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Old 08-11-2011, 07:47 PM
 
Location: Houston, Texas
1,164 posts, read 1,276,707 times
Reputation: 387

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Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Your story doesn't ring true with me as I know many white, blue collared Americans seeking work wherever they can find it. As I said, once a company hires a lot of Hispanics both legal and illegal they won't hire white or black Americans for various reasons (none of which is because Hispanics work harder either). After awhile non-hispanics can see the handwriting on the wall and just plain give up applying at certain places.
Then it's different depending in which state you live in? You claim that construction workers are paid little because of illegals and yet I know some who are paid quite well. Although, I did say my example was anecdotal as are some of your arguments and examples.
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Old 08-11-2011, 08:20 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,144,640 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canaan-84 View Post
Then it's different depending in which state you live in? You claim that construction workers are paid little because of illegals and yet I know some who are paid quite well. Although, I did say my example was anecdotal as are some of your arguments and examples.
Of course it is different with states that don't have a high population of illegals. There is less competition from them for jobs. However, the way it is going there will be no states safe from illegal alien competition for jobs and resources.

Overall the construction industry has been hit hard by the use of illegal alien labor and decreasing wage scales. Not only the construction industry but other industries as well.

Just what is your stance on illegal immigration? Do you think that employers should be able to hire illegal labor in direct conflict with our laws? Do you have no sympathy for your fellow Americans who have lost their jobs in this manner or can't get a job? Do you believe in the rule of law and our right to enforce and limit immigration?
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Old 08-12-2011, 12:21 AM
 
Location: Houston, Texas
1,164 posts, read 1,276,707 times
Reputation: 387
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Of course it is different with states that don't have a high population of illegals. There is less competition from them for jobs. However, the way it is going there will be no states safe from illegal alien competition for jobs and resources.

Overall the construction industry has been hit hard by the use of illegal alien labor and decreasing wage scales. Not only the construction industry but other industries as well.

Just what is your stance on illegal immigration? Do you think that employers should be able to hire illegal labor in direct conflict with our laws? Do you have no sympathy for your fellow Americans who have lost their jobs in this manner or can't get a job? Do you believe in the rule of law and our right to enforce and limit immigration?
I think we should legalize the ones who have been here for years, but force them to pay a penalty like one of the congressmen have suggested. I do think we should reinforce border security as there is a limit to how many people can be in the country.
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Old 08-12-2011, 01:33 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
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Originally Posted by Canaan-84 View Post
I think we should legalize the ones who have been here for years, but force them to pay a penalty like one of the congressmen have suggested. I do think we should reinforce border security as there is a limit to how many people can be in the country.
How can you have the "undocumented" document how many years they've broke the laws of this country to be here? Do they claim they stole a social security number 10 years ago and so get to stay? Or can someone show up yesterday and just lie and say they really snuck over the border 20 years ago and so can stay?
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Old 08-12-2011, 06:50 AM
 
1,574 posts, read 788,760 times
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Originally Posted by Canaan-84 View Post
I do think we should reinforce border security as there is a limit to how many people can be in the country.
Really? What's the maximum?
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Old 08-12-2011, 07:22 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,144,640 times
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Originally Posted by Canaan-84 View Post
I think we should legalize the ones who have been here for years, but force them to pay a penalty like one of the congressmen have suggested. I do think we should reinforce border security as there is a limit to how many people can be in the country.
Why should we reward immigration lawbreakers even with a penalty just because they managed to dodge the law longer and probably have committed the felony of working with a fake or stolen I.D. and/or SS number? We don't need these people. We need to free up jobs and resources for Americans. The 1986 amnesty was a failure. This time we have at least quadruple the illegal aliens we had back then. As for securing the border, do you really believe that our government will do it this time around as was promised in 1986? I don't!

No, what we need to do is remove all incentives for them to remain here or to continue to come here and continue with workplace raids and our states should be allowed to implement laws like sb1070 to detect and detain illegal aliens for deportation.
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Old 08-12-2011, 07:38 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Why should we reward immigration lawbreakers even with a penalty just because they managed to dodge the law longer and probably have committed the felony of working with a fake or stolen I.D. and/or SS number? We don't need these people. We need to free up jobs and resources for Americans. The 1986 amnesty was a failure. This time we have at least quadruple the illegal aliens we had back then. As for securing the border, do you really believe that our government will do it this time around as was promised in 1986? I don't!

No, what we need to do is remove all incentives for them to remain here or to continue to come here and continue with workplace raids and our states should be allowed to implement laws like sb1070 to detect and detain illegal aliens for deportation.
Yes. Or as the federal government doesn't choose to enforce the laws or have any sort of border, just leave them the way they chose to come -- illegal.

That way if they get out of line, they can be easily deported, many planned to return home to their families at some point, there is no good reason at all to try to keep them from going back to that plan.
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Old 08-12-2011, 12:26 PM
 
Location: Houston, Texas
1,164 posts, read 1,276,707 times
Reputation: 387
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Why should we reward immigration lawbreakers even with a penalty just because they managed to dodge the law longer and probably have committed the felony of working with a fake or stolen I.D. and/or SS number? We don't need these people. We need to free up jobs and resources for Americans. The 1986 amnesty was a failure. This time we have at least quadruple the illegal aliens we had back then. As for securing the border, do you really believe that our government will do it this time around as was promised in 1986? I don't!

No, what we need to do is remove all incentives for them to remain here or to continue to come here and continue with workplace raids and our states should be allowed to implement laws like sb1070 to detect and detain illegal aliens for deportation.
I understand how you feel, but it would actually be more costly to try and deport all illegals (especially in our current economy). Some state police agencies have even protested these new sb1070 type laws because they lack funds to train and implement them in the departments.

Now making some of them legal would gain us new tax payers, no driving down wages as some people here claim and it would also allow them to be more productive in society. However, like the congressman suggested only those who have not committed crimes (excluding the fact they crossed the border) should be given amnesty and they should pay $500-$1,000 fines.
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Old 08-12-2011, 06:50 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,144,640 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canaan-84 View Post
I understand how you feel, but it would actually be more costly to try and deport all illegals (especially in our current economy). Some state police agencies have even protested these new sb1070 type laws because they lack funds to train and implement them in the departments.

Now making some of them legal would gain us new tax payers, no driving down wages as some people here claim and it would also allow them to be more productive in society. However, like the congressman suggested only those who have not committed crimes (excluding the fact they crossed the border) should be given amnesty and they should pay $500-$1,000 fines.
What part of voluntary deportations don't you get? As I said, remove all the incentives for them to remain here and most will self-deport. At any rate it is cheaper to deport them than to allow them to stay here even Homeland Security has said so. I have posted the link many times.

Giving the jobs back that they are holding to Americans would in turn make them tax payers instead of welfare or unemployment beneficiaries. We have millions of Americans out of work right now.

In case you don't know it using fake and stolen I.D.'s and SS numbers is a felony. Are these the ones you think we should reward with a mere slap on the wrist and a measly fine? Giving them amnesy in any form will just encourage more illegals to come here and we don't even need the ones that are here already.

The state of our economy is precisely why we should rid ourselves of these job and benefit stealing thieves.
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Old 08-12-2011, 08:13 PM
 
Location: Houston, Texas
1,164 posts, read 1,276,707 times
Reputation: 387
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
What part of voluntary deportations don't you get? As I said, remove all the incentives for them to remain here and most will self-deport. At any rate it is cheaper to deport them than to allow them to stay here even Homeland Security has said so. I have posted the link many times.

Giving the jobs back that they are holding to Americans would in turn make them tax payers instead of welfare or unemployment beneficiaries. We have millions of Americans out of work right now.

In case you don't know it using fake and stolen I.D.'s and SS numbers is a felony. Are these the ones you think we should reward with a mere slap on the wrist and a measly fine? Giving them amnesy in any form will just encourage more illegals to come here and we don't even need the ones that are here already.

The state of our economy is precisely why we should rid ourselves of these job and benefit stealing thieves.
Did you not read when I said those who have committed crimes would not be legalized. As for removing incentives it sounds like a good idea, but it's unlikely to happen in all states and we're losing more money in all these court cases that attempt to block them?
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