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Old 09-05-2011, 08:21 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,168,220 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Roma View Post
Why do you continually bring U.S. citizens into an illegal immigration debate? Why do you keep talking about this fantasy where immigrants may agree not to use tax payer funded services?

These questions are rhetorical BTW........
Again, these pro-illegals won't address the fact that we do not have jobs for all the millions of illegals already here and the millions more that would like to come here. Instead they say "well what if we don't allow them any benefits". It isn't just about benefits but a shortage of jobs and resources. They totally ignore the uncontrolled population growth and the added demands on so many things that unlimited immigration would bring also.
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Old 09-05-2011, 08:23 AM
 
Location: Miami
888 posts, read 609,981 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Again, these pro-illegals won't address the fact that we do not have jobs for all the millions of illegals already here and the millions more that would like to come here. Instead they say "well what if we don't allow them any benefits". It isn't just about benefits but a shortage of jobs and resources. They totally ignore the uncontrolled population growth and the added demands on so many things that unlimited immigration would bring also.
Open the borders, then we can all move freely.
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Old 09-05-2011, 08:31 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,168,220 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TempesT68 View Post
LOL when the link is some ultra-right wing nutcase that says "Barry" in the fist paragraph, you can pretty much write it off as some kind of low intelligence idiot.

Otherwise this issue is from weeks ago and was easily debunked. Here's a few facts the the right wingers seem to have issues understanding:
Obama is one of the most anti-illegals presidents in the history of the nation.
Obama arrested and deported most illegals last year than any other president in US history.
Obama has been cracking down harder on business that hire illegals than anyone.
As for the link that person is referring to, Obama has been arresting at such high levels they can't deport them fast enough. In the mean time to address the issue, they are putting the criminals and other top scumbags at the top of the list to get deported first.
Except that Obama will never see that these 300,000 will get deported later and others without a a felony conviction will never get deported either. And what's with the work permits while millions of Americans are out of work?
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Old 09-05-2011, 08:52 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,168,220 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FiveplaysbyLorca View Post
Well Americans shouldn't be forced to pay taxes at all to the military or bailouts for banks, or for hand outs for companies.



Not wanting to spend money on X,Y, or Z isn't racist in and of itself it is the rational given behind such motives that belay a certain kind of racism or what I think is mostly a fear ( probably justified) of increased economic competition and with that uncertainty. And in some sense people are right. The CEO of Goldman Sachs can jet set to about any country he wants, pay off a few officials and settle down in his villa with his yacht, while the poor smhucks have to scrap and scrimp just to get by. So a certain fear of immigration could be somewhat expected from the working people as opposed to anyone who can just hop, skip, and jump to another country.

But if you pay attention you'll see that there are gross distortions in the reasons people give. People claim that illegal immigrants are only here to live off of welfare, get free education, eat your American pie take a dump in your lawn and then leave. Or that they are all blood thirsty criminals only seconds away from stealing America right from under their noses. There is a strange obsession with the English language that boarders on pure crazyness because it isn't backed up by aaannnyyttthinngg, and even after shown repeatedly stats, figures, anecdotes and on and on, its like the reset button gets hit and the same completely debunked and dog whistle things get played over again. This is racism.



You are right that racism has no borders. An Armenian can be as racist as anyone else regardless of whatever has happened in the past. In my experience many other cultures are far more racist and xenophobic than America though America does get a bad reputation because racism and xenophobia can be discussed so openly as opposed to other places. I think on its face illegals, legal aliens and citizens should pay for their education. The state isn't a baby sitter. But there is also a sense of social justice, that as a society people should look out for those less fortunate.



Again, maybe its not you, but it has been plenty implicate that people here do not assume the best in people. Gross mis characterizations are pretty obvious when people sneer at an illegal alien for saving a child from a child molester and claim that perhaps the whole thing was orchestrated for the benefit of all illegal aliens. People are called sympathizers as if WW3 was going on ( which this I fully expect various posters to claim that "it is war" or "it's an invasion" or other marmongering phrases which show 1) their abject fear present and 2) the propensity toward violent imagery for people who have very little intention of any violence). People are usually given the benefit of the doubt but continuous wildly disproportionate and hysterical threads lead to other conclusions.



This is the crux of the fallacy here. You think that "your" pie is fixed and other people are coming to take away your pie. In reality all you have are scraps and your trying to fend off even less fortunate people who only want scraps. The "pie" isn't fixed and there are others who have more money than you can think of and are sucking you dry, bleeding you from every pore far more than any illegal alien could ever dream of doing and they are perfectly legal citizens. So by all means fight over your welfare, its the only thing you have left to protect you. Don't worry though that will be gone sure enough, and it won't be a poor immigrant that takes it from you, but a guy in a suit.
All I can say is that your entire post is full of exaggerations and half or non-truths. Most Americans do not accuse "all" illegal aliens of the things you mentioned. You are stereotying now. This issue has nothing to do with racism either and we have a right to control our borders and set limits on immigration. Americans are fighting for the scraps that belong to them. Americans need the jobs that most illegals are holding. We need our taxes to help our own people, not illegal aliens.

Have a nice life.
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Old 09-05-2011, 09:06 AM
 
1,574 posts, read 791,268 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GimmeMts View Post
No, but you DO believe Americans should be forced to pay taxes in order to support an "oppressed" (which they are not) group of people. Spending my money on foreign nationals is not how I "see fit" for the government to spend that money. But when other people said the same thing in other threads, you accused them of racism.
"human rights" could not be further from the truth. Clearly, not very many cultures seem to share your twisted world view.
Interesting. I specifically set it up so Americans would not be supporting these people and you STILL dont want them here. Sorry, but your harping about how it's not racist to oppose something I didn't even ask you to support is not really convincing me of anything. Either you didn't read the question or your script you follow when answering these questions doesn't cover this question so you just copied the answer to some other question.
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Old 09-05-2011, 09:38 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,840,989 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
Interesting. I specifically set it up so Americans would not be supporting these people and you STILL dont want them here. Sorry, but your harping about how it's not racist to oppose something I didn't even ask you to support is not really convincing me of anything. Either you didn't read the question or your script you follow when answering these questions doesn't cover this question so you just copied the answer to some other question.
And why don't their own countries want them?
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Old 09-05-2011, 09:59 AM
 
Location: Massachusetts
10,032 posts, read 6,876,397 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
Interesting. I specifically set it up so Americans would not be supporting these people and you STILL dont want them here. Sorry, but your harping about how it's not racist to oppose something I didn't even ask you to support is not really convincing me of anything. Either you didn't read the question or your script you follow when answering these questions doesn't cover this question so you just copied the answer to some other question.

That's not interesting at all because it's an asinine fantasy that would never happen.
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Old 09-05-2011, 01:39 PM
 
3,204 posts, read 2,388,165 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MountainBiking View Post
As long as we continue having this two party system and voting for these imbeciles- Republican or Democrat- nothing is going to change. The pro illegal alien groups are getting stronger and stronger and are well represented. They organize protests and make their 'cause' heard. Where are the anti illegal alien groups at? Where are the protesters? Why aren't Americans outside the White House and letting our leaders know that American citizens are fed up with the illegals? Why are AMERICAN judges siding for the illegals? Why? Why? Why?

-Cheers.

It's notable that many states are trying to gain the right to enforce the Federal laws and are being sued by the Democrat administration.

Those republicans, and some democrats as well, are speaking up but being stifled.
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Old 09-05-2011, 01:51 PM
 
3,204 posts, read 2,388,165 times
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[quote=rhymetime;20746024]I don't think wanting to keep your money and dispose of it as you see fit is inherently racist.

When you start getting into "well also I don't want those people living near me so let's build a wall or use guns or something like that and keep them fenced in over there" well, people might start wondering.

Do you think of US citizens that get welfare are "economic parasites"?

Would you support legal immigration for anyone who paid for and passed a background/health check if they agreed to not use welfare?[/quote]


Many people don't want to live by criminals. That is why we have a list that shows us where pedophiles live. Are we racist because we chose not to live by pedophiles?

We pay taxes for police to keep us safe from lawbreakers.

Entering this country without proper documentation is illegal.

The bold is what is expected in our current immigration policy. What is your problem? We allow more immigrants than any other country on earth. If that's too tough, find another country to go to. Obviously you don't like the laws here.
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Old 09-05-2011, 01:58 PM
 
1,574 posts, read 791,268 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
And why don't their own countries want them?
Nice dodge. This doesn't have anything to do with the countries they are coming from.
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