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Old 10-09-2011, 06:14 AM
 
Location: Indianapolis
3,895 posts, read 4,382,926 times
Reputation: 957

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theliberalvoice View Post
Undocumented immigrant students will be eligible for California aid - CNN.com

Why not send AMERICAN STUDENTS to college? Give us more opportunities? Damn, no wonder California is going down.

Wtf? How do they plan on funding all the illegals?
I call it the Peoples Republic of Californiastan for a reason

Also you bet i'm pissed too its not so much the idea of california passing it as california has NO MONEY! and the other 49 states will have to bail them out like before.
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Old 10-09-2011, 06:17 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,146,155 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by A_Lexus View Post
These immigrants that so many scream about support those on the Left. They are Obama supporters, and they're going to help give him a second term too. Only the Left is willing to acknowledge that those who are less fortunate may require a bit more consideration to advance their educational aspirations. I'm all for any mechanism that helps as many underprivileged people as possible, get a higher education. The parents of these kids came here illegally, and these kids grew up here. For all intents and purposes, they are citizens, just undocumented. Those who worked hard in school and are qualified for college, should be helped.

For centuries, only whites were allowed to go to college. Glad to see the opportunity extended to those less privileged, those here because their parents came as immigrants seeking to realize the American dream we market so effectively around the globe, and those who have historically been discriminated against. If the GOP had its way, ONLY the most privileged would be able to go to college. They represent the ultimate regression, exclusion, divisiveness, and bigotry.

For you people on the Right, scream on. This society is moving AWAY from your ideal which is the preservation of the hierarachy that emerged from slavery and a continuation of the benefits of "unearned privilege." Good move by California!
They are "undocumented" citizens? Gee, what politician did we hear that crappola from?

You are just spouting nonsense about the GOP using uncalled for untruths and smears. You might want to learn some history on slavery and racism before you point your finger at the right. No, society our is not moving away from the rule of law and that is basically what this issue is about.
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Old 10-09-2011, 08:43 AM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 32,484,948 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
I hate to break it to you, but being domiciled within a State does not make one a Resident of said State, especially in California. University requirements for establishing residency are independent from those of other types of residency, such as for tax purposes, or other state or institutional residency. A resident for tuition purposes is someone who meets the requirements set forth in the University of California Board of Regents Policy Relating to Residence.Here is the State residency requirement for tax purposeshttp://www.ftb.ca.gov/forms/2010/10_1031.pdf Domicile Page 9

For Drivers License purposeDriver License and Identification (ID) Card Information How to apply for a driver license if you are over 18
The semantics game yet again?

******************

A resident is any individual who meets any of the following:
• Present in California for other than a temporary or transitory purpose.
• Domiciled in California, but outside California for a temporary or transitory purpose. . (See “Meaning of Domicile’’ on page 9).

******************
California Franchised Tax Board.

Paying taxes is always the ultimate judge of residency. The others are legal quirks.
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Old 10-09-2011, 08:45 AM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 32,484,948 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by KickAssArmyChick View Post
What part of they are here ILLEGALLY is it so hard for you to understand?

That is the bottom line.... ILLEGALLY, in violation of our Federal Laws.
Yup...well unlawfully for sure...but still may be best and brightest. We should attempt to keep such people. They make very valuable citizens. And they all speak english fluently and are generally well assimilated into American culture.
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Old 10-09-2011, 08:59 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,699,632 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theliberalvoice View Post
Undocumented immigrant students will be eligible for California aid - CNN.com

Why not send AMERICAN STUDENTS to college? Give us more opportunities? Damn, no wonder California is going down.

Wtf? How do they plan on funding all the illegals?
They will fund them, aka buy their votes, by denying all this aid for Americans. It's that simple. Americans will be turned away and the illegals pouring over the borders will be given a free ride.
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Old 10-09-2011, 09:07 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,699,632 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by plwhit View Post
Yes, I prefer American tax dollars to go towards Americans.

It's a pity is it not that the Mexican government doesn't care about it's own citizens instead leaving the standard of living poor in their own country so that the .001% of their population can live the good life.
Actually that's not true, these citizens of Mexico can attend one of their own country's universities and pay very low tuition. Americans however cannot expect the same from Mexicans as they expect from us. What's ours is theirs and what's theirs is theirs.

They now can expect to attend college free in the USA and at very low cost in their own country and American citizens are just plain out of luck.
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Old 10-09-2011, 09:11 AM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,711,425 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
The semantics game yet again? You don't get to place your own definition to the meaning of the words or phrases.

******************

A resident is any individual who meets any of the following:
• Present in California for other than a temporary or transitory purpose.
• Domiciled in California, but outside California for a temporary or transitory purpose. . (See “Meaning of Domicile’’ on page 9).

******************
California Franchised Tax Board.

Paying taxes is always the ultimate judge of residency. The others are legal quirks. NO it is not, The term “domicile” has a special legal definition that is not the same as residence....For instance, you may be domiciled in California but not be a California resident or you may be domiciled in another state but be a California resident for income tax purposes.
The UC system has its own criteria for determining residency of students (University requirements for establishing residency are independent from those of other types of residency, such as for tax purposes, or other state or institutional residency.), I merely used the FTA and the DL links to show that different CA agencies have different criteria. So, just because one may pay CA taxes doesn't mean one is a resident of said state according to the UC regents. I would suggest reading Standing Order 110.2. Language in Standing Order 110.2 delegates authority to the General Counsel of The Regents to establish regulations for determining residence status. The General Counsel has, in turn, authorized each campus to officially designate a member of the Registrar’s staff as a “Deputy” in Residence a Matters. The Residence Deputy (or similar title) at each campus is the only person who can make a determination regarding a student’s status for residence for tuition purposes and appeal of the Residence Deputy’s decision can only be made to the Office of the General Counsel. This is probably the best sentence from the link I provided: Courts that have faced challenges to residency classification procedures have consistently recognized the rights of University systems to charge higher rates to out-of-state students and to adopt criteria for determining the establishment of the in-state status.
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Old 10-09-2011, 09:14 AM
 
Location: Out in the Badlands
10,395 posts, read 8,346,895 times
Reputation: 7679
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theliberalvoice View Post
****, I will denounce my US citizenship and move to California so I can be an illegal there and live the good life. Free college, free health care, welfare, maybe even housing.

That is what they are teaching me! Where do I sign up?

ABBA California Here I come - YouTube
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Old 10-09-2011, 11:53 AM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 32,484,948 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
The UC system has its own criteria for determining residency of students (University requirements for establishing residency are independent from those of other types of residency, such as for tax purposes, or other state or institutional residency.), I merely used the FTA and the DL links to show that different CA agencies have different criteria. So, just because one may pay CA taxes doesn't mean one is a resident of said state according to the UC regents. I would suggest reading Standing Order 110.2. Language in Standing Order 110.2 delegates authority to the General Counsel of The Regents to establish regulations for determining residence status. The General Counsel has, in turn, authorized each campus to officially designate a member of the Registrar’s staff as a “Deputy” in Residence a Matters. The Residence Deputy (or similar title) at each campus is the only person who can make a determination regarding a student’s status for residence for tuition purposes and appeal of the Residence Deputy’s decision can only be made to the Office of the General Counsel. This is probably the best sentence from the link I provided: Courts that have faced challenges to residency classification procedures have consistently recognized the rights of University systems to charge higher rates to out-of-state students and to adopt criteria for determining the establishment of the in-state status.
Again you are simply playing sleight of hand games with the semantics.

As the FTB says residency is a matter of fact.

That various universities attempt to limit residency even when it is legally impossible is well known. My brother fought the University of Wisconsin on exactly that issue and won. They really were not willing to go to court and defend their absurd position...that a mid 20s veteran married with a child was not a Wisconsin resident though he lived and worked there. What they actually do is simply make the procedure to be declared a resident so long and complex as to drive off all but the most determined. I am quite sure CA plays a similar game. If I remember they even claim the right to have different residency requirements in UC versus the state colleges.

Domocile is yet another red herring. No real bearing on residency. Domicile is a pet of the FTB which uses it to keep those long gone from CA still paying state taxes. The only way to get rid of a CA domicile is to establish one somewhere else...and until you do CA still expects you to pay CA taxes.
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Old 10-09-2011, 12:27 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,711,425 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
Again you are simply playing sleight of hand games with the semantics.

As the FTB says residency is a matter of fact.

That various universities attempt to limit residency even when it is legally impossible is well known. My brother fought the University of Wisconsin on exactly that issue and won. They really were not willing to go to court and defend their absurd position...that a mid 20s veteran married with a child was not a Wisconsin resident though he lived and worked there. What they actually do is simply make the procedure to be declared a resident so long and complex as to drive off all but the most determined. I am quite sure CA plays a similar game. If I remember they even claim the right to have different residency requirements in UC versus the state colleges.

Domocile is yet another red herring. No real bearing on residency. Domicile is a pet of the FTB which uses it to keep those long gone from CA still paying state taxes. The only way to get rid of a CA domicile is to establish one somewhere else...and until you do CA still expects you to pay CA taxes.
Wisconsin is not California. I note you do realize they even claim the right to have different residency requirements in UC versus the state colleges. As I stated, residency requirements are different as per different CA agencies, all with their own criteria.

Now, only residents of the State of California can vote in CA local elections, illegal aliens are not allowed to vote in these elections, as per the California Constitution. Does this disqualify them from State Residency? You will note, it's not about semantics, nor is it sleight of hand. You are using only one agencies criteria and applying it across the board for your own arguments justification, so who really is using the sleight of hand? HINT: It's not me.
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