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Old 06-15-2011, 11:21 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,836,058 times
Reputation: 3028

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1751texan View Post
Both citizens and non-citizens are under the jurisdiction of the US. Is that more clearer.

Your exmaples were rights held only by citizens. I guess you thought that since citizens only held these rights, that they were the only ones under the jurisdiction of the US. Which I clearly dis-proved.

I beleive you need to look up the terms-
American National
Asylee
H-1B beneficiary
Intracompany Transferee
Legalized Aliens
Parolee[not same as criminal parolee]
Permenat Resident Alien
...All non-citizens, in the US legally, and under the jurisdiction of the US.
In THAT case, every citizen of the world is “subject to the jurisdiction thereof” of the United States.

 
Old 06-15-2011, 11:33 PM
 
951 posts, read 617,593 times
Reputation: 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Being prosecuted for a crime does not qualify one as being a citizen, or being fully subject to the jurisdiction thereof as intended by the framers of the 14th. It simply means they have been charged for violating a law in this country, or causing harm to this country. U.S. citizens are also arrested, tried, and convicted of crimes in foreign lands. So what?

Of course they don't qualify as a citizen, but they still get rights like due process.

As to your interpretations of the jurisdiction thereof:

United States v. Wong Kim Ark - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Old 06-15-2011, 11:51 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,836,058 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by huddledmasses View Post
Of course they don't qualify as a citizen, but they still get rights like due process.

As to your interpretations of the jurisdiction thereof:

United States v. Wong Kim Ark - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Due process is not tantamount to citizenship, or being subject to the jurisdiction thereof for citizenship purposes.

Ah, Wong Kim Ark. Sorry, but his parents were NOT here illegally. Try again. Good night.
 
Old 06-15-2011, 11:57 PM
 
951 posts, read 617,593 times
Reputation: 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post

Ah, Wong Kim Ark. Sorry, but his parents were NOT here illegally. Try again. Good night.
Would you like to debate Constitutional law with me? Given that the Supreme Court said in Plyler that "no plausible distinction with respect to Fourteenth Amendment 'jurisdiction' can be drawn between resident aliens whose entry into the United States was lawful, and resident aliens whose entry was unlawful", please describe for me the legal reasoning that you believe gets you to your desired result?
 
Old 06-16-2011, 08:39 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,836,058 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by huddledmasses View Post
Would you like to debate Constitutional law with me? Given that the Supreme Court said in Plyler that "no plausible distinction with respect to Fourteenth Amendment 'jurisdiction' can be drawn between resident aliens whose entry into the United States was lawful, and resident aliens whose entry was unlawful", please describe for me the legal reasoning that you believe gets you to your desired result?
Plyler v. Doe was a Supreme Court decision addressing the issue of the children of non-citizens, including those here illegally, to have a Constitutional right to receive a public school education. It did NOT relate to the issue of Birthright Citizenship. It was also based on the belief, at that time, that doing so would not create a burden for states. After all, we did not have untold millions living here illegally when the decision was rendered. Now, the argument could easily be made, that it does in fact place an unsustainable burden on taxpayers. We need to revisit Plyler v. Doe before all of our school districts are bankrupt. But, that’s another issue, for a another thread.

Do you think every case citing the 14th Amendment, or every case involving "jurisdiction" relates even remotely to the issue of Birthright Citizenship? If so, be advised that countless cases have referenced the 14th Amendment, and none have any relevance to Birthright Citizenship. In fact, the Supreme Court has yet to decide a case involving Birthright Citizenship for illegal aliens. Again, keep trying.
 
Old 06-16-2011, 09:09 AM
 
951 posts, read 617,593 times
Reputation: 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Plyler v. Doe was a Supreme Court decision addressing the issue of the children of non-citizens, including those here illegally,
LOL. What part of "no plausible distinction with respect to the 14th Amendment 'jurisdiction' do you not get? It means they are all under the jurisdiction thereof and YOU don't get to pick and choose.

I'll take a note from you - Keep tryin'.
 
Old 06-16-2011, 09:18 AM
 
Location: Tempe, Az
1,421 posts, read 1,240,306 times
Reputation: 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Plyler v. Doe was a Supreme Court decision addressing the issue of the children of non-citizens, including those here illegally, to have a Constitutional right to receive a public school education. It did NOT relate to the issue of Birthright Citizenship. It was also based on the belief, at that time, that doing so would not create a burden for states. After all, we did not have untold millions living here illegally when the decision was rendered. Now, the argument could easily be made, that it does in fact place an unsustainable burden on taxpayers. We need to revisit Plyler v. Doe before all of our school districts are bankrupt. But, that’s another issue, for a another thread.

Do you think every case citing the 14th Amendment, or every case involving "jurisdiction" relates even remotely to the issue of Birthright Citizenship? If so, be advised that countless cases have referenced the 14th Amendment, and none have any relevance to Birthright Citizenship. In fact, the Supreme Court has yet to decide a case involving Birthright Citizenship for illegal aliens. Again, keep trying.
Quote:
Originally Posted by huddledmasses View Post
LOL. What part of "no plausible distinction with respect to the 14th Amendment 'jurisdiction' do you not get? It means they are all under the jurisdiction thereof and YOU don't get to pick and choose.

I'll take a note from you - Keep tryin'.
Kids of diplomats born here DONT get birthright. Time to do the same thing to kids from ILLEGAL aliens.
 
Old 06-16-2011, 09:20 AM
 
951 posts, read 617,593 times
Reputation: 89
So you want to repeal the 14th Amendment? Good luck with that. Do you hate America?
 
Old 06-16-2011, 09:32 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,836,058 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by huddledmasses View Post
LOL. What part of "no plausible distinction with respect to the 14th Amendment 'jurisdiction' do you not get? It means they are all under the jurisdiction thereof and YOU don't get to pick and choose.

I'll take a note from you - Keep tryin'.
Again, "jurisdiction" has been cited in numerous cases, none of which, relate to Birthright Citizenship for illegal aliens, including Plyler v. Doe.

Show me a Supreme Court decision which defends the “rights” of illegal aliens to even be here, let alone entitles their children to be granted U.S. citizenship. Keep grasping at straws.
 
Old 06-16-2011, 09:34 AM
 
Location: Maryland
18,563 posts, read 15,816,256 times
Reputation: 6259
Here's what needs to happen, the state department needs to refuse to issue a passport to a child of illegals and let the case work up the system. I'll like our chances with this group of SCOTUS judges to get this travesty reversed once and for all.
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