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Old 03-25-2012, 09:11 AM
 
Location: North America
14,212 posts, read 9,616,814 times
Reputation: 5534

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
Education - they don't pay enough in local taxes to cover their costs.
Health care - unless they use a clinic where they pay for service, they usually skip out on the hospital charges for the emergency room use or they, in some states, get state aid for birth and fail to pay the remaining balance.
Jobs - there is only one industry that Citizens don't want and that is AG, every other occupation would be filled with citizens in mere moments. Tyson foods is a good example, this has been proven time and time again.

Instead of using rhetoric and calling BS, why not define your arguments vs leaving them so broadly brushed and easily refuted? Second thought, no matter how well you define them they will be easily refuted.
Oh really so thats why crab picking house in my state have to rely on guest workers to do their jobs, and most resort towns need to do the same because of the lack of college workers wanting to do the jobs their parents did? As for local taxes that's pretty much BS, since local municipalities usually rely solely on property taxes, and sales tax both of which they do pay. Not to mention a goodly portion pay federal taxes which might offset any gaps you mentioned. As for healthcare we can't say, but what i can say is that my sister is a doctor, and when she volunteers her time to the local clinic a good majority of the patients are hispanic. Which contrasts when she has to go to the hospital for her patients and the emergency room is mostly filled with white and black faces .
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Old 03-25-2012, 09:15 AM
 
20,611 posts, read 12,286,582 times
Reputation: 5895
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucidkitty View Post
They don't get either of the first 2 things which you would know if you actually read, and stopped getting your data from right wing sites. The 3rd has been proven BS time and time again when illegals are forced to leave areas with low paying manuel labor jobs, and owners of businesses in the areas can't ship in documented workers then they have a hard time filling said jobs. Contrary to popular fiction from the right side of world the jobs these people fill americans do not want.
Can you PROVE it that Americans WON'T do those jobs that ILLEGAL aliens do? Please remember less than 1 job in 10 done by illegal aliens is in farm work. Many of those illegals do construction which Americans WILL do. Just that an employer CAN'T cheat an American like he can an illegal alien.
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Old 03-25-2012, 09:17 AM
 
Location: North America
14,212 posts, read 9,616,814 times
Reputation: 5534
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
You're absolutely correct and it has been pointed out in here a gazillion times there are unlimited visas for AG workers. Every other job Americans have always been willing to do for a fair wage and humane working conditions. The left never gets tired of repeating the same old rhetoric, though do they? "They are only doing jobs Americans won't do". Blah, blah, blah ad nauseum.
And yet the left has given you proof time and time again of industries on multiple fronts that need to rely on illegal or guest workers due to the lack of americans willing to work for them . I can tell you from experience working in ocean city which is a resort town, that the amount of americans vs foreign guest workers is pretty low. And most of the americans working there are older ones that started there in college, and just never left. However college kids are pretty much a non entity, which is funny because this used to be a haven for college kids to work in the summer in years past.
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Old 03-25-2012, 09:21 AM
 
Location: North America
14,212 posts, read 9,616,814 times
Reputation: 5534
Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
Can you PROVE it that Americans WON'T do those jobs that ILLEGAL aliens do? Please remember less than 1 job in 10 done by illegal aliens is in farm work. Many of those illegals do construction which Americans WILL do. Just that an employer CAN'T cheat an American like he can an illegal alien.
Well when industries have to rely on guest worker programs to do their job that pretty much tells you that americans are not willing to do the jobs now isn't it? Because guest worker programs are federally mandated they are more regulated and force to pay correct wages. When you have to pay the same wages and need to look outside the country to get the employees then what does that tell you?
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Old 03-25-2012, 09:25 AM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,712,131 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucidkitty View Post
Oh really so thats why crab picking house in my state have to rely on guest workers to do their jobs, and most resort towns need to do the same because of the lack of college workers wanting to do the jobs their parents did? As for local taxes that's pretty much BS, since local municipalities usually rely solely on property taxes, and sales tax both of which they do pay. Not to mention a goodly portion pay federal taxes which might offset any gaps you mentioned. As for healthcare we can't say, but what i can say is that my sister is a doctor, and when she volunteers her time to the local clinic a good majority of the patients are hispanic. Which contrasts when she has to go to the hospital for her patients and the emergency room is mostly filled with white and black faces .
Your "crab picking link" stated this: The picking houses have had a hard time finding locals willing to do the difficult, low-paying work. I would also tribute this to the push for education over the last couple decades, to include inflation for which wages haven''t kept up. Local taxes and BS , I agree they do pay property tax ans sales tax, however, they do not pay enough in those taxes to cover their local costs, it has been proven and shown in every report out their to include your Progress far left ones. A "goodly portion" pay federal taxes? I think you mean they have federal withholdings taken out of paychecks, for which once they file their tax forms they actually receive back much more than they had with held, thus nullifying your claim. Undocumented workers got billions from IRS in tax credits, audit finds - The Federal Eye - The Washington Post
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Old 03-25-2012, 09:31 AM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,712,131 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucidkitty View Post
And yet the left has given you proof time and time again of industries on multiple fronts that need to rely on illegal or guest workers due to the lack of americans willing to work for them . I can tell you from experience working in ocean city which is a resort town, that the amount of americans vs foreign guest workers is pretty low. And most of the americans working there are older ones that started there in college, and just never left. However college kids are pretty much a non entity, which is funny because this used to be a haven for college kids to work in the summer in years past.
So you can only come up with arguments in which you use legal and illegal workers? Nobody in here is against legal workers, if the business needs legal workers they can apply for them and attain them. Your "crab link" showed that. For a business, its kinda hard to distinguish work authorized documents that must be accepted. So how can a business readily identify an illegal worker in the scenario you have described, especially if that worker is receiving a paycheck and paying federal taxes?
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Old 03-25-2012, 09:35 AM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,712,131 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucidkitty View Post
Well when industries have to rely on guest worker programs to do their job that pretty much tells you that americans are not willing to do the jobs now isn't it? Because guest worker programs are federally mandated they are more regulated and force to pay correct wages. When you have to pay the same wages and need to look outside the country to get the employees then what does that tell you?
What are "correct wages"? Minimum wage is a "correct wage". Your argument leaves much to be desired, how about being much more refined.
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Old 03-25-2012, 09:36 AM
 
20,611 posts, read 12,286,582 times
Reputation: 5895
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucidkitty View Post
Well when industries have to rely on guest worker programs to do their job that pretty much tells you that americans are not willing to do the jobs now isn't it? Because guest worker programs are federally mandated they are more regulated and force to pay correct wages. When you have to pay the same wages and need to look outside the country to get the employees then what does that tell you?
Please post some links to back up what your saying. Otherwise I don't believe your opinions.
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Old 03-25-2012, 09:43 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,152,437 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
Please post some links to back up what your saying. Otherwise I don't believe your opinions.
Besides we don't have a problem with guest workers where it is proven they are needed. This forum however is about illegal immigration. Don't ya just love the switch and bait these people do?
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Old 03-25-2012, 09:47 AM
 
Location: North America
14,212 posts, read 9,616,814 times
Reputation: 5534
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
Your "crab picking link" stated this: The picking houses have had a hard time finding locals willing to do the difficult, low-paying work. I would also tribute this to the push for education over the last couple decades, to include inflation for which wages haven''t kept up. Local taxes and BS , I agree they do pay property tax ans sales tax, however, they do not pay enough in those taxes to cover their local costs, it has been proven and shown in every report out their to include your Progress far left ones. A "goodly portion" pay federal taxes? I think you mean they have federal withholdings taken out of paychecks, for which once they file their tax forms they actually receive back much more than they had with held, thus nullifying your claim. Undocumented workers got billions from IRS in tax credits, audit finds - The Federal Eye - The Washington Post
The eastern shore of maryland is pretty blue collared and backwards. Its like the deep south, not much different now then it was 60 years ago. If you subtract the revenue from ocean city you pretty much have a backwards country area. I don't get the point you are making there since the argument i am making is there are jobs americans don't want to fill. So thank you for pretty much affirming what i just told you . As for the tax credits, that can pretty much be applied to most americans, since the majority end up paying no taxes. But the bigger issue there is HOW many even file their tax returns? And i'm sorry that doesn't nullify any claims because it simply states they received back a little over 4 million dollars in credits, and doesn't say it's more then withheld. Lastly why don't you offer some proof that they don't pay enough in local taxes to cover their costs ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
What are "correct wages"? Minimum wage is a "correct wage". Your argument leaves much to be desired, how about being much more refined.
Yes guest workers are paid at least min wage which was the point i was making.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Besides we don't have a problem with guest workers where it is proven they are needed. This forum however is about illegal immigration. Don't ya just love the switch and bait these people do?
You are missing the point here :roll eyes:.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Funny, in my neck of the woods it is mostly Hispanic faces I see in the ER. I am sure that is true of most of the southwest and many of them are here illegally and getting this service free on the backs of the American taxpayer.
I doubt it

Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
Please post some links to back up what your saying. Otherwise I don't believe your opinions.
I have given links, you just have not read them was all. Funny though i see most of you spewing off opinions and only one so far has engaged me on an intellectual level and given a link .

Last edited by Yac; 03-26-2012 at 05:28 AM.. Reason: 5 posts in a row merged
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