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Old 06-16-2011, 05:53 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,321 posts, read 21,009,347 times
Reputation: 10016

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Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave View Post
But what do I know?
Apparently not as much as you think you do. Utah and Salt Lake City already has a fairly sizable Hispanic population and I suspect quite of few of them are undocumented.

The problems you just described really aren't a problem here. You really need to understand where the LDS Church's position originates in order to see why it exists. Mormons were driven out of their homes within the boundaries of the United States and forced to leave Illinois in mid-winter, to haul their meager belongings across 1300 miles to settle outside of the country. They were simultaneously being persecuted by the federal government and being asked to fight for the United States in the war against Mexico. In Missouri, it was actually legal to kill a Mormon until 1976. The Mormon people know how it feels to be persecuted. I'm sure this explanation isn't going to change anybody's mind about Mormonism, but for those who are willing to consider this background, it could explain the Church's position today about undocumented workers.

That said, I am personally opposed to illegal immigration. My husband and I have worked with refugees from two different countries who entered this country legally, and I believe that that's how all people should enter the country.

 
Old 06-16-2011, 06:49 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,195,062 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katzpur View Post
Apparently not as much as you think you do. Utah and Salt Lake City already has a fairly sizable Hispanic population and I suspect quite of few of them are undocumented.

The problems you just described really aren't a problem here. You really need to understand where the LDS Church's position originates in order to see why it exists. Mormons were driven out of their homes within the boundaries of the United States and forced to leave Illinois in mid-winter, to haul their meager belongings across 1300 miles to settle outside of the country. They were simultaneously being persecuted by the federal government and being asked to fight for the United States in the war against Mexico. In Missouri, it was actually legal to kill a Mormon until 1976. The Mormon people know how it feels to be persecuted. I'm sure this explanation isn't going to change anybody's mind about Mormonism, but for those who are willing to consider this background, it could explain the Church's position today about undocumented workers.

That said, I am personally opposed to illegal immigration. My husband and I have worked with refugees from two different countries who entered this country legally, and I believe that that's how all people should enter the country.
I have no idea what an "undocumented worker" is but as for illegal aliens and comparing their plight to the Mormons persecution makes no sense to me any more than comparing them to the Civil Rights Era. Those Mormons and Blacks were U.S. citizens, not illegal aliens in this country. Now if the Mormom church wants to defend any U.S. citizens being persecuted then I could understand it but this issue is about illegal foreigners, not citizens. If this is their stance, they need to re-think it as "loyal" U.S. citizens.
 
Old 06-16-2011, 07:07 PM
 
Location: Tempe, Az
1,421 posts, read 1,242,891 times
Reputation: 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katzpur View Post
Apparently not as much as you think you do. Utah and Salt Lake City already has a fairly sizable Hispanic population and I suspect quite of few of them are undocumented.

The problems you just described really aren't a problem here. You really need to understand where the LDS Church's position originates in order to see why it exists. Mormons were driven out of their homes within the boundaries of the United States and forced to leave Illinois in mid-winter, to haul their meager belongings across 1300 miles to settle outside of the country. They were simultaneously being persecuted by the federal government and being asked to fight for the United States in the war against Mexico. In Missouri, it was actually legal to kill a Mormon until 1976. The Mormon people know how it feels to be persecuted. I'm sure this explanation isn't going to change anybody's mind about Mormonism, but for those who are willing to consider this background, it could explain the Church's position today about undocumented workers.

That said, I am personally opposed to illegal immigration. My husband and I have worked with refugees from two different countries who entered this country legally, and I believe that that's how all people should enter the country.
Mormons were jacked around. My Hispanic familia was jacked around back in the day. Oh well. That happend before any of us were born. The illegals aliens TODAY are tryin to jack us around. I want them GONE.

Missouris law: if some idiot tryed it by offing a Mormon, the Feds would be on it real fast.
 
Old 06-16-2011, 08:15 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,321 posts, read 21,009,347 times
Reputation: 10016
Quote:
Originally Posted by ErikCortez View Post
Missouris law: if some idiot tryed it by offing a Mormon, the Feds would be on it real fast.
They would today. They probably would have in 1970. In 1870, Mormons were fair game.
 
Old 06-16-2011, 08:17 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,195,062 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katzpur View Post
They would today. They probably would have in 1970. In 1870, Mormons were fair game.
I really wish people would stop living in the past and nursing old grudges endlessly.
 
Old 06-16-2011, 08:42 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,031,386 times
Reputation: 601
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
I really wish people would stop living in the past and nursing old grudges endlessly.
A few years back I heard of an African that objected that his ancestors weren't captured and brought to America for enslavement:

"I could have owned a Cadillac!"

 
Old 06-16-2011, 09:28 PM
 
106 posts, read 216,831 times
Reputation: 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
A few years back I heard of an African that objected that his ancestors weren't captured and brought to America for enslavement:

"I could have owned a Cadillac!"

Ok, I thought this thread was about Mormons and immigrants. Interesting stereo typing I won't bother but my time in Utah was interesting...to say the least.
 
Old 06-16-2011, 09:42 PM
 
Location: Tempe, Az
1,421 posts, read 1,242,891 times
Reputation: 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katzpur View Post
They would today. They probably would have in 1970. In 1870, Mormons were fair game.
So were many people.

Blacks
Irish
Chinese
Mexicans
Indians
Etc.

This is 2011; NOT 1870.
 
Old 06-16-2011, 09:59 PM
 
841 posts, read 792,439 times
Reputation: 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by majesticat View Post
Consider this, though: the Catholic leadership is also in favor of amnesty for illegals, yet most rank-and-file Catholics are not. In fact, the leadership of quite a few denominations have come out with a pro-illegal stance, but their membership do not necessarily agree.

I'd be inclined to listen to what Romney (or any other pol) has to say on the issue rather than listening to what their individual church leadership comes out with.
If you can believe what they say, especially on this issue.

Romney's comments on illegals are very contradictory. I looked up his past comments: He repeated "we must follow the rule of law", and "Illegals cannot stay here, they must get their affairs in order and go back home in a set amount of time." THEN Romney speaks to the big Hispanic group and says "I'm not for rounding up millions of illegals and holding a gun to their head", "I'd LIKE TO SEE all illegal immigrants here now register with the government to work/live here". At the debate his words were typical evasive politican.
 
Old 06-16-2011, 10:09 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,195,062 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by clsicmovies View Post
If you can believe what they say, especially on this issue.

Romney's comments on illegals are very contradictory. I looked up his past comments: He repeated "we must follow the rule of law", and "Illegals cannot stay here, they must get their affairs in order and go back home in a set amount of time." THEN Romney speaks to the big Hispanic group and says "I'm not for rounding up millions of illegals and holding a gun to their head", "I'd LIKE TO SEE all illegal immigrants here now register with the government to work/live here". At the debate his words were typical evasive politican.
Yep, that's what I remember about Romney also. Of course it seems that most politicans when they are in front of a Hispanic audience all of a sudden they change their tune from enforcement only to throwing in a hint of amnesty to get their votes. I'm looking for a politican will talk the talk and walk the walk no matter what their audience is and follow through if they are elected. I am not however, holding my breath.
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