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Old 07-06-2007, 02:08 PM
 
Location: Tennessee/Michigan
27,996 posts, read 46,373,100 times
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OTTAWA (AFP) - US software behemoth Microsoft Corp. said Thursday it would soon open an office in Canada, lamenting tough immigration rules in the United States that make it difficult to hire foreign staff.

"It is about recruiting the best and brightest, and right now, the majority are coming from overseas," Marc Seaman, a spokesman for the world's biggest software company, told The Globe and Mail newspaper.

Harsh US immigration rules force Microsoft to open shop in Canada - Yahoo! News (broken link)
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:16 PM
 
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There are plenty of best and brightest right here in the USA. Microsoft just wants the best and brightest at a much lower wage.
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Old 07-06-2007, 06:33 PM
 
Location: Ohio, but moving to El Paso, TX August/September
431 posts, read 1,522,978 times
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Not really. My husband's field (not computer related) is mainly foreigners. Most Americans do not have the math skills to do the job so the employers get the most qualified people. In his field, foreigners are paid the same as Americans. It's not a money issue, it's a matter of skills needed for the job.
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Old 07-06-2007, 07:02 PM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,800 posts, read 7,690,528 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emjbulls View Post
Not really. My husband's field (not computer related) is mainly foreigners. Most Americans do not have the math skills to do the job so the employers get the most qualified people. In his field, foreigners are paid the same as Americans. It's not a money issue, it's a matter of skills needed for the job.
You are so wrong. My husband teaches at the University of California in Irvine. The focus at this particular university is the maths and sciences. There are umpteen American kids and return to learners graduating with math and science degrees who cannot get work in their fields because they've been squeezed out of the job market due to outsourcing. Don't tell me there are not enough talented and degreed Americans. There are. There are just no employers who want to pay them what they are worth.

It's that old slave labor mentality and the reason why illegal immigration in this country has reached such alarming numbers. Corporations want something for nothing and there seem to be plenty of plebians willing to give it to them at the expense of the American job market.
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Old 07-06-2007, 07:21 PM
 
Location: Ohio, but moving to El Paso, TX August/September
431 posts, read 1,522,978 times
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So...my husband is a finance professor. The American kids cannot do the math that is required for his type of job and don't have the kind of gmat scores that enable them to get into Ph.D programs in finance. His field is dominated by foreigners..and mind you, this tends to be one of the top paid departments across most schools. Assistant profs in finance make more than full and chaired profs in other departments. Foreigners do not hold the salaries down in that field. The foreigners are hired because the US school system utterly fails it students in mathematical education and the parents fail their children by not supplementing what the schools fail to teach.

When I was in grad school, I was an Econ TA. It was pathetic the amount of kids who could not solve simple supply and demand equations. Sorry, but the best students were rarely the Americans, and that was from first hand experience in a university setting.
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Old 07-06-2007, 07:33 PM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,800 posts, read 7,690,528 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emjbulls View Post
So...my husband is a finance professor. The American kids cannot do the math that is required for his type of job and don't have the kind of gmat scores that enable them to get into Ph.D programs in finance. His field is dominated by foreigners..and mind you, this tends to be one of the top paid departments across most schools. Assistant profs in finance make more than full and chaired profs in other departments. Foreigners do not hold the salaries down in that field. The foreigners are hired because the US school system utterly fails it students in mathematical education and the parents fail their children by not supplementing what the schools fail to teach.

When I was in grad school, I was an Econ TA. It was pathetic the amount of kids who could not solve simple supply and demand equations. Sorry, but the best students were rarely the Americans, and that was from first hand experience in a university setting.
Well, they are making the grade at UCI, rated one of the highest Universities in the country in the areas of science and math. Oh, suprise, look how many doctors and scientists UCLA is turning out...again, one of the highest rated Universities in the country.

Guess your first hand experience out there in Ohio is a little different than what we're experiencing on the west coast. Perhaps that's because all of the really intelligent kids are opting for the University of California experience.
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Old 07-06-2007, 07:33 PM
 
2,432 posts, read 6,005,685 times
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Originally Posted by Kele View Post
You are so wrong. My husband teaches at the University of California in Irvine. The focus at this particular university is the maths and sciences. There are umpteen American kids and return to learners graduating with math and science degrees who cannot get work in their fields because they've been squeezed out of the job market due to outsourcing. Don't tell me there are not enough talented and degreed Americans. There are. There are just no employers who want to pay them what they are worth.

It's that old slave labor mentality and the reason why illegal immigration in this country has reached such alarming numbers. Corporations want something for nothing and there seem to be plenty of plebians willing to give it to them at the expense of the American job market.

When I lived in Sacramento I saw the same thing. I had neighbors that were in the IT field, and they were replaced by H1B labor. One guy was actually told he could keep his job if he took a substantial pay cut.

In addition, did you see the segment on Dateline regarding this very subject? One point they made is that the cheap labor coming in has had such a huge effect on the field many have left and are pursuing work in other occupations.
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Old 07-06-2007, 07:36 PM
 
Location: Ohio, but moving to El Paso, TX August/September
431 posts, read 1,522,978 times
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Yep, I guess you got me. Your California wisdom is just to much for my little mind to handle.

And for the record, I went to grad school in NY. But people in NY must be dumb too because they can't hold a candle to your well thought out arguments against immigration, legal or illegal.
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Old 07-06-2007, 08:29 PM
 
2,432 posts, read 6,005,685 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emjbulls View Post
Yep, I guess you got me. Your California wisdom is just to much for my little mind to handle.

And for the record, I went to grad school in NY. But people in NY must be dumb too because they can't hold a candle to your well thought out arguments against immigration, legal or illegal.
Actually illegal aliens aren't immigrants, they are criminals.

But Microsoft only wants to hire lower wage employees because it lowers their operating expenses, which increases their bottom line, which in turn means a higher profit. Government usually likes it for similar reasons. The more illegals that are hired, the more money that gets sent to the federal treasury.
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Old 07-07-2007, 12:55 AM
 
3,748 posts, read 7,216,574 times
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It does not look good for American IT workers. Some people believe that other software companies will follow Microsoft's lead. Since no one, not even the government can force companies to stay in the US, it is time to look for solutions instead playing the blame game. Let's look at two scenarios.

Visas are granted:

1. Companies stay but hire foreign workers
2. Americans lose jobs.
3. Foreign workers have to spend on housing, food, gas, etc., thus supporting the economy. I believe they have to pay taxes also.

Visas are not granted:

1. Companies move overseas and hire foreign workers
2. American workers lose jobs.
3. Economy does not get anything; uncle sam does not get tax revenue.

I would have to go with the first choice. American workers will lose jobs either way. If companies stay in the US, some of that income earned by foreign workers goes to support the economy.
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