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Old 11-10-2010, 03:46 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,144,640 times
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[quote=Agnapostate;16602838]

Actually, it first has an impact on the moral legitimacy of national sovereignty. Since theft is not a morally legitimate means of property acquisition, it is nonsensical to say that it is wrong to “steal” from a thief. On a somewhat related note, there is tremendous irony in white Europeans calling American Indians “illegal aliens.”

The Mestizos of Mexico coming here illegally are not "American Indians" (U.S. indigenous tribes) they are Mexicans Indians. In fact they are part Spanish-European so they could be considered invaders and illegal on this continent just as you are claiming those of other European ancestry are.

 
Old 11-11-2010, 12:04 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,807,269 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
There are none so blind as those who refuse to see. While anecdotal incidents could be cited to support one view or another (and I have cited an anecdotal incident to support my claims simply to demonstrate that fact to you), the only information about the nature of generalities that can be analyzed is derived from large data sets. There have been seven sources posted for you to consider. Where is your refutation? Where is your counter-argument? Where is your citation of superior empirical research? At best, you made an attempt to criticize data collection deficiencies, but could not elaborate on that.
According to you, unless an exhaustive study is conducted, at best, the data can only be considered anecdotal. Given that data on illegal aliens has only recently been compiled, your studies fail to fulfill your “large data sets” prerequisite. Hence, they have no relevance to the topic of this thread. Furthermore, we are not discussing Hispanic “immigrants,” we are discussing illegal aliens. Until you recognize this salient distinction, a debate of the issue is futile.

Come back when you can provide a “large data set” on the criminality of illegal aliens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
Actually, it first has an impact on the moral legitimacy of national sovereignty. Since theft is not a morally legitimate means of property acquisition, it is nonsensical to say that it is wrong to “steal” from a thief. On a somewhat related note, there is tremendous irony in white Europeans calling American Indians “illegal aliens.”
When has anyone on this forum referred to Native Americans as illegal aliens? Please quote the posts, or retract your ridiculous comment. If you are implying that Mexican illegal aliens are the rightful occupants of this land, you are not only delusional, but in need of an in depth history lesson.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
Are you a social Darwinist? If might makes right, and genocide and theft are legitimate mechanisms of property transfer, why are you crying about this murder? The victim “lost” -- deal with it.
This, by far, is the most despicable post I have read on this forum in a very long time. Three young people were viciously murdered, and the lone survivor will live with these horrific memories forever. Yet, you have the temerity to justify this due to your warped belief that it’s an acceptable retribution for the European conquest of this land. How sick.

I’m a staunch anti-illegal, but I would NEVER relish the thought of illegal aliens being murdered, let alone try to trivialize it.

Obviously, your hatred is so intense you can’t even condemn these senseless murders. I suppose you even celebrate when illegals rape innocent, defenseless children. After all, a Native American must have been raped by the settlers. Even the most rabid DREAMies don’t generally exhibit this vile level of callousness. At this moment, if I spoke my mind I would be banned, so I will leave it at that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
And each incident of Dr. Quinones saving a life is REAL, and lives have been saved. Are citizens now expendable, that you would include physicians and various aid workers in deportation efforts? Do you now see what an utter failure your attempts to cite anecdotes are? Anecdotes that illustrate the opposite point can be directed right back at you. It’s for that reason that people interested in the scientific method turn to empirical research.
This anomalous illegal is not representative of millions of illiterate, reprobate invaders. To suggest otherwise, is sheer lunacy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
I’d expect not. Border “executions” imply deliberate coordination by government personnel, whereas murders committed by individuals are uncoordinated and separate actions, that do not reflect an organized policy decision.
These murders were not only “coordinated,” they were an “organized policy decision” of the well-established MS-13 gang. The scumbags were instructed to kill as a condition of their gang initiation, and their assignment was executed accordingly. Regardless, murder is murder, and only the morally bankrupt condone such acts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
Do you think the family and friends of Dr. Quinones’s patients give a damn about legal status or your usage of the appellations “illegal alien” or “invader”? The fact that you are willing to discount even one life saving to support your agenda, speaks volumes.
Not that it’s relevant, but how many lives has the good doctor saved? I assure you, they pale by comparison to the lives destroyed by illegal aliens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
No, biased reporting is aggressive over reporting and hosting of pundits that freely assert lies about immigrants causing more crime than native-born people, which is false. Again, where is your refutation of the statistical analyses that have been cited?
There you go again with “immigrants.” Apparently you made a wrong turn, because this is the Illegal Immigration Forum. Again, until you can provide comprehensive data on illegal alien criminality, there is absolutely nothing to refute.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
"What ifs"? I cited an anecdotal account, unless you are alleging that it is fraudulent and not a factually accurate story. Again, where is your refutation of the seven sources that flatly contradicted your assertions of immigrant criminality? Where is the rebuttal? Where are these things? Why are you incapable of rational response? Regardless, apart from the fact that the illegal/undocumented persons are less prone to crime because of the disincentive of discovery, I would expect that a number of crimes that are committed by that number are due to the absence of gainful employment that exists as a result of their confinement to the informal labor market created by artificial restraints (i.e. immigration laws).
The premise of your argument is the ramification of the absence of Dr. Q. Therefore, it aptly qualifies as a “what if.”

Give me a break. illegals are less likely to commit crimes due to their “disincentive of discovery?” Do tell. Obviously, said disincentive does not preclude ID theft, fraud, rape, murder, DUI, and myriad other crimes.

A lack of gainful employment does not justify or mitigate criminal behavior. Furthermore, they are ALL ineligible to work in this country. If they can’t find work, GOOD!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
LOL. Making baseless assertions about my personal attitudes is not a tactic that will get you far. Mexico, like the U.S., is another colonialist entity that I have no use for.
So, you hate both countries? Why are you here? Or, are you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
I agree. It has been catastrophic since 1492, and I welcome your efforts to aid in the repatriation of these unwanted squatters and anchor babies back to Europe.
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