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Old 09-26-2007, 12:12 PM
Status: "Make America the Great Joke Again" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Denver
9,059 posts, read 15,467,286 times
Reputation: 5288

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Quote:
Originally Posted by skatealoneskatetogether View Post
Race or culture, I think its a bit of both.
On the Race side:
There are things that we as Americans value:
An honest days work
Abiding by the law
Having an education

Go to virtually any mexican community in any major city in the usa and you will find these communites lacking-for a better word- these types of values

Than you have culture:
The playing of mariachi music at all hours, regardless of how close your neighbors are
Drinking and driving
Promoting masculine/machismo culture ie: physical contfrontation is the only way to solve problems


you see where im going here
I think that sounds like a lot of cultures, especially impoverished ones, even in poor white neighborhoods in the country have you ever been to the real country? West Virginia, South Carolina, Georgia? You can see white people behaving exactly like that, not all of them but that is the point.

Here is an example of Guyanese immigrants in NYC drawing complaints from neighbors on the New York forum:
Guyanese immigrants in New York

Matter of fact in Florida you will hear the same comments being made about Puerto Ricans.

The direction I see you going in, is that you have only been around Mexicans and you are probably from Southern California, but if you went to NYC or Boston or Miami you will see these same characteristics of any poor area and they won't be mexicans.

So please save your pointless attempts of stereotyping the mexican poor, as the same can be applied to any race, color or creed.

Last edited by Mach50; 09-26-2007 at 12:29 PM..
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Old 09-26-2007, 12:18 PM
Status: "Make America the Great Joke Again" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Denver
9,059 posts, read 15,467,286 times
Reputation: 5288
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arizona Annie View Post
An apology to Mach50Thunderdart ~
I would just like to publicly apologize to you for coming at you personally in an earlier post on this thread. I shouldn't have attacked you. I was just so frustrated by what I felt you were doing from thread to thread. It was not my place to call you out like that and I am sorry I did it. It was especially inappropriate because as I said myself, you were being remarkably reserved on this thread. Yac (moderator) asked me how it was benefitting the discusion (my post) and I realized it would do quite the opposite. (some times a good shake can do that) Anyway, I am sorry. You and I will probably never agree on some points, but on others we do. Have a great day Mach!
It is no problem. I think I have been pretty reserved on all of these threads . Maybe my conviction has been mistaken for anger.
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Old 09-26-2007, 12:46 PM
 
547 posts, read 1,044,546 times
Reputation: 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by skatealoneskatetogether View Post
Race or culture, I think its a bit of both.
On the Race side:
There are things that we as Americans value:
An honest days work
Abiding by the law
Having an education

Go to virtually any mexican community in any major city in the usa and you will find these communites lacking-for a better word- these types of values

Than you have culture:
The playing of mariachi music at all hours, regardless of how close your neighbors are
Drinking and driving
Promoting masculine/machismo culture ie: physical contfrontation is the only way to solve problems


you see where im going here
I do see where you are going with that, but I disagree.

My community is heavily Hispanic and although we do have more crime than I would like, it's comparable to other cities of our size with a smaller Hispanic footprint. The Hispanic people are very hard working and MOST take shame in having to ask for a handout, but with every culture there are those who take advantage. What you have listed as culture I have seen quite a few examples of since I have lived in Arizona, but I don't happen to believe it is their culture anymore than it is ours. I have had neighbors with loud stereos blasting other kinds of music as well, who were not Hispanic. You'll never convince me that only Hispanics drink and drive, look at all the DUI's we have in this every state.

We definitely have a huge problem with illegal aliens in our country who have no interest in becoming citizens or learning our language, take advantage of our social services and "free" education, send most of their money back to their country and whose loyalty remains there rather than the U.S.A. I believe we desperately have to do something about it because we cannot afford the numbers streaming in, but please lets not blame all our ills on one race or culture. By focusing on the Mexican race/culture you alienate all Mexicans and really do them a disservice. Many legal immigrants who came from Mexico are just as upset as we are about the illegal's. They deserve to be here as much as any of us. I'm proud to count many among my dearest friends.

Last edited by Arizona Annie; 09-26-2007 at 12:56 PM..
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Old 09-26-2007, 01:01 PM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,797 posts, read 6,119,545 times
Reputation: 5171
Quote:
Originally Posted by skatealoneskatetogether View Post
Race or culture, I think its a bit of both.
On the Race side:
There are things that we as Americans value:
An honest days work
Abiding by the law
Having an education

Go to virtually any mexican community in any major city in the usa and you will find these communites lacking-for a better word- these types of values

Than you have culture:
The playing of mariachi music at all hours, regardless of how close your neighbors are
Drinking and driving
Promoting masculine/machismo culture ie: physical contfrontation is the only way to solve problems


you see where im going here
Wrong, culture is fundamental beliefs. What is acceptable behavior and what is not. Here are some examples of what used to be accepted norms of American culture. How have things changed today?
A man is only worth as much as his word. It is shameful to accept charity. Personal responsibility. Pride and ownership in your neighborhood,state, and country. Alegance to the United States. Respect for the law. Respect for your neighbors rights. Playing by the rules. Do unto others. These were examples of things people actually believed and lived their lives by. It is what made the U.S. more civilized and a better place to live than other countries. 50 years ago people did not tag their neighbors house or wall because the cultural belief was that it was wrong to do something like that. Unrestained immigration has deluded our cultural beliefs and lowered the bar for society as a whole.
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Old 09-26-2007, 05:48 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach50Thunderdart View Post
It is no problem. I think I have been pretty reserved on all of these threads . Maybe my conviction has been mistaken for anger.
Unfortunately; I have to agree.

Being that you toned down your rhetoric a touch: consider yourself detrolled in my eyes.

If I come across as rough; usually that is not my intention------I tend to call it as I see it, rightly or wrongly.
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Old 09-26-2007, 06:00 PM
 
547 posts, read 1,044,546 times
Reputation: 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Unfortunately; I have to agree.

Being that you toned down your rhetoric a touch: consider yourself detrolled in my eyes.

If I come across as rough; usually that is not my intention------I tend to call it as I see it, rightly or wrongly.
I like that. detrolled. Perfect. I agree Mach, you have been acting awfully un-troll-like the last couple of days. Keep it up, I find myself so much more receptive to what you say this way. Plus, hopefully I am getting my points across just a little bit better by not getting all emotional.
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Old 09-27-2007, 08:52 AM
 
537 posts, read 312,010 times
Reputation: 182
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm We shall see how long it lasts. I hope it does though.
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Old 09-27-2007, 10:39 AM
 
Location: new mexico
447 posts, read 705,921 times
Reputation: 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
I respectfully disagree:

The tipping point against illegal immigration may have occurred April 2006 with those idiotic demonstrations--------how stupid can the so-called 'Hispanic' leadership be? IMHO: they may have unwittingly sold out the rank and file Latinos-----legal as well as illegal.

agree....i just feel that only voting will help...i have written letters and called, but nothing....
so voting may well be the only answer.
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Old 09-27-2007, 11:05 AM
 
Location: new mexico
447 posts, read 705,921 times
Reputation: 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cribster View Post
Tell that to La Raza who's goal is the latinization of America. It's not fiction, it's happening now. Maywood, CA is 96% Hispanic and I'll bet my bottom dollar, if we last another 1000 years, Maywood will never be a welcome place for non-hispanics. Once they take hold there is no turnig back. Diversity to the exclusion of all else is DIVISION!

There's a town in Texas, can't remember the name off-hand who has made Spanish the official language. The tri-state area in Washington is 57% Hispanic, the invasion is taking hold far from the sounthern border.

Why can't I protect my culture, Norman Rockwell's Americana that I love and grew up in?

Where is the diversity in transforming my country into something that mirrors everything south of the border?

Mexico has waged war on the United States in the form of 30,000,000 disenfranchised citizens.

The level of hypocrisy coming from Mexico is hard to believe.


YouTube - Felipe Calderon and Mexico's Hypocrisy in National Security

i'm very proud to be an american, have been doing research on my family tree, both mothers and fathers, and also my husbands parents...it's great reading, and very interesting stuff...now, as for the idea of people who oppose illegal immigration being racists, i cannot speak for all, but i for one am not...as i feel you are not, just wanted to say thanks for the post, i agree with what you say.
i really don't think being opposed to illegal immigration is the same thing as being racist....and cannot understand the folks that think it is.
maybe if an illegal immigrant touched their lives in a violent way such as what happened to our family they may change their minds...
in our case, my husband was sereverly injured by an illegal immigrant drunk driver, who pled guilty to get his get out of jail free card, went on the run for nine years and then after two more years we finally found out he'd been captured ... even though we'd requested on a continual basis to attend his sentencing if he was ever captured, and informed the albuquerque nm district attorneys office of our adress and phone numbers, we were denied the federal and state victims of violent crimes act rights, were never informed of the mans capture, extradiction, or sentencing, we were denied the right to give victims statements at his sentencing, and what did the drunk illegal get? a three year sentence, two years and one day suspended for good behavior, and time already served waiting for the justice sytem to do their job...and one year of supervised probation, and one year of unsupervised probation...and restitution that was never paid to us....
he was proved to be here illegally, yet was never deported...so anyone living in california, beware...roberto flores garcia is free to do it again....hope you aren't in his path.
i'd also like to add this, so mr flores garcia was from mexico, doesn't matter to me, he couldve been from asia or germany or iraq,and i'd still feel the same about illegal immigration.
regards to all.
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Old 09-27-2007, 11:13 AM
 
Location: new mexico
447 posts, read 705,921 times
Reputation: 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach50Thunderdart View Post
Article IV, Section 4 of the U.S. Constitution


"The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence."

When California and Arizona were both confronted with the above US Constitution, they both replied "We are not being invaded by a hostile power".

I welcome the Mexicans and personally beleive it helps the economy:
felixsalmon.com: — Illegal immigrants are good for the US economy
california and arizona may not feel that the illegal immigrants are a hostile power, but i , as the wife of a man who was almost killed by an illegal immigrant drunk driver do.
you can welcome them if you want, it's your right...but i do not have to... and when anyone steps foot into this country illegally, then in my eyes they are a threat to this nations national security...lets not ever forget about the illegals who flew planes into the world trade centers, the pentagon and that pennsylvania field.....
this is not about just illegals from mexico...this is about all illegal immigrants....and not all of them are here for good reasons...
it's time we all wake up and realize this...
hope you never have to go through what our family has gone through due to the careless actions and disregard of an illegal immigrant.
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