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Old 02-02-2012, 11:14 AM
 
3,951 posts, read 3,583,774 times
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People seem to be stuck in the present about illegal immigration while the rest of us are able to see far-and-wide about where this is all headed. The ones that think, "Ah, they aren't hurting anybody" obviously don't know the truth about having illegal immigrants here or they are too stuck-in-the-moment to see where we will be years from now.

That's why I don't understand why people think our opposition is about race. No, it's not about race, it's about not wanting to live in a ran-down, broke-ass country. It doesn't matter who comes in and puts stress on our way-of-life, we just are trying to keep this place prosperous and contrary to want our respectable President Obama wants to think, all illegal immigrants aren't going to become doctors, lawyers and hard-working professionals.
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Old 02-02-2012, 11:17 AM
 
Location: Lower east side of Toronto
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Country is real estate. Nation signifys family - extended and adopted members....If a person has ties and is loyal to the community - then they are adopted into the national family. In the alternative..if the new comer is a cut throat opportunist and does not love the national family- well - you can get out and find another bit of real estate to exploit.
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Old 02-02-2012, 11:59 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oleg Bach View Post
Country is real estate. Nation signifys family - extended and adopted members....If a person has ties and is loyal to the community - then they are adopted into the national family. In the alternative..if the new comer is a cut throat opportunist and does not love the national family- well - you can get out and find another bit of real estate to exploit.
Aren't there rules governing real estate? Don't you have to get a real estate license before you start selling? Don't you have to eventually register your land and home once you buy?

All of that should be true within your analogy. Also, do you believe in open-borders? Because that's how it sounds. The countryis not open to anyone who wants to just walk through, or at least that was not the intention.

Also, what about the illegal immigrants that are only here to use the United States and have allegiance to their native country? I'm not into generalizing people or acting like I've met every single person that falls under a group, but I grew up working with illegal immigrants and going to school with them in high school (I grew up in a city that is one of those places that illegal immigrants set up shop in) and really got to know different cultures through that. Basically, today and back then there was this idea that the United States was just a place to get-by in, a place to escape to because there was no work in their home/native country. Their allegiance and loyalty seemed to remain in the country that they were from.

This attitude is very visible and obvious by the lack of interest in speaking the language that is common in this country
or obtaining an ability to. The largest group of people that are illegal immigrants seem to cling to the culture from their native country and the "communities" that they deal with and socialize with are full of relatives or people from their native country. Basically, you speak of this loyaly to the U.S. and communities, but there doesn't seem to be much of that compared to the opposite.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:05 PM
 
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If the US House cut off all federal funding going to sanctuary cities this would stop in a heartbeat, IMO. YMMV
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Old 02-06-2012, 06:08 PM
 
14 posts, read 6,034 times
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Originally Posted by SoEdible View Post
Aren't there rules governing real estate? Don't you have to get a real estate license before you start selling? Don't you have to eventually register your land and home once you buy?

All of that should be true within your analogy. Also, do you believe in open-borders? Because that's how it sounds. The countryis not open to anyone who wants to just walk through, or at least that was not the intention.

Also, what about the illegal immigrants that are only here to use the United States and have allegiance to their native country? I'm not into generalizing people or acting like I've met every single person that falls under a group, but I grew up working with illegal immigrants and going to school with them in high school (I grew up in a city that is one of those places that illegal immigrants set up shop in) and really got to know different cultures through that. Basically, today and back then there was this idea that the United States was just a place to get-by in, a place to escape to because there was no work in their home/native country. Their allegiance and loyalty seemed to remain in the country that they were from.

This attitude is very visible and obvious by the lack of interest in speaking the language that is common in this country
or obtaining an ability to. The largest group of people that are illegal immigrants seem to cling to the culture from their native country and the "communities" that they deal with and socialize with are full of relatives or people from their native country. Basically, you speak of this loyaly to the U.S. and communities, but there doesn't seem to be much of that compared to the opposite.
Virtually all the children speak English fluently.
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Old 02-06-2012, 06:33 PM
 
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Originally Posted by succinct2 View Post
Virtually all the children speak English fluently.
Then I guess there is no need for ESL classes, right? What about the parents? There is much evidence that many do not learn English nor do they want to.
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Old 02-06-2012, 07:53 PM
 
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Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Then I guess there is no need for ESL classes, right? What about the parents? There is much evidence that many do not learn English nor do they want to.
Having spent 15 years trying to learn to speak Spanish I would suggest it can be difficult. I can read it well, and write it passably...but I can't hear it or speak it well.

I have always though ESL an idea suited only for a poor set of kids caught in the middle. Well capable in Spanish and older than 9 or 10 with no English. Those into the system earlier need no ESL.
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Old 02-06-2012, 08:21 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,152,437 times
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Originally Posted by succinct2 View Post
Having spent 15 years trying to learn to speak Spanish I would suggest it can be difficult. I can read it well, and write it passably...but I can't hear it or speak it well.

I have always though ESL an idea suited only for a poor set of kids caught in the middle. Well capable in Spanish and older than 9 or 10 with no English. Those into the system earlier need no ESL.
Well tell that to the advocates for illegal aliens that tell us we are too lazy to learn Spanish. The difference is this is our country and our language is English. It isn't up to Americans to learn Spanish but for "immigrants" to learn our language.
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Old 02-06-2012, 08:37 PM
 
14 posts, read 6,034 times
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Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Well tell that to the advocates for illegal aliens that tell us we are too lazy to learn Spanish. The difference is this is our country and our language is English. It isn't up to Americans to learn Spanish but for "immigrants" to learn our language.
Which advocates are those? I would love to learn Spanish. The only other language I ever felt the urge to learn and there are practical reasons why it would be helpful. But my older neurons appear incapable.

And I also agree that the immigrants must learn English. But the children are soon enough. My childrens great grandparents on one side spent 50 years in the USofA and never learned English. But their children sure did. And the next generation lost the old language.
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Old 02-06-2012, 08:43 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,152,437 times
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Originally Posted by succinct2 View Post
Which advocates are those? I would love to learn Spanish. The only other language I ever felt the urge to learn and there are practical reasons why it would be helpful. But my older neurons appear incapable.

And I also agree that the immigrants must learn English. But the children are soon enough. My childrens great grandparents on one side spent 50 years in the USofA and never learned English. But their children sure did. And the next generation lost the old language.
The trend doesn't seem to be the same today. Today, "immigrants" and all descending generations never seem to make English their primary language of usage.
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