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Old 06-30-2011, 09:48 AM
 
2,113 posts, read 2,242,553 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickDros View Post
He is one "of our own." He's a human being (just like you and me!), educated in US schools, works for US corporations, buys products from other US corporations, reads and writes in English, contributes to the US tax base, and is, in every substantive way American.

Answer the question I posed in that post: What does the United States gain from sending a Pulitzer Prize winning writer back to a country he hasn't lived in since he was 12? He's a valuable contributor to society; why discard such a person?

Why do you want to weaken the United States by sending people like this, who are quite obviously valuable assets, away?
He may be a human being but he is certainly not one of our own. He is not an American or a legal resident.

Welcome to the board. It has certainly become very popular this month.
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Old 06-30-2011, 10:06 AM
 
1,569 posts, read 1,005,771 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindy_Jole View Post
He may be a human being but he is certainly not one of our own. He is not an American or a legal resident.

Welcome to the board. It has certainly become very popular this month.
You can define "one of our own" however you'd like. I can say no one who lives in my state is "one of our own." Or no one who doesn't work in my office building. Or I could, you know, treat human beings equally.
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Old 06-30-2011, 10:38 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Rockmadinejad View Post
You can define "one of our own" however you'd like. I can say no one who lives in my state is "one of our own." Or no one who doesn't work in my office building. Or I could, you know, treat human beings equally.
I prefer treating humans equally as well.

Therefore, I have every respect for legal immigrants who obey our laws and come here the right way. Why should criminals be allowed to cut the line, abuse our social services, make demands and then be rewarded for their crimes? That is not treating humans equally. That is giving preference to criminals over law-abiding people.
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Old 06-30-2011, 10:48 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,152,437 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindy_Jole View Post
I prefer treating humans equally as well.

Therefore, I have every respect for legal immigrants who obey our laws and come here the right way. Why should criminals be allowed to cut the line, abuse our social services, make demands and then be rewarded for their crimes? That is not treating humans equally. That is giving preference to criminals over law-abiding people.
Correct, is holding our own citizens accountable for breaking the law not treating them equally as human beings? I can't believe the desperate tactics and ludicrous analogies that these pro-illegals make to justify illegal immigration into our country and the demonization of the enforcement of our immigration laws.
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Old 06-30-2011, 11:00 AM
 
1,569 posts, read 1,005,771 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindy_Jole View Post
I prefer treating humans equally as well.

Therefore, I have every respect for legal immigrants who obey our laws and come here the right way. Why should criminals be allowed to cut the line, abuse our social services, make demands and then be rewarded for their crimes? That is not treating humans equally. That is giving preference to criminals over law-abiding people.
Treating them all equally would be giving them equal access to immigration to the best of our ability. However, there are lots of restrictions, to the point where illegally immigrating is easier for most Mexicans. That's why they do it.
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Old 06-30-2011, 11:08 AM
 
2,113 posts, read 2,242,553 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockmadinejad View Post
Treating them all equally would be giving them equal access to immigration to the best of our ability. However, there are lots of restrictions, to the point where illegally immigrating is easier for most Mexicans. That's why they do it.
First of all, we welcome more legal immigrants than any other country.

Second, we welcome more Mexican immigrants than any other group of people. This is not equal access to immigration for immigrants from other countries. We are not treating all immigrants equally. We are favoring immigrants from Mexico, so your "lots of restrictions" doesn't change the fact that the majority of our immigrants come from Mexico.

If you truly want things "equal" then we should allow the same number of immigrants from each country to come here.
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Old 06-30-2011, 11:15 AM
 
1,569 posts, read 1,005,771 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindy_Jole View Post
First of all, we welcome more legal immigrants than any other country.
Who cares? Obviously more want to come here than want to go elsewhere. We still have strong restrictions on who can come and from where, and that's what's most relevant to Mexicans looking to emigrate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindy_Jole View Post
Second, we welcome more Mexican immigrants than any other group of people. This is not equal access to immigration for immigrants from other countries. We are not treating all immigrants equally. We are favoring immigrants from Mexico, so your "lots of restrictions" doesn't change the fact that the majority of our immigrants come from Mexico.
That's not "favoring," it's the result of more Mexicans than anyone else wanting to come here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindy_Jole View Post
If you truly want things "equal" then we should allow the same number of immigrants from each country to come here.
Agreed. Unrestricted numbers from each.
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Old 06-30-2011, 12:23 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,152,437 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindy_Jole View Post
First of all, we welcome more legal immigrants than any other country.

Second, we welcome more Mexican immigrants than any other group of people. This is not equal access to immigration for immigrants from other countries. We are not treating all immigrants equally. We are favoring immigrants from Mexico, so your "lots of restrictions" doesn't change the fact that the majority of our immigrants come from Mexico.

If you truly want things "equal" then we should allow the same number of immigrants from each country to come here.
Don't hold you breath for a viable answer. I am all for diversity quotas also. Allowing more Mexicans in here both legally and illegally is not treating OTHER immigrants equally.
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Old 06-30-2011, 12:26 PM
 
Location: East Coast US
37 posts, read 22,985 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Excellent and truthful post. These people need to put the blame where the blame belongs and that is on their parents, not on this country.
Ok, lets blame his mother and his grandparents.

Then why would you want to deport someone who you admit is not responsible for his circumstance? That doesn't seem very fair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chanygirl View Post
For RickDros:
And not on the laws of said country or the citizens of said country for wanting our laws upheld. You can p*iss and moan all day about how they are home and they have worked so hard and they don't know anything else... but that doesn't change the law and the law says they must go.
Why does the law say that? What purpose is that law supposed to serve?

Is it to punish people who broke the law? Well, he didn't do it. He was forced to do it while he was still a minor - as has been admitted in the comments above.

Is it to provide restitution to people he's harmed? Who is going to benefit form his deportation?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chanygirl View Post
And no, he wasn't violent or a drain on the social services system but the scholarships he had could have been used by someone legal, the internships he had could have been had by someone legal.
See, you lost me here. I see all kinds of complaining about how these people have some sort of expectant attitude, how they come here and expect things to be handed to them. Well, this guy hasn't done any of that. He legitimately worked for what he has, and has been successful. Scholarships and internships are merit-based awards. This is exactly the type of person who you should want those scholarships and internships to go to. Would you rather have those opportunities given to some kid who barely dragged his way through college with a 2.5 GPA or someone who is going to take those opportunities and make the most of them?

Those things exist to help make productive citizens out of students, because the organizations who give them out understand that by creating productive members of society everyone in that society benefits. So this is, by all objective measures, a success story.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chanygirl View Post
What I am saying is for every 1 of him there are 100 that deserve the opportunities he had that are legal.
There are? Why do those people deserve it more than he does? This is the exact "deserving attitude" that people hate on immigrants for. So it's ok if someone thinks they deserve something like this, but only if they were lucky enough to happen to be born within a relatively small geographic area? That, most certainly, is not treating all people equal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chanygirl View Post
I have to ask this tho....are you one of those pro illegal trolls from that "other" website??? Because, all emotions aside, the facts are the facts and the law is the law...you just seem to be wanting to argue.
I'm not a pro-illegal troll, and I'm not arguing on emotion. I belong to lots of websites, but I'm not sure what you're referring to. I'm basically a libertarian leaning humanist. I don't think there's a difference between me and anyone else in the world. I think they should have every opportunity that I have, regardless of where on the globe their mother was when they emerged from her womb.

Claiming "the law is the law" is just not enough of a justification for following inhumane policy. There have been hundreds of thousands of laws which are horribly unfair, illogical, and repugnant throughout history. Hell, there have been tens of thousands of ridiculous laws in the United States - many of which are still technically in effect. There has to be a logical reason for a law to exist, IMO, before it deserves to be followed and respected rather than questioned. As St. Augustine said, "An unjust law is no law at all."

Last edited by RickDros; 06-30-2011 at 12:38 PM..
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Old 06-30-2011, 12:28 PM
 
2,113 posts, read 2,242,553 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Correct, is holding our own citizens accountable for breaking the law not treating them equally as human beings? I can't believe the desperate tactics and ludicrous analogies that these pro-illegals make to justify illegal immigration into our country and the demonization of the enforcement of our immigration laws.
I agree. Using the "equal human beings" angle is a new one.

Since human beings should be treated equally, then illegals should not sneak into the country while millions are applying to become legal immigrants.

Treating human beings equally also means that illegals should be prosecuted for their criminal activity, such as violating our immigration laws, driving without a license, identity theft, tax evasion, etc because citizens and legal residents would also be charged for not driving without a license, identity theft, and tax evasion.
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