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Old 02-22-2012, 12:26 PM
 
3,493 posts, read 2,392,785 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tluv00 View Post
Came from somewhere else yes. But theories (only thing to go on since the numbers range from them being here 12-20,000 years ago) where that there was either no one here or they didn't know because it was basically 100% wilderness back then.

Thoughts are that they crossed over from Siberia after the Ice Age. It's all theories though as opposed to taught in our schools in order to make sure our kids know how the white man came and took land.
I have news for you: the white man was not the only person who "took land." Most American Indian tribes fought constantly over land rights. All was not Shangri La in the Americas until the EVIL WHITE MAN arrived.

That still has nothing to do with modern day boundaries. You have no more right to come here without permission than you do to break into someone's house and set up camp. If you believe otherwise unlock your own door and let someone else come here to take back your own stolen land.

 
Old 02-22-2012, 12:33 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,957 posts, read 30,201,927 times
Reputation: 17764
Quote:
Originally Posted by tluv00 View Post
Came from somewhere else yes. But theories (only thing to go on since the numbers range from them being here 12-20,000 years ago) where that there was either no one here or they didn't know because it was basically 100% wilderness back then.

Thoughts are that they crossed over from Siberia after the Ice Age. It's all theories though as opposed to taught in our schools in order to make sure our kids know how the white man came and took land.
Vs the red man of the time that conquered other tribes, took their women, horses and food? Boundaries were implied but there were still boundaries.
 
Old 02-22-2012, 12:37 PM
 
16,553 posts, read 11,095,630 times
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Considering there would have had to have been a law to break to make something illegal. What was the law that was broken and what country's law was it?
 
Old 02-22-2012, 12:37 PM
 
3,493 posts, read 2,392,785 times
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By the OP's reasoning the US was founded by slave owners. Therefore Americans had no right to object to slavery.
 
Old 02-22-2012, 12:37 PM
 
3,951 posts, read 3,594,028 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tluv00 View Post
Illegal Immigrants. Ask the Native Americans. You are all hypocrites and are the descendants of illegal immigrants. Of course back then they where called Pioneers and Explorers but it's the same difference.
This is just another talking point that people who want to make illegal immigration OK try to use.

I am sympathetic with Native Americans, know what Native Americans went through and specifically how many of them were basically shoved off the land that they inhabited.

However, I really don't understand the way people act like every single European, African or Asian that sailed here stole land from a Native American. There was tons of land in the USA that wasn't even inhabited by Native Americans or anyone for that matter and some explorers or settlers started their families there. What do people such as yourself have to say about this? We can't pretend that every square mile of the land was inhabited by Natives. It was a free-for-all for everyone at that time.

I just feel that people aren't really educated about U.S. history when they say things like you did. I wonder if they really know what went on in the present United States.

Also, there were no laws in regards to immigration during the most of the settlement days. Today there are laws and people are expected to obey them or suffer the punishment. So, just because you feel Europeans stole the land from Natives doesn't mean they should be exempt from the law. Also, the Europeans (Spainards) did the same thing to Native Americans in Mexico and now the products of that time are trying to come to the U.S. So, they are reaping rewards of the things you say were unfair and bad to do, but you are supporting them in reaping those rewards.
 
Old 02-22-2012, 12:42 PM
 
Location: Too far from home.
8,743 posts, read 5,572,318 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tluv00 View Post
Illegal Immigrants. Ask the Native Americans. You are all hypocrites and are the descendants of illegal immigrants. Of course back then they where called Pioneers and Explorers but it's the same difference.
So what you are saying is that in reality illegal immigrants today are pioneers and explorers.

There was no such thing as "illegal" or "legal" immigrants until:

Quote:
The contemporary period of required passports for Americans under United States law began on November 29, 1941.
United States passport - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Old 02-22-2012, 12:48 PM
 
5,527 posts, read 8,793,743 times
Reputation: 1860
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eleanora1 View Post
Nonsense. It's accurate description of the lives of the ancestors of most Americans today. Most Americans today are descended from LEGAL immigrants.

The OP states that the US is was founded by illegal immigrants. That's not even remotely true. The founding of the nation was not largely based on the pilgrims. It was based on the Revolutionary War. Most of the signers of the Declaration of Independence and those who fought in the Revolutionary War were natives. In fact, given the heavy Hessian soldier contingent on the side of the Redcoats you could easily argue that most people who fought against the founding of the US were illegals.

Every contemporary nation has borders. Illegals have no right to ignore them, let alone to imply that Americans who want our borders enforced are nothing more than ignorant hypocrites.
Okay so I used "founded" incorrectly. My bad.
 
Old 02-22-2012, 12:49 PM
 
5,527 posts, read 8,793,743 times
Reputation: 1860
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eleanora1 View Post
By the OP's reasoning the US was founded by slave owners. Therefore Americans had no right to object to slavery.
American's have rights to object to anything. That's what makes America great. Your spin makes no sense.
 
Old 02-22-2012, 12:53 PM
 
5,527 posts, read 8,793,743 times
Reputation: 1860
Quote:
Originally Posted by SourD View Post
Considering there would have had to have been a law to break to make something illegal. What was the law that was broken and what country's law was it?
They were Christians right? Isn't there a commandment that says something about not killing people or stealing or something like that? Not really into fiction but I heard that somewhere.

As for breaking the law you are right no law was broken so killing people and stealing land was okay. Screw Native Americans. Sorry for the post.
 
Old 02-22-2012, 01:05 PM
 
16,553 posts, read 11,095,630 times
Reputation: 4227
Quote:
Originally Posted by tluv00 View Post
They were Christians right? Isn't there a commandment that says something about not killing people or stealing or something like that? Not really into fiction but I heard that somewhere.

As for breaking the law you are right no law was broken so killing people and stealing land was okay. Screw Native Americans. Sorry for the post.
Native Americans were killing and stealing land from each other at the time as well.
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