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Old 07-16-2011, 12:16 AM
 
26 posts, read 25,434 times
Reputation: 12

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Even if you have a master's degree in an engineering and you want to work legally you need to sit in your own country and wait for 3-5 months while they monkey around with the paperwork. Of course you don't get paid for waiting. You also have to fly back to your country of origin at a cost of thousands of dollars to renew the visa.

Conclusion: The US prefers to have people work there illegally.

If they wanted people to work legally they could simply allow them to work while the application is pending and also allow for in-country renewals.

I don't think most people want to work illegally, they just have better things to do than filling out fkn forms (and pay outrageous fees + attorney costs) and sitting around waiting for an ape to look at it.

 
Old 07-16-2011, 02:05 AM
 
Location: Chicagoland
4,028 posts, read 6,223,837 times
Reputation: 1305
Quote:
Originally Posted by KsStorm View Post
If 20 mil left? Instant 0% unemployment rate. Imagine all the MONEY the US would save on welfare & Medicaid!!!
What the!? You have absolutely no idea.

"They took our jobs!"

Quote:
Originally Posted by aquabluesrq View Post
Prisons would be empty. Tax dollars could be used to help Americans who are homeless and/or poor.

Man if would be awesome for our society.
Most in prison are our own. Nice try.

Dear God you people spend too much time in your own little world.

Let's look back at the sentiment of immigration in the past and the pattern that it follows. Oh, hey, all of your comments have no basis when that happens!

Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Where was the racism? Is that the only card you have to play? You can't really explain why with such high unemployment rates we should be bringing in millions of cheap foreign workers who cannot afford the high cost of living here?

And how is it not racist to insist that there is some superior race of hard workers who happily work the slave-type jobs for very little pay? In fact most of the open borders type sound just like the slave masters of the past, insisting we need to bring in hordes of people to do the menial labor kinds of jobs.

That's the true racism, but suggesting Americans will and do work hard is not, pointing out that Americans are suffering with lack of jobs is not racism. But it might be racism to insist we need some special type of servants and peons.
The racism is everywhere. Unemployment would not nearly drop to the levels that people think they would. Many are day laborers.

They do jobs that Americans don't want to do. They work hard because they can't get jobs so they are grateful for the crappy ones here, because they risked a lot to get here, because they nee money for their families.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Whoever made such claims in this forum? Debating with honesty instead of lies lends so much more credibility to one's posts.
Welcome to this thread. Reading through the posts helps.

Quote:
Originally Posted by floridasandy View Post
all mexico has to do is guard ITS OWN BORDERS. it shouldn't be our job to keep illegal immigrants out.
Why not? America by far has the world's largest defense budget if you can't "defend" the borders, then why not slash the budget?

I guess you didn't bother to think about what really goes on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by floridasandy View Post
i guess you are ignoring that both countries actually have rules for immigration and emigration.

in that case, i guess we should all just go to mexico then-the beaches might be nice.

who is with me?
For entering, not for leaving. Which would fall upon America.

Quote:
Originally Posted by floridasandy View Post
let's not twist this around.
You're right, let's not twist this around like your idea that Mexico should stop Mexicans from leaving a free country. American law does not and cannot stop Mexicans from leaving Mexico, only from entering America.

Quote:
Originally Posted by medvall View Post
Conclusion: The US prefers to have people work there illegally.
That's right.
 
Old 07-16-2011, 04:54 AM
 
12,870 posts, read 12,773,798 times
Reputation: 4446
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lebowsky View Post
What am I twisting? Imagine if every time you want to get out of the US you have to ask permission to the US government... Have you ever done it? You do not need to provide anything, you do however have to ask permission to the country you are entering.

This is a basic human right according to the United Nations:

Article 13.

(1) Everyone has the right to freedom of movement and residence within the borders of each state.
(2) Everyone has the right to leave any country, including his own, and to return to his country.


All of the ones below look correct to me...

mexico has citizens that it is responsible for, correct?
they are not united states citizens, correct?
they are not entitled to united states benefits, correct?
they break the law when they come here, correct?
it is an unfair burden to expect the united states to control the mexican citizens, correct?


Also, Mexico changed its immigration laws recently:

Mexico de-criminalizes migration
you have a right to travel freely within your own country only, and you have to respect the rules of other countries. the UN has absolutely zero influence on me. it's just an international organization made up of people who think that they can determine the "rules" for everybody. no country should have to answer to them.

here is the bottom line:

america's economy cannot handle all the excess "workers" it has been forced to absorb (by mexico's intent or neglect, as well as by other countries) and we have a right and a duty to demand that they go back to their own countries and obey their own laws, and give our economy a chance to recover.

Last edited by floridasandy; 07-16-2011 at 05:04 AM..
 
Old 07-16-2011, 05:45 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,711,508 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by medvall View Post
Even if you have a master's degree in an engineering and you want to work legally you need to sit in your own country and wait for 3-5 months while they monkey around with the paperwork. Of course you don't get paid for waiting. You also have to fly back to your country of origin at a cost of thousands of dollars to renew the visa.

Conclusion: The US prefers to have people work there illegally.

If they wanted people to work legally they could simply allow them to work while the application is pending and also allow for in-country renewals.

I don't think most people want to work illegally, they just have better things to do than filling out fkn forms (and pay outrageous fees + attorney costs) and sitting around waiting for an ape to look at it.
What the US *should* prefer is that American citizens and already-here legal immigrants are working.

What you don't seem to understand is we have American engineers out of work, why should many engineers from all over the world show up and be quickly processed or given a job before the paperwork is processed while the Americans face such high unemployment?

The open borders crowd needs to realize that with NAFTA and all these China and other trade deals, many millions of jobs have left the USA and continue to leave the USA.

We simply do not need millions more people showing up to take the very very few available jobs.
 
Old 07-16-2011, 06:16 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,146,155 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by medvall View Post
Even if you have a master's degree in an engineering and you want to work legally you need to sit in your own country and wait for 3-5 months while they monkey around with the paperwork. Of course you don't get paid for waiting. You also have to fly back to your country of origin at a cost of thousands of dollars to renew the visa.

Conclusion: The US prefers to have people work there illegally.

If they wanted people to work legally they could simply allow them to work while the application is pending and also allow for in-country renewals.

I don't think most people want to work illegally, they just have better things to do than filling out fkn forms (and pay outrageous fees + attorney costs) and sitting around waiting for an ape to look at it.
I'm all for improving our visa application process and backlogs however until that happens that doesn't justify coming here illegally. Most illegals never even try to come with a visa at all.
 
Old 07-16-2011, 06:21 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,146,155 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by thePR View Post
What the!? You have absolutely no idea.

"They took our jobs!"



Most in prison are our own. Nice try.

Dear God you people spend too much time in your own little world.

Let's look back at the sentiment of immigration in the past and the pattern that it follows. Oh, hey, all of your comments have no basis when that happens!



The racism is everywhere. Unemployment would not nearly drop to the levels that people think they would. Many are day laborers.

They do jobs that Americans don't want to do. They work hard because they can't get jobs so they are grateful for the crappy ones here, because they risked a lot to get here, because they nee money for their families.



Welcome to this thread. Reading through the posts helps.



Why not? America by far has the world's largest defense budget if you can't "defend" the borders, then why not slash the budget?

I guess you didn't bother to think about what really goes on.



For entering, not for leaving. Which would fall upon America.



You're right, let's not twist this around like your idea that Mexico should stop Mexicans from leaving a free country. American law does not and cannot stop Mexicans from leaving Mexico, only from entering America.



That's right.
I see you're another one spouting the pro-illegal propaganda that illegals are only doing jobs that Americans won't do and no most of them are NOT day laborers. Haven't you read about all the raids? Those were not day laborer jobs. Even day laborers are stealing jobs from American construction and landscape workers.

It is the greedy employers that want them here, not most Americans.
 
Old 07-16-2011, 06:23 AM
 
Location: CA
250 posts, read 338,010 times
Reputation: 169
Considering Illegals cost the California's health care system $1.4 BILLION last year alone... I'd say things would be ..umm, Cheaper?
 
Old 07-16-2011, 07:55 AM
 
Location: Tempe, Az
1,421 posts, read 1,237,724 times
Reputation: 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by thePR View Post
What the!? You have absolutely no idea.

"They took our jobs!"



Most in prison are our own. Nice try.

Dear God you people spend too much time in your own little world.

Let's look back at the sentiment of immigration in the past and the pattern that it follows. Oh, hey, all of your comments have no basis when that happens!



The racism is everywhere. Unemployment would not nearly drop to the levels that people think they would. Many are day laborers.

They do jobs that Americans don't want to do. They work hard because they can't get jobs so they are grateful for the crappy ones here, because they risked a lot to get here, because they nee money for their families.



Welcome to this thread. Reading through the posts helps.



Why not? America by far has the world's largest defense budget if you can't "defend" the borders, then why not slash the budget?

I guess you didn't bother to think about what really goes on.



For entering, not for leaving. Which would fall upon America.



You're right, let's not twist this around like your idea that Mexico should stop Mexicans from leaving a free country. American law does not and cannot stop Mexicans from leaving Mexico, only from entering America.



That's right.
If you were 100 percent right bout Americans not doing day labor jobs, time are changin. Many people are losing there unemployment now and those day labor jobs are lookin good.
 
Old 07-16-2011, 10:15 AM
 
26 posts, read 25,434 times
Reputation: 12
Why would a US employer pay steep attorney fees, application fees, deal with the uncertainty of visa approval and so on when there is an equally qualified US citizen available?

Bottom line is, there isn't or he/she is a deadbeat that is better of flipping burgers than putting his 2.5 GPA brain to work at designing precision tools for the semiconductor industry.

It is the US employer that is the decider in this case, a legal US entity is making the decision based on their analysis to improve/expand/maintain their business and stay competitive.

For US businesses to be competitive they need to draw their workers from an international community.

Have you checked what the unemployment rate is for white US college graduates? I am guessing less than 3 %.

Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
What the US *should* prefer is that American citizens and already-here legal immigrants are working.

What you don't seem to understand is we have American engineers out of work, why should many engineers from all over the world show up and be quickly processed or given a job before the paperwork is processed while the Americans face such high unemployment?

The open borders crowd needs to realize that with NAFTA and all these China and other trade deals, many millions of jobs have left the USA and continue to leave the USA.

We simply do not need millions more people showing up to take the very very few available jobs.
 
Old 07-16-2011, 10:23 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,711,508 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by medvall View Post
Why would a US employer pay steep attorney fees, application fees, deal with the uncertainty of visa approval and so on when there is an equally qualified US citizen available?

Bottom line is, there isn't or he/she is a deadbeat that is better of flipping burgers than putting his 2.5 GPA brain to work at designing precision tools for the semiconductor industry.

It is the US employer that is the decider in this case, a legal US entity is making the decision based on their analysis to improve/expand/maintain their business and stay competitive.

For US businesses to be competitive they need to draw their workers from an international community.

Have you checked what the unemployment rate is for white US college graduates? I am guessing less than 3 %.
Uhhhh....why would the unemployment rate of just the white ones matter? What of the black US college graduates?

But illegals aren't really taking those jobs that require a college education. That's more a legal immigration topic. And yes - if an American college graduate costs $60,000 a year, there is someone from somewhere you would take the same job for $20,000 a year which more than makes up for the cost of the legal work visa.
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