in fact until the end of Bush reign even the beloved Republicans were trying to figure out the so called "path to citizenship".


There are Citizens who fail to comply with our laws as well.
If you check Obama’s deportation record, you will discover that while he may have increased deportations of “violent criminals” he actually has placed a moratorium on deportations of so-called non-criminal illegals. It is nothing but political posturing.

I don’t recall anyone on this thread or elsewhere on this forum EVER stating that amnesty is a new phenomenon. Who hasn’t heard of the 1986 mass amnesty? In any case, that is history. We must deal with our current crisis, and another amnesty would be an even greater tragedy.

As for “beloved Republicans” you have so barked up the wrong tree.

Yes, many citizens are criminals. So what?
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Old 10-14-2010, 02:18 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,158,884 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackandproud View Post
Take a breath...My statement AGAIN is...Your post acts as if "amnesty" is something new and can only be associated to this administration. As far as the rest of your diatribe. NO WHERE did I indicate that it was right or wrong that Reagan gave blanket amnesty of 5 million which could have included violent felons. No where in my post did I indicate that Obama should give blanket amnesty to 11 million including violent felons. What my post did indicate was everyone is in a uproard with this Administration concerning a debate as well as the possible path forward that both sides have been trying to circumvent for years. I would really be interested to know how YOU believe 11 million who are here illegally are supposed to be ushered out of the country and who will pay for it?
We have stated over and over that there is no need to mass deport. With all the incentives removed for them to remain here they will self-deport and there are no costs associated with that.
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Old 10-14-2010, 02:19 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,824,744 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackandproud View Post
First of all NO not making an excuse, just a statement. So your stating that its alright for a CITIZEN to break the law because they have the right too as a citizen . I would much rather have a law abiding person who over stayed their visa living next door to me than a drug dealer or child molestor. Let me be clear, I don't believe in blanket amnesty, but I also do not believe in removing a young person from this country that was bought over by their parents. I also do not believe that illegals should recieve welfare, social security or medicaid.
Criminal behavior, regardless of the immigration status of the perpetrator, is wrong, period. Why are you defending illegal alien criminals?

I hate to break it to you, but as a black person, the same people you so fervently defend, once legalized, will throw you under the bus in a hot second. Wake up! They are using black people to accomplish their goals.
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Old 10-14-2010, 02:20 PM
 
6,899 posts, read 6,379,721 times
Reputation: 2013
[quote=Benicar;16261318]If you check Obama’s deportation record, you will discover that while he may have increased deportations of “violent criminals” he actually has placed a moratorium on deportations of so-called non-criminal illegals. It is nothing but political posturing.



This is incorrect.

non violent illegal aliens ARE being deported. Here in NJ, its the non violent folks that are deported more than anyone else. So again, how has Obama NOT enforced the immigration laws?
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