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Old 05-27-2011, 10:56 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,176,297 times
Reputation: 2130

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Quote:
Originally Posted by All American NYC View Post
Of course everyone will not be asked.

The same thing they do in NY with illegal random bag searches (Of course they need a warrant) but they do it anyway.

Its the same policy they can do here in NY. Random searches.
I believe in Escondido, Ca that is what the police did. They stopped all vehicles doing sobreity tests. It was successful in finding a lot of illegal aliens.

 
Old 05-27-2011, 11:09 AM
 
9,243 posts, read 7,122,528 times
Reputation: 2200
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
I believe in Escondido, Ca that is what the police did. They stopped all vehicles doing sobreity tests. It was successful in finding a lot of illegal aliens.
I believe they can do it, but they are afraid of the Pro illegal crowd.
 
Old 05-27-2011, 01:39 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,024,115 times
Reputation: 601
Let's get a little more specific:

The topic title suggest that any law enforcement officer be given this ability. Do they ask for a declaration of citizenship/status, or require proof? What happens if I remain silent? Or that I state a status that I cannot at that moment prove?

Is the officer allowed to arrest me if they don't believe my status, or I do not answer them? What are the charges? How do all the separate law enforcement agencies universally gain this enforcement to equally apply it?
 
Old 05-27-2011, 03:00 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,953 posts, read 30,201,927 times
Reputation: 17764
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
Let's get a little more specific:

The topic title suggest that any law enforcement officer be given this ability. Do they ask for a declaration of citizenship/status, or require proof? What happens if I remain silent? Or that I state a status that I cannot at that moment prove?


You can and probably will be held until they can prove your identity. I don't think it wise that you attempt this.

Is the officer allowed to arrest me if they don't believe my status, or I do not answer them? What are the charges? How do all the separate law enforcement agencies universally gain this enforcement to equally apply it?
I believe that they can haul you in for not identifying yourself. If they can't run your information and get a match you can be kept until they are able to identify you.
 
Old 05-27-2011, 05:47 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,024,115 times
Reputation: 601
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer View Post
I believe that they can haul you in for not identifying yourself. If they can't run your information and get a match you can be kept until they are able to identify you.
Identity laws vary state to state, and can depend on what you are doing (driving, walking down the street, etc.). I'm also not saying a refusal to identify myself, but not declaring my citizenship status. There is no law currently being enforced anywhere within the boundaries of the United States that requires a U.S. citizen to state or prove their citizenship.

What are they going to match me to? The burden of proof is on the detainee to have family or someone else bring in documentation of their status. Previous wrongful deportations of U.S. citizens (there is some real whoppers in there) had an allocated time pass, before they removed the person.
 
Old 05-27-2011, 05:57 PM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 32,583,249 times
Reputation: 2661
It actually is reasonably settled law.

An individual must state their name. No other response can be required.

Settled in the US Supreme Court Case of

Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial Circuit of Nevada

If driving different rules. But not if you are a passenger. You are still however required only to produce a driver's license and insurance proof if required.

It is called the Constitution folks...the Constitution..

Any other information requires probable cause.
 
Old 05-27-2011, 05:59 PM
 
11,536 posts, read 8,494,707 times
Reputation: 3580
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
It actually is reasonably settled law.

An individual must state their name. No other response can be required.

Settled in the US Supreme Court Case of

Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial Circuit of Nevada

If driving different rules. But not if you are a passenger. You are still however required only to produce a driver's license and insurance proof if required.

It is called the Constitution folks...the Constitution..

Any other information requires probable cause.
Perhaps we need to get rid of the 4th amendment of the Constitution.
 
Old 05-27-2011, 06:10 PM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 32,583,249 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Savoir Faire View Post
Perhaps we need to get rid of the 4th amendment of the Constitution.
Go for it...have fun...
 
Old 05-27-2011, 10:59 PM
 
Location: Tempe, Az
1,421 posts, read 1,241,021 times
Reputation: 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
It actually is reasonably settled law.

An individual must state their name. No other response can be required.

Settled in the US Supreme Court Case of

Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial Circuit of Nevada

If driving different rules. But not if you are a passenger. You are still however required only to produce a driver's license and insurance proof if required.

It is called the Constitution folks...the Constitution..

Any other information requires probable cause.
Probable cause changes depending on situations.
 
Old 05-28-2011, 02:55 AM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,024,115 times
Reputation: 601
Quote:
Originally Posted by ErikCortez View Post
Probable cause changes depending on situations.
Equal Protection Under the Law...

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