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Old 06-26-2012, 08:45 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,149,569 times
Reputation: 2130

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
Can't arrest them, so whats the point?

And here is the major challenge for the law. The first time an American citizen of Hispanic descent is pulled over in their beat up truck, and detained because they left their wallet at home, this whole house of cards is going to fall. All in the name of civil rights.

I'm for restricting law enforcement in any way possible, so I hope this law sticks. There is no money for extra enforcement, so it takes more attention away from other things that I think should be legal.
If the Hispanic citizen is driving without his license he is breaking the law. There will be no defense of that nor could it be called racial profiling so no, the whole house of cards would not fall. How is being ticketed for driving without a license a civil rights issue?

You want restriction of law enforcement and yet you hope this law sticks? You meant the sb1070 law or Obama's dictatorship unwritten law?

There would be no need for extra LE with sb1070. The only thing changed is that under a routine stop for a traffic violation for example LE would have the ability to ask for status if the driver can't provide a valid ID. How is this taking their attention away from other crimes? You're grasping at straws here.
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Old 06-26-2012, 08:49 AM
 
16,438 posts, read 18,516,574 times
Reputation: 9490
Quote:
Originally Posted by Little-Acorn View Post
With that now in place, will we keep seeing the continued flood of illegal aliens crossing the border into the United States?
They'll tend to avoid Arizona now. There's still lot's of states open to invasion.
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Old 06-26-2012, 09:05 AM
 
Location: San Diego, CA
10,584 posts, read 7,967,483 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plwhit View Post
^^^ If you can't speak a word of English it's pretty sure one is an illegal alien....
My wife is from another country, got her green card long before she met me. Her English is good, though she has an accent. She is now a legal naturalized American citizen. We have petitioned over her mother, sister, and sister's daughter, and they are all here now, perfectly legally. They all have green cards from the U.S. government. And none of the three speaks a word of English.

They all carry their green cards witth them at all times - I have pointed out to them that Federal law requires them to do so. But if one of them leaves it at home, and runs into a cop, they have a problem. They can call my wife, and she or I can bring them their green card, and all will be well.

But the cop is justified in suspecting one of them might be an illegal if they find them with no green card, speaking no English. He would be wrong... but he would be justified. If he can find someone who speaks their language, then he can get the full story quickly, with names, addresses, and contacts to verify.

I don't see a problem with any of this.
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Old 06-26-2012, 09:20 AM
 
9,243 posts, read 7,099,270 times
Reputation: 2199
Everyone should be verified they are legally here.
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Old 06-26-2012, 09:20 AM
 
Location: San Diego
32,799 posts, read 30,044,409 times
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This whole thing is a big ticket item on the local news here and the Pro-Illegal crowd is NOT happy. Let's just put it that way.
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Old 06-26-2012, 09:29 AM
 
Location: Miami / Florida / U.S.A.
684 posts, read 1,255,004 times
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I was a supporter of the mulattoe until he approved the amnesty to all illegals under the age of 30.

Where is his patriotism? Chavez used the same strategy in communist venezuela, he legalised 8 million illegal colombian aliens in order to gain votes.

Obamas amnesty is going to hurt more the usa than bushs wars combined. What a liar, how did congress aprove this amnesty?
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Old 06-26-2012, 09:47 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,149,569 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edu983 View Post
I was a supporter of the mulattoe until he approved the amnesty to all illegals under the age of 30.

Where is his patriotism? Chavez used the same strategy in communist venezuela, he legalised 8 million illegal colombian aliens in order to gain votes.

Obamas amnesty is going to hurt more the usa than bushs wars combined. What a liar, how did congress aprove this amnesty?
Congress didn't approve this amnesty. Obama bypassed them.
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Old 06-26-2012, 10:14 AM
 
Location: San Diego
32,799 posts, read 30,044,409 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Congress didn't approve this amnesty. Obama bypassed them.
Yes he did, this and plenty of other times recently.
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Old 06-26-2012, 10:43 AM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,011,547 times
Reputation: 601
Quote:
Originally Posted by All American NYC View Post
Everyone should be verified they are legally here.
And exactly how do you implement such an idea? A naturalized citizen may not carry specific proof (and is not required, nor to state their citizenship on demand) of that status, but might have an accent or physical features that mark themselves as being foreign-born. We've even gone to the lengths of getting state-issued ID for my stepson (he is a big kid) so that it would be known he wasn't over the age of 18 (at which point he is required to carry his Resident Card). That ID shows his identity, not his immigration status.

For interior Federal immigration enforcement, most commonly the Border Patrol, that "verification" is merely a verbal statement of citizenship. That is, the Border Patrol asks "Are you [or Is everyone in the vehicle] a U.S. citizen?". As a citizen, you are not even required to provide a response (it is a violation if you lie, but you can remain quiet or otherwise not answer the question).

An exercise for the reader is to go through their wallet or purse. Find ID that proves your nationality or citizenship, that someone without U.S. nationality cannot have, or is marked differently from yours for their status. I am only able to produce a New Mexico Voter's ID, but it is on cardstock, without a picture, and probably could be easily fabricated.

Now that you have proven (in most states) that you are at least a Legal Permanent Resident, where is your Resident Card? Not carrying one does not prove you are a U.S. citizen. Are you satisfied that the Federal enforcement level may commonly allow just a verbal statement (if any), and you want local police to be able to go beyond that boundary?

Or are you just relying on the fact that the police will interpret your mannerisms and appearance to mean that they think you are an American? Implemented truthfully, the Arizona police could arrest just about everyone for further immigration status checks at the station. After all, Joe Arpaio would be hypocritical to direct his officers not to do the same level to prove U.S. citizenship as he has done for President Obama.
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Old 06-26-2012, 10:59 AM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,149,569 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
And exactly how do you implement such an idea? A naturalized citizen may not carry specific proof (and is not required, nor to state their citizenship on demand) of that status, but might have an accent or physical features that mark themselves as being foreign-born. We've even gone to the lengths of getting state-issued ID for my stepson (he is a big kid) so that it would be known he wasn't over the age of 18 (at which point he is required to carry his Resident Card). That ID shows his identity, not his immigration status.

For interior Federal immigration enforcement, most commonly the Border Patrol, that "verification" is merely a verbal statement of citizenship. That is, the Border Patrol asks "Are you [or Is everyone in the vehicle] a U.S. citizen?". As a citizen, you are not even required to provide a response (it is a violation if you lie, but you can remain quiet or otherwise not answer the question).

An exercise for the reader is to go through their wallet or purse. Find ID that proves your nationality or citizenship, that someone without U.S. nationality cannot have, or is marked differently from yours for their status. I am only able to produce a New Mexico Voter's ID, but it is on cardstock, without a picture, and probably could be easily fabricated.

Now that you have proven (in most states) that you are at least a Legal Permanent Resident, where is your Resident Card? Not carrying one does not prove you are a U.S. citizen. Are you satisfied that the Federal enforcement level may commonly allow just a verbal statement (if any), and you want local police to be able to go beyond that boundary?

Or are you just relying on the fact that the police will interpret your mannerisms and appearance to mean that they think you are an American? Implemented truthfully, the Arizona police could arrest just about everyone for further immigration status checks at the station. After all, Joe Arpaio would be hypocritical to direct his officers not to do the same level to prove U.S. citizenship as he has done for President Obama.
No person on entering our country or being here already should get away with just stating they are a citizen or legally here, under lawful contact. They should have to provide proof of that. IMO a DL nor state issued ID should only be given to citizens and those lawfully in our country. If one can't be provided to LE under lawful contact then their status should be investigated. It should have nothing to do with how they look or how they speek. That is exactly how the upheld provision of sb1070 is meant to work. It is merely your biased opinion that Arpaio isn't operating within the law.
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