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Old 07-10-2011, 12:44 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
The most commonly spoken language in the USA is English. Hence, if, as you suggest, they have no obligation whatsoever to learn English, they will not assimilate.
Again, that doesn't logically follow. They do not owe it to the nation to learn English. That doesn't mean they won't learn it or that they won't assimilate. Not that they owe it to you to assimilate.

 
Old 07-10-2011, 12:52 PM
 
Location: Maryland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockmadinejad View Post
Again, that doesn't logically follow. They do not owe it to the nation to learn English. That doesn't mean they won't learn it or that they won't assimilate. Not that they owe it to you to assimilate.
Again, unless they make learning the English language a priority, they will be slow to assimilate, if ever. In the meantime, we should not offer anything in their native language, particularly, at taxpayers’ expense. They should be forced to sink or swim.
 
Old 07-10-2011, 12:54 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Again, unless they make learning the English language a priority, they will be slow to assimilate, if ever. In the meantime, we should not offer anything in their native language, particularly, at taxpayersí expense. They should be forced to sink or swim.
Why, exactly? To satisfy your desire to force assimilation? I'm a taxpayer, too, and I would like Spanish language documents to be provided so that Spanish speaking people in America can understand them.
 
Old 07-10-2011, 12:55 PM
 
Location: OCEAN BREEZES AND VIEWS SAN CLEMENTE
19,899 posts, read 15,291,186 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockmadinejad View Post
Again, that doesn't logically follow. They do not owe it to the nation to learn English. That doesn't mean they won't learn it or that they won't assimilate. Not that they owe it to you to assimilate.

Look learning english only benefits themselves. If they are going to be out and about, shopping, i am sure they will, buying clothes, etc, they need to learn at least minimum english, it will only help themselves, do you not see this. And if they get stopped by the police knowing a bit of english would help don't ya think.

And they do put demands on us, don't tell me they don't ask my daughter why don't you. Mexicans who do not speak a lick of english come into a upscale department store, demanding to know why the employees of this store don't speak english, and then have a tissy fit. I here all kinds of stories, do you know how many get escorted out of the store, because they are rude as hell. Fine don't speak a bit of english, but don't go into any store putting demands on english speaking people, because some don't speak spanish, what right do they have by doing this. And no i am not kidding, this happens all the time. You see speaking english would only benfit themselves, since they cannot undestand simple logic being made to them., by the employess of the store. They don't get what is being said to them, and to tell ya the truth, the hispanic employees who work there who were born in this Country, won't speak spanish to them.

And they have been caught right at the register, changing prices on items, that don't even have the right price tag on it, their are certain codes and once at the register, they have already seen them changing prices.But without them speaking english, it is a losing battle, because they argue, scream, one even laid a hand on my daughter, telling her he did not change a price when he certainly did. I think some choose not to learn to speak english for their own benefit. They even bring in merchandise from another store, that is old as the hill, and try and enchange it, are you going to tell me that they forgot where they bought the merchandise, yeah right! Again without speaking english, they cannot accuse anyone without them not understanding, so they do get kicked out of the store.

Don't say they do not put demands on us, cause they do.


Hell no documents in this Country should be in English, Think documents in mexico are going to be in English i don't think so, In Italy, think they are going to be in English, don't think so.

Dare loro un pollice che vogliono un miglio?

Last edited by california-jewel; 07-10-2011 at 01:15 PM..
 
Old 07-10-2011, 12:59 PM
 
1,569 posts, read 1,005,489 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by california-jewel View Post
Look learning english only benefits themselves. If they are going to be out and about, shopping, i am sure they will, buying clothes, etc, they need to learn at least minimum english, it will only help themselves, do you not see this. And if they get stopped by the police knowing a bit of english would help don't ya think.
Um, yes. I've said as much. These are all good incentives for them to learn English. But if they choose not to, that is no business of mine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by california-jewel View Post
And they do put demands on us, don't tell me they don't ask my daughter why don't you. Mexicans who do not speak a lick of english come into a upscale department store, demanding to know whey the employees of this store don't speak english, and then have a tissy fit. I here all kinds of stories, do you know how many get escorted out of the store, because they are rude as hell. Fine don't speak a bit of english, but don't go into any store putting demands on english speaking people, because some don't speak spanish, what right do they have by doing this. And no i am not kidding, this happens all the time, you see speaking english would only benfit themselves, since they cannot undestand simple logic being made to them. by the employess of the store, they don't get what is being said to them, and to tell ya the truth, the hispanic employees who work there who were born in this Country, won't speak spanish to them.

Don't say they do not put demands on us, cause they do.
I mean, great, you have anecdotes where Mexicans (presumably illegal, right?) demand that employees speak English. I think they're probably being a little silly. But this is not being enforced legally. This is a person complaining in a department store. That might be the least important public policy issue of our time.
 
Old 07-10-2011, 01:03 PM
 
Location: Maryland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockmadinejad View Post
Why, exactly? To satisfy your desire to force assimilation? I'm a taxpayer, too, and I would like Spanish language documents to be provided so that Spanish speaking people in America can understand them.
Why only Spanish documents? What about our other immigrants who donít speak Spanish? No, this is the USA, and while English is not our official language, it is the primary language. If Spanish-speaking people wish to live in this country, they should learn our language. Otherwise, they should remain in Mexico, or other Spanish-speaking countries. If I relocated to France, I certainly would not be so arrogant to expect the French government to provide anything for me in English.
 
Old 07-10-2011, 01:06 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Why only Spanish documents? What about our other immigrants who donít speak Spanish?
They should be provided translations as well, though for lesser known languages on a case by case basis. This is a super cheap and most likely cost-efficient approach to this problem, I hope you realize. When someone cannot read a document, they cannot legally agree to its terms.
 
Old 07-10-2011, 01:21 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,813,362 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockmadinejad View Post
They should be provided translations as well, though for lesser known languages on a case by case basis. This is a super cheap and most likely cost-efficient approach to this problem, I hope you realize. When someone cannot read a document, they cannot legally agree to its terms.
You must be kidding. Do you actually not realize the fiscal burden of providing translators and documents in foreign languages? And, the following aren't even current amounts. Those must be staggering.

Quote:
St. Cloud (MN) reported in March 2003 that almost $200,000 was spent in a nine-month period on a variety of interpreter and translation services. Many of these costs are not reimbursed by insurance.
Quote:
Reversing a campaign pledge to push for English immersion programs, New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg has expanded the city's bilingual education program. Under the new plan, announced in June, the city will spend $20 million to allow students to take their core courses in their native tongues.
Quote:
The Virginia Supreme Court has certification programs for Spanish court interpreters and is considering certification programs in Vietnamese and Korean. In 2002, 36,625 people were served by language interpreters in Virginia criminal cases, at a cost of 2.7 million to taxpayers. These numbers have almost doubled since 2000 and are expected to keep rising.
Quote:
The total cost of providing multilingual services for the Immigration and Naturalization Service would be between $114 million and $150 million annually.
Fact Sheets: Costs of Multilingualism
 
Old 07-10-2011, 01:26 PM
 
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As much as I am swayed by that obviously unbiased site, like I was heavily implying, that's probably cheaper than the alternative. WTF is supposed to happen in a court proceeding where the defendant can't understand the charges? What do you do when you have thousands of immigrants challenging contracts because they could not understand the terms? Those are expensive and difficult problems.
 
Old 07-10-2011, 01:34 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,813,362 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockmadinejad View Post
As much as I am swayed by that obviously unbiased site, like I was heavily implying, that's probably cheaper than the alternative. WTF is supposed to happen in a court proceeding where the defendant can't understand the charges? What do you do when you have thousands of immigrants challenging contracts because they could not understand the terms? Those are expensive and difficult problems.
Well, if they live within the law, they wonít have to worry about understanding the charges. As for contracts, if they have chosen to make the USA their home, it would behoove them to first learn the language. If I planned to move to a non-English-speaking country, I would consider it a MUST to first learn the language. We should not spend millions on interpreters or documents for people who are too lazy, or too arrogant to learn English.
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