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Old 12-26-2011, 08:25 PM
 
387 posts, read 270,592 times
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Another interesting Pew poll.

Illegal Immigration: Gaps Between and Within Parties | Pew Research Center for the People and the Press

Basically the pluarlity prefers a path and enforcement.

Very much a political issue with vast differences between parties...and between the young and old.
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Old 12-26-2011, 09:24 PM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
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VERY contradictory. Rewarding criminal behavior only encourages more of it.

Handing people who have broken many laws to be here and work here easy citizenship will not help enforcement efforts whatsoever.

Even if one doesn't want to have a big round up, there is absolutely no good reason to reward the illegals with citizenship. They made the choice to be here illegally, so leave them illegal. Deny them employment, welfare handouts, social security, free health care and at least some of them would opt to return home.

Having them voluntarily return to their own country certainly has to be one of the best options.
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Old 12-26-2011, 09:32 PM
 
387 posts, read 270,592 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
VERY contradictory. Rewarding criminal behavior only encourages more of it.

Handing people who have broken many laws to be here and work here easy citizenship will not help enforcement efforts whatsoever.

Even if one doesn't want to have a big round up, there is absolutely no good reason to reward the illegals with citizenship. They made the choice to be here illegally, so leave them illegal. Deny them employment, welfare handouts, social security, free health care and at least some of them would opt to return home.

Having them voluntarily return to their own country certainly has to be one of the best options.
You have no solution. So you will defend the status quo which assuredly will make it worse. And then you will complain even more.

If they survived the last few years of the economic decline they are not in the least likely to deport over being unloved.

And citizenship is not now and has never been the issue. They want to be regularized and not under threat of deportation. Able to work openly.

It is quite clear you cannot deprive them of working or driving. You can prevent them from doing it legally. Thenyou can complain about them doing it illegally. But would it not make more sense to regularize them and get this thing under control?
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Old 12-26-2011, 09:40 PM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by libertylover7 View Post
You have no solution. So you will defend the status quo which assuredly will make it worse. And then you will complain even more.

If they survived the last few years of the economic decline they are not in the least likely to deport over being unloved.

And citizenship is not now and has never been the issue. They want to be regularized and not under threat of deportation. Able to work openly.

It is quite clear you cannot deprive them of working or driving. You can prevent them from doing it legally. Thenyou can complain about them doing it illegally. But would it not make more sense to regularize them and get this thing under control?
Another reason it's better to leave them illegal (which is the choice they themselves made) is that it makes them easier to deport.

The goal should be all about getting these people back to their own homeland. Making them citizens or legal residents doesn't do that. We don't need 30 million illegals here taking jobs from Americans. We don't need "dreamies" getting free college while Americans are denied college educations.

What you and many others forget - many of these illegals first intended to return home eventually. Many only planned to work here illegally a couple years or so and get back home.

Inertia sets in, they get too comfortable here, they grow to love our government handouts, the free health care they are given, the rewards like food stamps and WIC for having babies here that aren't given back home.

They will get used to being back home too when they go. Anyone can get used to a place after living in it for a couple years, but that doesn't mean they can't get used to being at home again.
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Old 12-26-2011, 09:43 PM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
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As for the driving -- many of these people never even rode in a car until after they snuck over to the USA. They don't have licenses to drive because they never had one.

Back home they rode buses, taxis, trains - no problem. They get here and realize how easy it is to break our laws, how lax we are at enforcement of laws and suddenly they feel the need to drive here illegally -- just like everything else they do.

They have no need at all to drive here. Just like most didn't drive when they were back home. Their fellow citizens never felt the need in passing out drivers licenses to anyone and everyone.
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Old 12-27-2011, 07:07 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,144,640 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Another reason it's better to leave them illegal (which is the choice they themselves made) is that it makes them easier to deport.

The goal should be all about getting these people back to their own homeland. Making them citizens or legal residents doesn't do that. We don't need 30 million illegals here taking jobs from Americans. We don't need "dreamies" getting free college while Americans are denied college educations.

What you and many others forget - many of these illegals first intended to return home eventually. Many only planned to work here illegally a couple years or so and get back home.

Inertia sets in, they get too comfortable here, they grow to love our government handouts, the free health care they are given, the rewards like food stamps and WIC for having babies here that aren't given back home.

They will get used to being back home too when they go. Anyone can get used to a place after living in it for a couple years, but that doesn't mean they can't get used to being at home again.
Quote: "You have no solution. So you will defend the status quo which assuredly will make it worse. And then you will complain even more".

Tell me malamute, are these not the exact same words of "olecapt" that was banned from this forum? Coincidence? I think not. It think that Yac is smart enough to figure it out also.

Note how many times that it has been pointed out that another reason not to legalize them is because we need the jobs they are holding and you never get an answer on that one? I wonder why that is?
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Old 12-27-2011, 07:50 AM
 
1,333 posts, read 814,891 times
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I've often asked the question...and never gotten a straight answer from the 'path to citizenship' crowd.....WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE ONES HERE NOW ARE GRANTRED CITIZENSHIP...AND 10 YEARS FROM NOW WE HAVE ANOTHER 10 MILLION ILLEGALS??

The government has no plan to stop illegals from coming here. None. So....what then?? Do we just keep rewarding people who break our laws every 10 years or so with a 'path to citizenship'??

NO!! that ISN'T the smart thing to do. If you are on a boat in the middle of the ocean...and it springs a leak...the FIRST thing you do is figure out a way to STOP THE LEAK...not promote everyone onboard to captain!!

This is another way in which the G** Damned stupid liberals in charge are systematically DESTROYING this country.
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Old 12-27-2011, 08:20 AM
 
Location: San Diego
32,798 posts, read 30,025,534 times
Reputation: 17687
Quote:
Originally Posted by libertylover7 View Post
You have no solution. So you will defend the status quo which assuredly will make it worse. And then you will complain even more.

If they survived the last few years of the economic decline they are not in the least likely to deport over being unloved.

And citizenship is not now and has never been the issue. They want to be regularized and not under threat of deportation. Able to work openly.

It is quite clear you cannot deprive them of working or driving. You can prevent them from doing it legally. Thenyou can complain about them doing it illegally. But would it not make more sense to regularize them and get this thing under control?
No, what is quite clear is that sooner or later these people will get caught up in some type of action that will get them deported. Be it driving, while working illegally or whatever. The constant is that it will happen. They can live in fear until then.

It's also quite "clear" that any form of amnesty brings a ten fold increase in more illegals.

You can continue to complain that illegals will NEVER be made legal and that they can be deported at any second.
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Old 12-27-2011, 08:42 AM
 
3,493 posts, read 2,385,153 times
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We tried amnesty in 1986. As others have repeatedly pointed out, all it did was make the problem worse. We now have even more illegals who simply presume that we'll hand them American citizenship eventually. Why would we try it again? Alabama's policies are working. We should do the same nationally. As others have pointed out we hardly need even more people here, particularly low skilled people in the middle of a bad recession.

No amnesty. Enforce our laws, stop the handouts for their kids and get Mexico's government to cooperate with us. That'll work.
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Old 12-27-2011, 10:29 AM
 
1,487 posts, read 1,989,171 times
Reputation: 934
This is simply a form of amnesty that has been tried by other nations and it has failed. As soon as people see that they try harder to illegally cross borders.
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