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Old 04-04-2012, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,305 posts, read 1,758,702 times
Reputation: 578
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
...All Christians believe in the ten commandments and follow them. They also expect other Christians to do the same.
But there are untold numbers of "Christians" that have not followed specific commandments within just that group of ten. Arguably, there might not be very many adult Christians that have not violated at least one of the Ten Commandments, in many cases it is going to be more than just one. Earlier I also referred to the difference in interpretations (i.e. "Thou shall not KILL" vs. "Thou shall not MURDER").

I have broken many of the Ten Commandments, whom wants to cast that first stone?...

And I realistically expect other "Christians" to be as weak and human as I am...

 
Old 04-04-2012, 12:42 PM
 
9,122 posts, read 3,371,623 times
Reputation: 2117
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
But there are untold numbers of "Christians" that have not followed specific commandments within just that group of ten. Arguably, there might not be very many adult Christians that have not violated at least one of the Ten Commandments, in many cases it is going to be more than just one. Earlier I also referred to the difference in interpretations (i.e. "Thou shall not KILL" vs. "Thou shall not MURDER").

I have broken many of the Ten Commandments, whom wants to cast that first stone?...

And I realistically expect other "Christians" to be as weak and human as I am...
The commandments are there for a reason.

Your stance has been to promote law breaking.
 
Old 04-04-2012, 12:51 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,305 posts, read 1,758,702 times
Reputation: 578
Quote:
Originally Posted by All American NYC View Post
The commandments are there for a reason.

Your stance has been to promote law breaking.
You're going to need to be more specific than that...

Upon review, within the doctrine of the Catholic Church, I have broken all of the Ten Commandments...

What is going to be really interesting is when other "Christians" will tell me that the Salvation of Christ won't save me for having done that...
 
Old 04-04-2012, 01:15 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 5,922,214 times
Reputation: 2118
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
But there are untold numbers of "Christians" that have not followed specific commandments within just that group of ten. Arguably, there might not be very many adult Christians that have not violated at least one of the Ten Commandments, in many cases it is going to be more than just one. Earlier I also referred to the difference in interpretations (i.e. "Thou shall not KILL" vs. "Thou shall not MURDER").

I have broken many of the Ten Commandments, whom wants to cast that first stone?...

And I realistically expect other "Christians" to be as weak and human as I am...
The point is that the Ten Commandments are there to follow as a guide to conduct our behavior. Most Christians do not willingly break them. Of course we are all human and subject to temptation but as long as we repent when we break them, ask forgiveness and try not to break them again, I believe that we are forgiven. It is when someone continually breaks one or more over and over that I don't consider them to be a true Christian then.

As for killing vs murder, I believe that one has a right to self-defense. Pre-meditated murder is an entirely different thing.
 
Old 04-04-2012, 02:36 PM
 
9,122 posts, read 3,371,623 times
Reputation: 2117
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
You're going to need to be more specific than that...

Upon review, within the doctrine of the Catholic Church, I have broken all of the Ten Commandments...

What is going to be really interesting is when other "Christians" will tell me that the Salvation of Christ won't save me for having done that...
The point is to live by those guides. Not to purposely break them.
 
Old 04-04-2012, 02:45 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,305 posts, read 1,758,702 times
Reputation: 578
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
The point is that the Ten Commandments are there to follow as a guide to conduct our behavior. Most Christians do not willingly break them. Of course we are all human and subject to temptation but as long as we repent when we break them, ask forgiveness and try not to break them again, I believe that we are forgiven. It is when someone continually breaks one or more over and over that I don't consider them to be a true Christian then...
I've known for you longer than most, that I would not want what you see as your own moral code projected upon others. Your phrasing even differs from the doctrine I follow. And you have the judgement to call someone different for what they believe because of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
...As for killing vs murder, I believe that one has a right to self-defense. Pre-meditated murder is an entirely different thing.
You're actually thinking too narrowly in this instance already...
 
Old 04-04-2012, 03:05 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,305 posts, read 1,758,702 times
Reputation: 578
Quote:
Originally Posted by All American NYC View Post
The point is to live by those guides. Not to purposely break them.
At no point did I say that I "purposely" set out to break any of the Ten Commandments, like they were a list to be checked off...

Yet they all were broken, sometimes with my best intentions...

If you call yourself a "Christian", tell me how the Grace of Christ will not save me despite that...

As I said before, this is going to be a long, and likely off-topic, discussion...
 
Old 04-04-2012, 03:17 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 5,922,214 times
Reputation: 2118
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
I've known for you longer than most, that I would not want what you see as your own moral code projected upon others. Your phrasing even differs from the doctrine I follow. And you have the judgement to call someone different for what they believe because of it.



You're actually thinking too narrowly in this instance already...
If one isn't living by the moral code of the ten commandments then they can't be a Christian. As I said, we are still human and do break those commandments from time to time but the important thing is to adhere to them as much as possible and repent when we don't. Going against any of the ten commandments on a daily basis in thought or action is not being a true Christian.

I hardly think that killing someone in self-defense and outright pre-meditated or a rage induced murder is the same thing. The margin of intent is wide, not narrow. Now I am done with this off topic discussion. It's gone on far too long now.
 
Old 04-04-2012, 03:48 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,305 posts, read 1,758,702 times
Reputation: 578
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
If one isn't living by the moral code of the ten commandments then they can't be a Christian...
To which I reject wholeheartedly...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
...As I said, we are still human and do break those commandments from time to time but the important thing is to adhere to them as much as possible and repent when we don't...
In particular to the Ten Commandments (and the divisions thereof), whom do we repent to?...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
...Going against any of the ten commandments on a daily basis in thought or action is not being a true Christian...
Whereas I say the very notion of being tempted to go against them on a daily basis is a crucial part in Christianity and other religions...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
...I hardly think that killing someone in self-defense and outright pre-meditated or a rage induced murder is the same thing. The margin of intent is wide, not narrow. Now I am done with this off topic discussion. It's gone on far too long now.
Still too narrow. In itself, just this could be a lifetime of debate. But you've finally brought up a point at the end I can agree with.
 
Old 04-04-2012, 04:49 PM
 
Location: San Diego
17,076 posts, read 12,954,402 times
Reputation: 6009
Maybe the Methodist Church would be better off using the proper term of Illegal Alien to clear up any confusion.
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