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Old 09-05-2011, 07:49 PM
 
1,574 posts, read 261,451 times
Reputation: 124

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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
Nothing unskilled undereducated labor will significantly impact. But they will impact our reserves what little we have.
I never implied mexicans would turn us into a 3rd world country. In fact I didnt even say anything about mexicans. So yes words in my mouth.
Yes, I was responding to someone else, and you chimed in with your "but they were legal". Here, let's replay the whole exchange.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Shellsandwater View Post
I must believe if Obama gives work permits that will open another floodgate of illegals into our country. I'm afraid America will not survive...... Anyone in their right mind can see America going downhilll fast. It is totaly suicide & insanity. And yes I would like to be able to help everyone in the world who is poor BUT we just can't do it ! We can't do it & survive folks ...... we will be a 3rd world country..
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
Just like when we had all those poor irish moved to the US and turned it into a dump, just like the english said would happen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
The difference being that the Irish actually entered using the approved method or system. They had a right to be here. Illegals on the other hand do not have a right to be here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
Wait, so legal vs. illegal entry is the difference between "building a great nation" and "turning this place into a toilet"?

If that's actually the difference, then why would anyone OPPOSE legalization???
Now, you say "the difference" is that the irish were legal.

So what are you taking issue with, exactly? Show me the words I put in your mouth.

Would you care to re-phrase and put this entire controversy to rest? Or perhaps just keep being shifty so we can drag this out a few more posts.
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Old 09-05-2011, 07:58 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,291 posts, read 11,485,808 times
Reputation: 6426
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
Yes, I was responding to someone else, and you chimed in with your "but they were legal". Here, let's replay the whole exchange.










Now, you say "the difference" is that the irish were legal.

So what are you taking issue with, exactly? Show me the words I put in your mouth.

Would you care to re-phrase and put this entire controversy to rest? Or perhaps just keep being shifty so we can drag this out a few more posts.
SO you admit that I never said they would trash the nation or turn it into a 3rd world country. Good.
Then you insinuated that the illegals are nation builders. I ask again if they are such great builders why not build their own nation?
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Old 09-05-2011, 08:09 PM
 
1,574 posts, read 261,451 times
Reputation: 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
SO you admit that I never said they would trash the nation or turn it into a 3rd world country. Good.
I didn't say you did say that. But you did take issue with my response to someone who did say that.

It doesn't matter if you said X. My point doesn't depend on WHO said it. You stepped up and took issue with my discussion of X. You drug yourself into this discussion.
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Old 09-05-2011, 08:14 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,291 posts, read 11,485,808 times
Reputation: 6426
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
I didn't say you did say that. But you did take issue with my response to someone who did say that.

It doesn't matter if you said X. My point doesn't depend on WHO said it. You stepped up and took issue with my discussion of X. You drug yourself into this discussion.
Then kindly quote me or ignore the intrusion.
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Old 09-05-2011, 08:25 PM
 
1,574 posts, read 261,451 times
Reputation: 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
Then kindly quote me or ignore the intrusion.
Are you serious? I just replayed the whole sequence. I did quote you.

Someone says the US is going to be a third world country if we let more immigrants in.

I pointed out people said that in the past and it didn't happen.

You chime in and say yeah but it was different because those were legal.

Now, did you mean that legal status affects the country turning into a toilet or not?
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Old 09-05-2011, 09:06 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,291 posts, read 11,485,808 times
Reputation: 6426
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
Are you serious? I just replayed the whole sequence. I did quote you.

Someone says the US is going to be a third world country if we let more immigrants in.

I pointed out people said that in the past and it didn't happen.

You chime in and say yeah but it was different because those were legal.

Now, did you mean that legal status affects the country turning into a toilet or not?
No I meant that 1 can not compare legal immigrants to illegal immigrants. Its a completely different character of people.
I will say that by lowering our standards to allowing virtually unlimited immigration to unskilled uneducated immigrants we will be overwhelmed and not gain enough tax revenues to offset the cost of added social burdons. We cant afford the burden we currently have. We as a nation can afford to set our standards high and there is no need to accept less.
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Old 09-05-2011, 09:42 PM
 
1,574 posts, read 261,451 times
Reputation: 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
No I meant that 1 can not compare legal immigrants to illegal immigrants. Its a completely different character of people.
I will say that by lowering our standards to allowing virtually unlimited immigration to unskilled uneducated immigrants we will be overwhelmed and not gain enough tax revenues to offset the cost of added social burdons. We cant afford the burden we currently have. We as a nation can afford to set our standards high and there is no need to accept less.
Of course, back then we had (much) lower standards than we do now.
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Old 09-05-2011, 09:49 PM
 
841 posts, read 507,542 times
Reputation: 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhymetime View Post
Just like when we had all those poor irish moved to the US and turned it into a dump, just like the english said would happen.

Way back then conditions were as different as day and night. We did not have a welfare state then that citizens paid for, and we had way more space. Today there is less than 10,000 square miles of land left in the U.S. and that is not all useable.
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Old 09-05-2011, 10:13 PM
 
841 posts, read 507,542 times
Reputation: 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
How can lack of standards be a better answer?
The problem I have with your postion is that it relies completely on the hope that immigration would be self leveling. In other words as opprotunity lessoned so would the flow of immigration.
I dont believe this to be true.
I have been in other countries seen the long lines at our embassies of people wanting to come here. They still believe that we are the land of plenty. They will keep coming in spite of the reality. They will come in mass, and we wont be able to absorb them quickly enough. Our infra structure will be maxed out as will our social services. We wont be able to keep up let alone afford the strain. The potential revenues will come long after the burdon. The majority will be minmum wage earners so federal revenues will only be drained no gain.
This is the reality of opening immigration on such a large scale.

Pro illegals should read Tinman's entire post a few times. America is already maxed out financially, even our high taxes could not pay for all the benefits used by illegal aliens and legal foreigners.
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Old 09-05-2011, 10:22 PM
 
1,574 posts, read 261,451 times
Reputation: 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by clsicmovies View Post
Pro illegals should read Tinman's entire post a few times. America is already maxed out financially, even our high taxes could not pay for all the benefits used by illegal aliens and legal foreigners.
Yeah, the problem with this is that keeping immigrants out isn't going to fix that problem. Most economists agree immigrants are a net positive and even the most biased anti-immigrant hate groups out there think they only cost a tiny fraction of the overall deficit.

The economic argument is completely bogus.
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