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Old 09-18-2011, 10:39 PM
 
1,574 posts, read 791,268 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Are illegals who commit ID theft, fraud, and/or tax evasion criminals? If so, EVERY employed illegal is indeed a criminal. Not to mention, the countless illegals who have returned after being deported. They have committed FELONY offenses. So, what percentage of illegal aliens could realistically fall into the “non-criminal” category, excluding children under the age of 16?
So what you're saying is they're all criminals... except the ones than aren't, and somehow that proves that I was wrong?

 
Old 09-18-2011, 10:42 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,836,058 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
So what you're saying is they're all criminals... except the ones than aren't, and somehow that proves that I was wrong?
No, I said all EMPLOYED illegals are criminals. In addition, every illegal who returned after being deported (and there are many), are not only criminals, but felons.
 
Old 09-18-2011, 10:43 PM
 
4,307 posts, read 7,916,496 times
Reputation: 1572
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
No, I said all EMPLOYED illegals are criminals. In addition, every illegal who returned after being deported (and there are many), are not only criminals, but felons.
What about the ones who are paid in cash?

EDIT: I see "working under the table" - Lemme look up something

EDIT 2: Ho Ho!

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/19/bu...pagewanted=all

It seems like in big cities illegals are well, well entrenched in janitorial and maid services.

"In some industries with many illegal immigrants, like construction, farming and landscaping, employers often turn to labor contractors to assemble crews of workers — transferring onto them the responsibility of checking the paperwork. That helps establish deniability in case of an immigration raid.

By contrast, the big building maintenance contractors do much of the hiring themselves. But some still distance themselves from the job market itself by delegating hiring to supervisors in individual buildings — often immigrants themselves — who will receive the job applications, help fill in official documents and copy supporting papers.

Adriana said she never had to step into ABM's offices, which are across the Mississippi River from downtown Minneapolis. She said that the supervisor knew she did not have proper papers.
"

and

"Starting about 30 years ago, as illegal immigration began to swell, building maintenance contractors in big immigrant hubs like Los Angeles started hiring the new immigrant workers as part of a broader effort to drive down labor costs. Unions for janitors fell apart as landlords shifted to cheaper nonunion contractors to clean their buildings. Wages fell and many American-born workers left the industry."
 
Old 09-18-2011, 10:45 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,836,058 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vicman View Post
What about the ones who are paid in cash?
Unless they are reporting all of their cash payments to the IRS, they have committed tax evasion, and are indeed criminals.

Edit: And, if they are using a stolen or fake SSN to report their cash income, they are still criminals.
 
Old 09-18-2011, 10:56 PM
 
1,574 posts, read 791,268 times
Reputation: 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
No, I said all EMPLOYED illegals are criminals.
OK, cool story. All drug-dealing US citizens are criminals, too. Fantastic.
 
Old 09-18-2011, 11:06 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,836,058 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vicman View Post
What about the ones who are paid in cash?

EDIT: I see "working under the table" - Lemme look up something

EDIT 2: Ho Ho!

Here Illegally, Working Hard and Paying Taxes - New York Times

It seems like in big cities illegals are well, well entrenched in janitorial and maid services.

"In some industries with many illegal immigrants, like construction, farming and landscaping, employers often turn to labor contractors to assemble crews of workers — transferring onto them the responsibility of checking the paperwork. That helps establish deniability in case of an immigration raid.

By contrast, the big building maintenance contractors do much of the hiring themselves. But some still distance themselves from the job market itself by delegating hiring to supervisors in individual buildings — often immigrants themselves — who will receive the job applications, help fill in official documents and copy supporting papers.

Adriana said she never had to step into ABM's offices, which are across the Mississippi River from downtown Minneapolis. She said that the supervisor knew she did not have proper papers.
"

and

"Starting about 30 years ago, as illegal immigration began to swell, building maintenance contractors in big immigrant hubs like Los Angeles started hiring the new immigrant workers as part of a broader effort to drive down labor costs. Unions for janitors fell apart as landlords shifted to cheaper nonunion contractors to clean their buildings. Wages fell and many American-born workers left the industry."
Response to Edit 2: Ho! Ho!. . . .

I think we all know illegals are working in construction, landscaping, hospitality, restaurants, agriculture, as well as most other industries. In fact, it is estimated that at least 8 million are employed, some even work for the government. How does that change their criminal status?

Are you suggesting they are not using stolen or fake SSNs? If so, please explain. Unless the law changed TODAY, it is still against the law to employ illegal aliens. And, they are still ineligible to obtain a SSN, which is required to work in this country.
 
Old 09-18-2011, 11:09 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,836,058 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
OK, cool story. All drug-dealing US citizens are criminals, too. Fantastic.
Yes, drug dealers are criminals. Does that change the fact that most illegal aliens are criminals? I think not.
 
Old 09-18-2011, 11:27 PM
 
1,574 posts, read 791,268 times
Reputation: 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Yes, drug dealers are criminals. Does that change the fact that most illegal aliens are criminals? I think not.
And we're right back at the beginning. I'm not sure what point you think you're making here.
 
Old 09-19-2011, 05:50 AM
Yac
 
5,877 posts, read 6,307,966 times
If I see one more generic rant or another post NOT ADDRESSING THE TOPIC of the thread, there will be infractions. This is getting too ridiculous.
Yac.
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Old 09-19-2011, 11:27 AM
 
4,307 posts, read 7,916,496 times
Reputation: 1572
The newspaper article says that SSNs are made up out of thin air... so... yes, illegals who work for "mainstream" large companies do use forged SSNs.

But what's more significant is that employers are clearly accepting illegal work but have mechanisms to "deny" that they hire illegals, and employers aren't being convicted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Are you suggesting they are not using stolen or fake SSNs? If so, please explain. Unless the law changed TODAY, it is still against the law to employ illegal aliens. And, they are still ineligible to obtain a SSN, which is required to work in this country.
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