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Old 09-11-2011, 11:55 AM
 
3,493 posts, read 2,397,164 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Yes. But then she might have to compete with would-be immigrants from all kinds of countries, she might not be the best qualified.

The illegals don't want to go the legal route before coming because that involves fairness, people from other countries might have applied before them, might have finished school or have better job skills. They figure they can just come here as they please and then demand their US citizenship, do everything the easy way.


Worse. They think our immigration laws exist to provide them with economic opportunity and make their lives better. If making their lives better means that Americans face increased fiscal burdens and fractured communities they don't care.

Illegals are some of the world's most selfish people.
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Old 09-11-2011, 12:46 PM
 
403 posts, read 281,572 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Actually that whole "all men were created equal" had nothing to do with illegal aliens, it refers to something in the bible, that in God's eyes, all men are created equal. It never meant that the government was to make them all equal or force equality.

And it doesn't stop Mexicans and other illegals from using their own natural rights to change their own countries.

It was NEVER at any time about some unlimited illegal immigration policy. Never.
And what bible college did you attend?
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Old 09-11-2011, 12:48 PM
 
403 posts, read 281,572 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
This is fascinating stuff.
I love this forum.
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Old 09-11-2011, 01:12 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,310 posts, read 18,959,787 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
lol

as discussed hundreds of times, the "legal route" has basically zero to do with "qualifications" (unless you mean the rich white people that get instant approval) and everything to do with having legal relatives. There is no line effectively for the vast majority of people who want to immigrate. There is, of course, something sort of like an application process but the deck is completely stacked and there's not some constantly moving line where if you're just patient enough you'll eventually get your number called.

But "just get in line and wait your turn" does SOUND fair, I'll give you that. It's a great way to avoid the uncomfortable conversation.
Ok here we go again.
1. Do we not as a nation have a right to determine what our minimum standards are?
2. Show me a USCIS document that dictates disqualify anyone but rich whites.
3. Is there a waiting period for any and all applicants? This is a line.
4. There is most definetly a waiting period and a list where people await their turn for each step of the process before they can get their VISA to immigrate to this country. This is a line. Not a physical line granted but a line none the less.
5. Qualifications. Well if your broke and cant even afford the application fees this would indicate that you will become an imeadiate burden upon this country. Uneducated? That means chances are you will be a minimum wage earner. This means that you will receive much more than what you pay in. You will be a burden. I think we produce enough of those without importing more.
6. The fact that rich whites are a minority of immigrants doesnt seem to matter when we play the race card.
7. tell me again why we owe poor immigrants a VISA skin color is not relevent.
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Old 09-11-2011, 02:23 PM
 
3,204 posts, read 2,394,879 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
Ok here we go again.
1. Do we not as a nation have a right to determine what our minimum standards are?
2. Show me a USCIS document that dictates disqualify anyone but rich whites.
3. Is there a waiting period for any and all applicants? This is a line.
4. There is most definetly a waiting period and a list where people await their turn for each step of the process before they can get their VISA to immigrate to this country. This is a line. Not a physical line granted but a line none the less.
5. Qualifications. Well if your broke and cant even afford the application fees this would indicate that you will become an imeadiate burden upon this country. Uneducated? That means chances are you will be a minimum wage earner. This means that you will receive much more than what you pay in. You will be a burden. I think we produce enough of those without importing more.
6. The fact that rich whites are a minority of immigrants doesnt seem to matter when we play the race card.
7. tell me again why we owe poor immigrants a VISA skin color is not relevent.

Great post tinman, I'm sure no one will take on your questions.

It's interesting that the illegals find it unfair that they should have to stand in line and COMPETE with others that want to come here legally, yet they can come up with all sorts or reasons that imply that US citizens are bigoted/racist for feeling that a US citizen should not have to COMPETE with illegals for jobs.

They are angry that they have to compete to get INTO the country yet we shouldn't be angry when having to compete with them for jobs.

I wish someone could explain that to me.
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Old 09-11-2011, 02:55 PM
 
1,574 posts, read 793,060 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
Ok here we go again.
1. Do we not as a nation have a right to determine what our minimum standards are?
Nations don't have rights. Only people do. But regardless, whether people have a right to do something is a different question. My point is that there is no "line" for practical purposes. Whether there is an entitlement to a line or the right to not create one or whatever is a sideshow.

Quote:
2. Show me a USCIS document that dictates disqualify anyone but rich whites.
Again, it's not explicit. But the result of the policy is undeniable. if you're poor and brown and you don't have a relative to sponsor you, THERE IS NO LINE. Agree or disagree?

If you're David Beckham, there's no line either, you just go right through, no waiting.

Quote:
3. Is there a waiting period for any and all applicants? This is a line.
4. There is most definetly a waiting period and a list where people await their turn for each step of the process before they can get their VISA to immigrate to this country. This is a line. Not a physical line granted but a line none the less.
Yeah, it's a line in a sense, as I already addressed. In reality, though, there's no "waiting" - you know pretty much immediately if you're going to get in or not. If you get sent "to the line" that means you're never getting in.

Quote:
5. Qualifications. Well if your broke and cant even afford the application fees this would indicate that you will become an imeadiate burden upon this country. Uneducated? That means chances are you will be a minimum wage earner. This means that you will receive much more than what you pay in. You will be a burden. I think we produce enough of those without importing more.
Again, this doesn't really have anything to do with my point. The point is that the "get in line" argument is disingenuous. Saying "well we have standards" doesn't refute my point at all. In fact it pretty much confirms it.

Quote:
6. The fact that rich whites are a minority of immigrants doesnt seem to matter when we play the race card.
Wait, who played the race card? Go read my post you were responding to and show me where I mentioned race? (the two-edged sword might cut you)

Quote:
7. tell me again why we owe poor immigrants a VISA skin color is not relevent.
Again, who is or is not owed a visa is irrelevant to the point. And again, saying this doesn't refute my point but in fact reinforces it.
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Old 09-11-2011, 03:50 PM
 
15,924 posts, read 16,931,461 times
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Woman has 3 jobs to make ends meet, has 3 underage children and owns a business that employs 12 people.

Yeah right

The story has no facts, it's just a huge illegal alien sob story...

As others have said:

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Old 09-11-2011, 04:11 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,310 posts, read 18,959,787 times
Reputation: 6517
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
Nations don't have rights. Only people do. But regardless, whether people have a right to do something is a different question. My point is that there is no "line" for practical purposes. Whether there is an entitlement to a line or the right to not create one or whatever is a sideshow.



Again, it's not explicit. But the result of the policy is undeniable. if you're poor and brown and you don't have a relative to sponsor you, THERE IS NO LINE. Agree or disagree?

If you're David Beckham, there's no line either, you just go right through, no waiting.



Yeah, it's a line in a sense, as I already addressed. In reality, though, there's no "waiting" - you know pretty much immediately if you're going to get in or not. If you get sent "to the line" that means you're never getting in.



Again, this doesn't really have anything to do with my point. The point is that the "get in line" argument is disingenuous. Saying "well we have standards" doesn't refute my point at all. In fact it pretty much confirms it.



Wait, who played the race card? Go read my post you were responding to and show me where I mentioned race? (the two-edged sword might cut you)



Again, who is or is not owed a visa is irrelevant to the point. And again, saying this doesn't refute my point but in fact reinforces it.
Once again the race card was played when you said only rich whites.
How many professional athletes from the Dominican Republic play baseball?
You talked about rich whites. Your words and thats the race card.
nations do have rights. Recognized by the world body. A nation is composed of people and reflect its citizens. Its citizens have the right to determine that nations laws.
There are lines for everyone. Regardless of how certain an individual might be about their chances to get a VISA.
If your poor and brown or poor and white, poor and yellow is the point. It means you dont meet the minimum standards. And these standards are justified.
If you get sent to the line that means the system is working even tho its slow and redundant. Some nations enjoy ertain freedoms or advantages others dont. For Example japan, England, Germany nations that have an equiv. stand. of living. That means that thier citizens are less likely to violate our immigration policies and leave when they are supposed to. They have something worth going back too. They also can demonstrate the financial means to live here.
The point is every legal immigrant in this country regardless of type of VISA had to apply and wait for approval, and wait until all those who applied before them are approved.
We can cry no fair because some applicants have the means and the potential to meet our standards and others dont. That really isnt our problem its theirs.
Is it unfair that i want to eat at an upscale resturaunt but cant because I cant afford whats on the menu and dont have the clothes they require?
I dont think so.
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Old 09-11-2011, 04:21 PM
 
3,493 posts, read 2,397,164 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
Once again the race card was played when you said only rich whites.
How many professional athletes from the Dominican Republic play baseball?
You talked about rich whites. Your words and thats the race card.
nations do have rights. Recognized by the world body.
There are lines for everyone. Regardless of how certain an individual might be about their chances to get a VISA.
If your poor and brown or poor and white, poor and yellow is the point. It means you dont meet the minimum standards. And these standards are justified.
If you get sent to the line that means the system is working even tho its slow and redundant. Some nations enjoy ertain freedoms or advantages others dont. For Example japan, England, Germany nations that have an equiv. stand. of living. That means that thier citizens are less likely to violate our immigration policies and leave when they are supposed to. They have something worth going back too. They also can demonstrate the financial means to live here.
The point is every legal immigrant in this country regardless of type of VISA had to apply and wait for approval, and wait until all those who applied before them are approved.
We can cry no fair because some applicants have the means and the potential to meet our standards and others dont. That really isnt our problem its theirs.
Is it unfair that i want to eat at an upscale resturaunt but cant because I cant afford whats on the menu and dont have the clothes they require?
I dont think so.
It's also a ludicrously inaccurate race card.



Immigration to the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Quote:
The top twelve emigrant countries in 2006 were Mexico (173,753), People's Republic of China (87,345), Philippines (74,607), India (61,369), Cuba (45,614), Colombia (43,151), Dominican Republic (38,069), El Salvador (31,783), Vietnam (30,695), Jamaica (24,976), South Korea (24,386), Guatemala (24,146).
That's over 175,000 people allowed to immgrate legally from Mexico alone in a single year. I daresay many of them were both brown and poor. I would also venture to assert that many people from other countries on the list such as El Salvador and Guatemala are also poor and brown.



Enough already. Americans do not owe every single poor person the right to come here because their lives might be better economically. If you break our laws and come anyway you should be fined and shipped home.

Americans are not slaves. No one has any legal or moral right to ask us to work harder to support the economic desires of poor foreigners. It is disgusting that refusal to agree to that idiotic proposal is labeled mere racism.

I don't owe anyone a Manhattan apartment or a Harvard education. If you can't get either one it is neither my fault nor is it my problem. If you argue the "right" to pick my pocket so you can get such things I will do everything I can to shove your hands out of my purse.
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Old 09-11-2011, 04:27 PM
 
403 posts, read 281,572 times
Reputation: 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by plwhit View Post
Woman has 3 jobs to make ends meet, has 3 underage children and owns a business that employs 12 people.

Yeah right

The story has no facts, it's just a huge illegal alien sob story...

As others have said:
It said she works two part-time jobs outside of her business. How do you know those aren't facts?
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