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Old 05-20-2011, 01:45 PM
 
Location: Maryland
18,563 posts, read 15,768,765 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plwhit View Post
I dunno, why don't you research Mexican law, find out and report back to us....
Calm yourself. I was referring to USA law. Mexican law is of no concern to me.
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Old 05-20-2011, 01:51 PM
 
Location: Maryland
18,563 posts, read 15,768,765 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Very few illegals are ever deported. Yes, if they catch them actually coming over the border, they send them back, but once they're a few feet inside the border, they're pretty much home free and can do whatever they please and nothing will happen.

Not many are deported for simply holding a beer can in public and there would have been something else going on. And yes I do know of some deportees, one guy here got in a bar fight in a Mexican bar that caters to illegals and green card holders, the bar owners called the police to get the fight ended but only one guy got sent back. He's happy enough back home anyhow that he says he's not coming back here, he got in on some Mexican government program that helps returning farmers get back on their feet.

Another guy was dealing drugs and got caught, he didn't go back home but is staying in Juarez trying to get friends to lend him the money -- he needs $500 more to get back over but as he has alcohol and drug problems he can't manage to save up his own money. Since he doesn't pay money back, even his girlfriend won't lend him money.

I know of another guy that was deported after he got out of prison for drug trafficking, and another that had too many DWIs with accidents.

The border patrol is limited to the actual border. After that point, there's little enforcement of any laws, illegals can be stopped and found with no license or liability insurance and are just allowed to continue on their way, the cops don't bother writing them tickets because they give fake addresses and aren't going to pay anyway.
It really depends on the state and locality. I'm proud to say as a PG County, MD resident our jurisdiction is one of the leaders in deportations as a result of Secure Communities. You wouldn't expect that in a majority Black, liberal county.

Also the Border Patrol has jurisdiction 100 miles from the border. So they do have some lattitude to operate but not enough. Frankly a lot more enforcement can be done if ICE simply did their job.

They have a right to ask any foreigner for papers (legal or illegal) and should be doing so in immigrant communities nationwide. Those caught walking or driving without the correct papers or green card should be held until their status is determined. If found to be an illegal they should be processed for deportation.

You do that enough times folks will get the hint and flee. That's how Eisenhower got rid of 3 million illegals with a Border force of about 1100.
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Old 05-20-2011, 06:10 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,807,269 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zacatecana View Post
Oh boy... You know this is sad... As an activist, you are very knowledgeable in the latest news regarding illegal immigration. You read a lot and I commend you for that. However, you lack the experience. That first hand experience is what counts. You can read all you want but it shows in your posts the lack of experience from someone that works or has connections with ICE, Immigration courts or direct interaction/contact with illegal immigrants would give you insight as to what really goes on. This is not meant as an insult. I really feel you are missing out on something.

A decade or more ago, border patrol would hardly even take finger prints when someone was apprehended for crossing the border illegally. They were let go on the other side of the border. Nowadays, most illegal immigrants that are caught crossing the border are documented. After ICE takes all the necessary data, finger prints, photo, etc. ICE will hold them until they get a full bus to transport them to back to Mexico. It may take hours, a few nights but the bus will not leave until it is full. I guess they figure it costs less to house them for a few nights than to transport them to the other side of the border.

If there is a red flag on the individual. Say someone that has crossed many times and ICE wants to book them on a felony for trespassing, that individual goes to court. If the illegal immigrant claims asylum, they are booked in and must wait their turn to go to court. This process is long and very difficult to pass. Most do not make it. I heard of someone stay six months and pay 8 thousand to a US attorney and still get deported at the end of their investigation and court. This is quite common.

I've known this to be the process for quite sometime but just in case, I made a few phone calls to legal residents that were once illegal and went through this process as well as a retired border patrol. Most of the immigration courts are concerning illegal immigrants that have been living in this country and are trying to become legal or avoid deportation. And yes, while a refugee in our ICE detention prisons, they are fed and given medication if they feel sick. I would not call this a free ride. No one wants free housing in jail.
Admittedly, I do not have firsthand knowledge of, or experience with, either illegal aliens or the deportation process, and I am thankful I donít. However, are you actually suggesting that all of the reports, including those from DHS, ICE, and the Border Patrol are embellishments? If we deported according to your accounts, we would not have untold millions living here in violation of our laws, and there would be no need for debate, or so-called immigration reform.

Furthermore, while I realize you have a personal relationship with illegal aliens, you do not personally know, nor are you privy to, the experiences of all, or even a fraction of the estimated 12-30+ million illegals in this country. Therefore, your knowledge and experience is limited to the illegals you have encountered, which hardly makes you an authority on our deportation process.

Yes, it is a free ride when people make a conscious decision to illegally enter a country, and then when caught, are provided food, shelter, and if necessary, even heart surgery and transplants at U.S. taxpayersí expense. Letís not forget the illegal who received a penis pump implant while in detention. It is costing us billions annually, and as a taxpayer, I resent this unnecessary burden.
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Old 05-21-2011, 09:56 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lebowsky View Post
OMG! I was just stating the fact that its impossible... Cyanna said... "why wont they come legally" I just stated the fact that is impossible... THATS IT

I never said the us should ignore laws, nor did I said it should accommodate the low skilled immigrants of Mexico... I stated a fact
Untrue. The fact is there are no caps on H2A visas. None -- that is a temporary guest worker program.

But the better question - how many unskilled, uneducated people do we really need to import?

The fact is that if they get their education, get some skills, they can be middle class in Mexico. Oh - and restrain themselves a little so they aren't having baby after baby starting at age 14 or 15.
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Old 05-21-2011, 10:03 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Admittedly, I do not have firsthand knowledge of, or experience with, either illegal aliens or the deportation process, and I am thankful I donít. However, are you actually suggesting that all of the reports, including those from DHS, ICE, and the Border Patrol are embellishments? If we deported according to your accounts, we would not have untold millions living here in violation of our laws, and there would be no need for debate, or so-called immigration reform.

Furthermore, while I realize you have a personal relationship with illegal aliens, you do not personally know, nor are you privy to, the experiences of all, or even a fraction of the estimated 12-30+ million illegals in this country. Therefore, your knowledge and experience is limited to the illegals you have encountered, which hardly makes you an authority on our deportation process.

Yes, it is a free ride when people make a conscious decision to illegally enter a country, and then when caught, are provided food, shelter, and if necessary, even heart surgery and transplants at U.S. taxpayersí expense. Letís not forget the illegal who received a penis pump implant while in detention. It is costing us billions annually, and as a taxpayer, I resent this unnecessary burden.
You are exactly right.

The reality is that very very little is done about illegals. They are very rarely deported even when there are glaring problems.

Fire Leaves 18 Homeless in Montana Vista | KTSM News Channel 9

A typical example - 18 people living in two run down mobile homes that burned down. Most here illegally of course -- and the Red Cross is using money donated to it to keep them here.
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Old 05-21-2011, 10:09 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lebowsky View Post
There is no way for many of them to immigrate to the US legally... can you clarify what you mean by the 1000 fee? Immigration from Mexico to the US (not including family sponsored) is just trough employment. The employment has to be skilled employment which means they need to hold studies equivalent to a US bachelors degree at the very least.

There are also unskilled work visas, but those also require employment, are capped to a certain number and require the employeer to demonstrate the need for foreign workers, and do not offer a path for permanent residence.

In short, most of the illegals that cross have no practical way of getting to the US legally... I'm not saying is right, I'm just stating the fact.
And that is the whole problem right there.

To immigrate legally through a work visa requires some ability of getting a job. Not just any day labor job but a job that can support the immigrant and spouse and minor age children.

They want to come anyhow. They want to come if they can't support their families, if they have no ability to ever get a job. Of course it's easy as pie if they have some relative living here who can sponsor them -- and that relative does not have to support them, that's a myth that a sponsor must provide support. Once sponsored they can head straight to the welfare office and get their food stamps and Medicaid and a whole lot more.

Yes it's harder if they have no ability to get a job here, and no relative here to sponsor them. Then they sneak over the border, if they are caught in the act of sneaking over they might get deported, but once a few feet within the border they won't be deported. If they plan it just right, they can head right over to a hospital and give birth because they never need to worry about getting a job in that case. Nor do they have to worry about being deported.
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Old 05-21-2011, 11:43 AM
 
254 posts, read 520,202 times
Reputation: 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Untrue. The fact is there are no caps on H2A visas. None -- that is a temporary guest worker program.

But the better question - how many unskilled, uneducated people do we really need to import?

The fact is that if they get their education, get some skills, they can be middle class in Mexico. Oh - and restrain themselves a little so they aren't having baby after baby starting at age 14 or 15.
Untrue how? The employer has to demonstrate that there are no sufficient american workers, the DOL then takes the application from all the employers requested and sends the amount of H2A visas available to the consulates to start processing... So finally the DOL does decide the amount of H2A workers...

The DOL sets limits on the salary the employer has to pay to its workers, that is how he posts the job and receives applications from American workers, at the end of the hiring period he then requests X amount of temporary workers.
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Old 05-22-2011, 07:43 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,807,269 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lebowsky View Post
Untrue how? The employer has to demonstrate that there are no sufficient american workers, the DOL then takes the application from all the employers requested and sends the amount of H2A visas available to the consulates to start processing... So finally the DOL does decide the amount of H2A workers...

The DOL sets limits on the salary the employer has to pay to its workers, that is how he posts the job and receives applications from American workers, at the end of the hiring period he then requests X amount of temporary workers.
Please post the section limiting the number of H2A visas. I searched both the DOL and USCIS and could not find it. Thanks.
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Old 05-22-2011, 11:14 PM
 
254 posts, read 520,202 times
Reputation: 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Please post the section limiting the number of H2A visas. I searched both the DOL and USCIS and could not find it. Thanks.
For the USCIS the steps are listed in:

USCIS - H-2A Agricultural Workers

One of those steps is to get a foreign labor certification from the DOL...

H-2A Certification

The DOL has the power to deny the application if it finds that American workers are indeed available. And actually it forces the employer to hire US workers during the period he requested for H2A workers...

You can see the section named "Recruitment of U.S. Workers" which lists what the employer has to do to demonstrate lack of workforce...
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Old 05-23-2011, 08:10 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lebowsky View Post
For the USCIS the steps are listed in:

USCIS - H-2A Agricultural Workers

One of those steps is to get a foreign labor certification from the DOL...

H-2A Certification

The DOL has the power to deny the application if it finds that American workers are indeed available. And actually it forces the employer to hire US workers during the period he requested for H2A workers...

You can see the section named "Recruitment of U.S. Workers" which lists what the employer has to do to demonstrate lack of workforce...
And do you see anything wrong with that? Anything too restrictive?

Big deal, the employer is supposed to try to hire Americans first and pay a legal wage. And why the hell not? With unemployment rates as high as they are, exactly why should semi-trailer load after semi-trailer load of cheap illegal labor be brought in?
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