Police should be given right to question legal status. (illegally, soldiers, drug)
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I think all of us anti-illegals want is for local LE to be able (on lawful contact)to be able to detain and report those who cannot produce a valid I.D. to ICE as suspected illegal aliens. I fail to see that this violates the Constitution as it is written presently. I fail to see that this makes them immigration agents per se. One phone call to ICE violates federal jurisdiction? I don't think so.
They can do so if they have arrested the individual. That is all legal and above board.
The issue is that the constitution does not allow stops to validate citizenship.
It is quite clear such a thing is an unlawful search. We do not wish to explore whether someone is illegal by an illegal action.
They can do so if they have arrested the individual. That is all legal and above board.
The issue is that the constitution does not allow stops to validate citizenship.
It is quite clear such a thing is an unlawful search. We do not wish to explore whether someone is illegal by an illegal action.
That isn't what I said. The cops aren't validating citizenship by calling ICE to investigate a suspect. Who's being searched? One can be stopped for a traffic violation and not be searched.
I think all of us anti-illegals want is for local LE to be able (on lawful contact)to be able to detain and report those who cannot produce a valid I.D. to ICE as suspected illegal aliens. I fail to see that this violates the Constitution as it is written presently. I fail to see that this makes them immigration agents per se. One phone call to ICE violates federal jurisdiction? I don't think so.
You may be believing or trying to connect two different laws. Valid ID and being in country without autorization.
What you would like to do is use law 1 to check status of law 2.
Local law enforcement have the duty to check law 1, they are not given that task under juridiction and the supremacy clause in the constitution to perform the second.
Just as local law enforcement dont investigate, mail fraud, counterfiting, tax evasion, or kidnapping...federal immigration law are still the perview of federal agents.
That isn't what I said. The cops aren't validating citizenship by calling ICE to investigate a suspect. Who's being searched? One can be stopped for a traffic violation and not be searched.
A traffic stop is basically a Terry stop. The cop has a right to see the required documents. That is all. He has no rights to anything from the passengers.
If he arrests the guy for no license or such than whatever is the system at that facility to which he is taken would prevail.
But no the driver does not have to answer questions about his citizenship.
And the officer has no right to make the stop for the purpose of asking about citizenship.
A traffic stop is basically a Terry stop. The cop has a right to see the required documents. That is all. He has no rights to anything from the passengers.
If he arrests the guy for no license or such than whatever is the system at that facility to which he is taken would prevail.
But no the driver does not have to answer questions about his citizenship.
And the officer has no right to make the stop for the purpose of asking about citizenship.
Again, I never said the driver had to answer questions about his/her citizenship. I never advocated for an officer to stop anyone just for the sole purpose of asking about citizenship either. Go back and read my post as you aren't comprehending what I said.
Its very simple... if you believe that local[municipal, county, & state] law enforcement should have immigration in their jurisdiction [as one of their duties] change federal law and the constitution to make that happen...whats the big deal?
If so many Americans want this, then the law will pass quickly.
I can't believe anyone could be this naive. EVEN in this coming age of Idiocracy.
Do you truly and honestly believe that whatever the Americans want is granted immediately ? Like a wish to a Genies bottle ?
There are SO many other things that I believe the majority wants. Top of the list being THEIR jobs that were stolen from them buy cheap immigrant labor given rightfully back to them. More affordable housing, less people on the public dole etc etc ad nauseam ad infinitum.
Have you seen ANYTHING change that the people want ? I haven't. In fact, I see it getting worse and worse.
"If so many Americans want this, then the law will pass quickly"
Yeh. And I'll sprout wings, fly to the moon and sing like Aretha Franklin.
I can't believe anyone could be this naive. EVEN in this coming age of Idiocracy.
Do you truly and honestly believe that whatever the Americans want is granted immediately ? Like a wish to a Genies bottle ?
There are SO many other things that I believe the majority wants. Top of the list being THEIR jobs that were stolen from them buy cheap immigrant labor given rightfully back to them. More affordable housing, less people on the public dole etc etc ad nauseam ad infinitum.
Have you seen ANYTHING change that the people want ? I haven't. In fact, I see it getting worse and worse.
"If so many Americans want this, then the law will pass quickly"
Yeh. And I'll sprout wings, fly to the moon and sing like Aretha Franklin.
So you seem to be saying, this problem of...law enforcement having the right to check immigration status... is not a concern to the majority of Americans so changing the current law is not likely. OK.
So you seem to be saying, this problem of...law enforcement having the right to check immigration status... is not a concern to the majority of Americans so changing the current law is not likely. OK.
WTF ? how on earth do you glean THAT from my posts.
Step off. Seriously. Don't twist my words around to suit yourself.
I'll say it with as few words and as simply as I can:
Law enforcement having the right to check immigration status is, I feel, a major concern of the American people. But just because we WANT it, doesn't mean that LE will be given the right to actually DO it. Ok ?
Similar to: I would love to sprout wings and fly to the moon and sing like Aretha Franklin, but it's never going to happen. Ok ?
I hope to God this makes my meaning clear, if it doesn't, I'm not sure what else I can do to make you understand.
WTF ? how on earth do you glean THAT from my posts.
Step off. Seriously. Don't twist my words around to suit yourself.
I'll say it with as few words and as simply as I can:
Law enforcement having the right to check immigration status is, I feel, a major concern of the American people. But just because we WANT it, doesn't mean that LE will be given the right to actually DO it. Ok ?
Similar to: I would love to sprout wings and fly to the moon and sing like Aretha Franklin, but it's never going to happen. Ok ?
I hope to God this makes my meaning clear, if it doesn't, I'm not sure what else I can do to make you understand.
you have a understanding that laws are given or granted, there is another way to change law, when a majority of American want change, they recind or amend a law.
"There are SO many other things that I believe the majority wants".
These are your words...dont run form them now!
If a majority of Americans dont find this a problem, then America has spoken.
A traffic stop is basically a Terry stop. The cop has a right to see the required documents. That is all. He has no rights to anything from the passengers.
If he arrests the guy for no license or such than whatever is the system at that facility to which he is taken would prevail.
But no the driver does not have to answer questions about his citizenship.
And the officer has no right to make the stop for the purpose of asking about citizenship.
Right on the money. I would add further that the driver is "detained", but not necessarily the passengers (if able they could request to leave). Unless the stop goes into a further search of the vehicle the passengers won't be questioned or searched themselves.
This should be fairly well understood and established; It is the most common police interaction with the public, happening thousands of times every day across the United States...
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