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Old 03-08-2011, 02:15 PM
 
Location: SouthCentral Texas
3,855 posts, read 4,086,323 times
Reputation: 957

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
I repeat -- the guest worker provision of the Utah law is a separate issue. Do you understand the difference between a work permit and a guest worker permit?


Both are in violation of our laws. You can’t establish a program with Mexico, as this so-called guest worker program intends to do, for people who do not have legal authorization to be here.
Which bill are you discussing? HB116 or HB466?

HB166[which I have read and and cite my information from...not a news article] does not establish any program with Mexico to recruit workers. It allows illegal aliens residing in Utah to apply for "guest worker permits". Read the bill, that is the language the bill uses.

It states... that Utah will seek waivers from the federal goverment to implement the program and be in compliance with federal immigration law. If the federal government grants Utah the waivers, then the program would be legal.

DPS is not mention in the bill to administer the program, the Utah Department of Workforce Services is cited in the bill as the administrative agency.

As for HB466...The Utah bill in no way sets up a treaty between Utah and the people of Mexico.

Migrant Worker Visa Pilot Project.
[LEFT]
Quote:
(1) With the assistance of the attorney general, and subject to Section 63G-12-302, the governor may negotiate and enter into a memorandum of understanding with the government of the State of Nuevo Leon, Mexico, through its Migrant Attention Center to create a pilot project known as the "Migrant Worker Visa Pilot Project" under which Utah businesses may obtain legal foreign migrant workers through use of United States nonimmigrant visas.
[/LEFT]

Memeorandum of understanding has no binding legal authority...it is a simple letter of co-operation. Utah businesses would seek to obtain legal current US Immigration visas for workers with the assistance From the state of Utah.
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Old 03-08-2011, 02:33 PM
 
Location: El Paso, TX
3,302 posts, read 3,755,932 times
Reputation: 2524
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Let’s see if Obama and Holder ignore this. After all, the employment of illegal aliens is a violation of Federal Law. Furthermore, they still need a SSN to work. Or, perhaps they intend to violate that law also.


Utah Legislature passes package of immigration bills | Deseret News
I have no problem if the jobs that need filled are jobs locals do not take. I do hope they bill requires employers to request a quota and the types of jobs needed to be filled. I suppose this will be challenges by the Federal Government though. We will see, take care.
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Old 03-08-2011, 02:33 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 16,203,701 times
Reputation: 4611
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1751texan View Post
Which bill are you discussing? HB116 or HB466?

HB166[which I have read and and cite my information from...not a news article] does not establish any program with Mexico to recruit workers. It allows illegal aliens residing in Utah to apply for "guest worker permits". Read the bill, that is the language the bill uses.

It states... that Utah will seek waivers from the federal goverment to implement the program and be in compliance with federal immigration law. If the federal government grants Utah the waivers, then the program would be legal.

DPS is not mention in the bill to administer the program, the Utah Department of Workforce Services is cited in the bill as the administrative agency.

Quote:
As for HB466...The Utah bill in no way sets up a treaty between Utah and the people of Mexico.
Migrant Worker Visa Pilot Project.

Memeorandum of understanding has no binding legal authority...it is a simple letter of co-operation. Utah businesses would seek to obtain legal current US Immigration visas for workers with the assistance From the state of Utah.
............
Quote:
they are now working together on the migrant worker program. HB466, which
Quote:
would establish a
partnership with the Mexican state of Nuevo Leon to supply workers
to Utah
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Old 03-08-2011, 03:37 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,813,362 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1751texan View Post
Which bill are you discussing? HB116 or HB466?

HB166[which I have read and and cite my information from...not a news article] does not establish any program with Mexico to recruit workers. It allows illegal aliens residing in Utah to apply for "guest worker permits". Read the bill, that is the language the bill uses.

It states... that Utah will seek waivers from the federal goverment to implement the program and be in compliance with federal immigration law. If the federal government grants Utah the waivers, then the program would be legal.

DPS is not mention in the bill to administer the program, the Utah Department of Workforce Services is cited in the bill as the administrative agency.

As for HB466...The Utah bill in no way sets up a treaty between Utah and the people of Mexico.

Migrant Worker Visa Pilot Project.
[LEFT][/LEFT]

Memeorandum of understanding has no binding legal authority...it is a simple letter of co-operation. Utah businesses would seek to obtain legal current US Immigration visas for workers with the assistance From the state of Utah.
This is precisely what happens when a thread is derailed. Included in the new Utah immigration law are several separate “bills.” The bill this thread was intended to discuss is the one which includes the “work permit” provision (116). Then, true to form, you introduced the “guest worker” program. So, instead of simply discussing the topic of this thread, the thread has gone in a totally different direction.

Included in the new law are bills #116, 466, 487, and 497. There may be others, but I think you get the message. Bill 466 is not a memorandum, it was passed.

For the last time, if you want to discuss other provisions of this law, please start a separate thread.

Quote:
The other bills in the compromise easily passed the House and Senate Friday.

The enforcement-only bill, House Bill 497, is modeled on Arizona's law but is different enough to appease legislators worried about the negative stigma attached to Arizona's law.

The law would require police to check the immigrant status of anyone stopped for a class A misdemeanor or felony. The status check would be optional for anyone stopped for a lower misdemeanor or infraction.

House Bill 466 creates a program allowing Utah businesses to hire workers through Nuevo Leon in Mexico.

Rep. Stephen Sandstrom, R-Orem, the sponsor of House Bill 466 and 487, said the legal migrant program will help alleviate the state's illegal immigration woes by allowing immigrants to enter the state on a two-year work contract.
Utah immigration bill passes - The Herald Journal: News: immigration, illegal aliens, utah legislature,
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Old 03-08-2011, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,813,362 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elamigo View Post
I have no problem if the jobs that need filled are jobs locals do not take. I do hope they bill requires employers to request a quota and the types of jobs needed to be filled. I suppose this will be challenges by the Federal Government though. We will see, take care.
If President Obama does not instruct Eric Holder to sue the state of Utah, their agenda will be crystal clear. How can they sue Arizona for usurping federal law, while ignoring such blatant violations as those included in this law? Given that immigration falls under the purview of the federal government, how can a state legalize illegal aliens, or establish a partnership with Mexico or any other country? Utah has seriously overstepped their bounds.
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Old 03-08-2011, 04:00 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,149,569 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
If President Obama does not instruct Eric Holder to sue the state of Utah, their agenda will be crystal clear. How can they sue Arizona for usurping federal law, while ignoring such blatant violations as those included in this law? Given that immigration falls under the purview of the federal government, how can a state legalize illegal aliens, or establish a partnership with Mexico or any other country? Utah has seriously overstepped their bounds.
We'll all be watching to see what actions if any Obama takes against Utah. If he takes none, I wonder how he will explain his double standard?
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Old 03-08-2011, 04:11 PM
 
Location: El Paso, TX
3,302 posts, read 3,755,932 times
Reputation: 2524
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
If President Obama does not instruct Eric Holder to sue the state of Utah, their agenda will be crystal clear. How can they sue Arizona for usurping federal law, while ignoring such blatant violations as those included in this law? Given that immigration falls under the purview of the federal government, how can a state legalize illegal aliens, or establish a partnership with Mexico or any other country? Utah has seriously overstepped their bounds.
You are probably right. We will see. I venture to guess the federal government will file a suit, take care.
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Old 03-08-2011, 04:46 PM
 
Location: outnabout
97 posts, read 194,334 times
Reputation: 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by elamigo View Post
I have no problem if the jobs that need filled are jobs locals do not take.
I, on the other hand, DO HAVE A PROBLEM with that.
There are thousands of legal citizens who would love to have a job. Unfortuneately, the pay scale has dropped, because of illegal workers.
So who wants to work for tacos, when you are used to eating steak ?
I don't shack-up with a dozen other brethren, just to make a life for myself....the list could go on, but we all have heard it before.
I have been a contractor for 30 some years, I refuse to hire illegals. Guess that's why I don't have a job

This bill was a GROSS MISTAKE, and I hope it gets overturned.
I can only hope that the higher cost of living we are experiencing, that appears to be escalating, will drive them back to their casa.
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Old 03-08-2011, 05:05 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,813,362 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by outnabout View Post
I, on the other hand, DO HAVE A PROBLEM with that.
There are thousands of legal citizens who would love to have a job.
Unfortuneately, the pay scale has dropped, because of illegal workers.
So who wants to work for tacos, when you are used to eating steak ?
I don't shack-up with a dozen other brethren, just to make a life for myself....the list could go on, but we all have heard it before.
I have been a contractor for 30 some years, I refuse to hire illegals. Guess that's why I don't have a job

This bill was a GROSS MISTAKE, and I hope it gets overturned.
I can only hope that the higher cost of living we are experiencing, that appears to be escalating, will drive them back to their casa.
It’s a slap in the face. We have record unemployment/underemployment, yet Utah wants to pave the way for illegals to work. How anyone can support such a measure is beyond me. I guess pro-illegals won’t be satisfied until every illegal in this country, and those soon to arrive have jobs, while citizens and legal residents continue to lose their livelihood. This is wrong.
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Old 03-08-2011, 05:16 PM
 
Location: Spokane via Sydney,Australia
6,611 posts, read 10,948,309 times
Reputation: 3083
Even the Utah leiglature admits that they cannot go ahead with this law unless they receive a federal waiver. If that waiver is forthcoming it immediately sets up this administration as showing in no uncertain terms it is willing to accomodate states that pander to illegals while simultaneously suing other states (Az comes to mind here) who don't.

From the comments section it appears the legislators are flying in the face of what the actual people of Utah want. Apparently this is not a concern for some politicians.
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